Why I'm Voting Democrat

[Juddog]

Originally posted by: CallMeJoe

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: CallMeJoe

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: Craig234
Question: what's the sort of idiotic propaganda that keeps weak links from voting democratic in their own best interest? Answer above.

Voting Democrat is only in your best interests if you want to personally witness the works of Karl Marx, Stalin, Mao, and Castro.

Hyperbole, thy name is Jaskalas.

Not at all. All those monsters actually really do live under his bed. You could put him on Hawaii 10,000 years ago and he would still see their faces in coconuts.

The monster of a government abusing its people also lived under the beds of the men who wrote our Constitution. It was explicitly crafted to protect us from everything you want to foster.

Thanks for the history lesson, Jaskalas! Until today, I had no idea Marxism predated the Constitution!

:thumbsup: A++ will read again.

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Pale Rider
1. I'm voting Republican because I believe the government will do a better job of spending the money my children earn than I would.

2. I'm voting Republican because freedom of speech is fine as long as Rush Limbaugh or Sarah Palin is not offended by it.

3. I'm voting Republican because if we never get out of Iraq and Afghanistan in 100 years, America FUCK YEAH! Even when our troops are committed there and Russia attacks us.

4. I'm voting Republican because I believe that people who can't tell us if it will rain on Friday CAN tell us that we should blow all our paychecks on 10 mpg SUVs.

5. I'm voting Republican because I think women should be subservient to men in all things.

6. I'm voting Republican because I believe that a business should not be allowed to make a profit for themselves unless they are a mega-corporation getting a fat government bailout with a golden parachute for the CEOs who fscked it all up.

7. I'm voting Republican because I believe three or four pointy headed elitists need to rewrite the Constitution every few days to suit some fringe kooks who would never get their agendas past the voters, like waterboarding at Guantanamo, revoking habeas corpus, or crushing free speech.

8. I'm voting Republican because I believe it when the government tells me it can protect me from terrorists.

9. I'm voting Republican because I'm infatuated with what goes on in my neighbors' bedrooms.

10. I'm voting Republican because I believe oil companies and oil-producing foreign nations should rule us as our masters forever.

11. I'm voting Republican because I believe government should raise everyone else's children according to my (and only mine) own personal belief system.

12. I'm voting Republican because I don't believe in religious freedom, except when it's my religion.

13. I'm voting Republican because I believe that the Constitution is something that changes according to partisan talking points.

14. I'm voting Republican because I believe church tithes should be collected as part of the federal income tax.

15. I'm voting Republican because I don't trust my poorly-raised whore daughter to not get an abortion without coming to me first.

Fixed

Haha, seconded.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: daveymark

Originally posted by: CSMR

Originally posted by: Craig234Yes, obviously anything in the constitution regarding transportation is limited to horses and buggies; anything about arms, to flintlocks; free speech doesn't include tv or internet, etc.

The "living document" theory goes much beyond that as you should know. It doesn't just mean we should find how the document applies to new situations. It means the words are flexible in the hands of the judges, even concerning the same situations that existed in the past.

:thumbsup:

craig was that a purposeful misdirection, or did you honestly not know?

No, it was not a misdirection, purposeful or otherwise.

I think you missed the point of it, so I'll clarify.

My post was not saying 'that's the whole issue of the constitution as a living document'.

My post was addressing the right-wing claims that it's NOT a living document (contradicting the founding fathers) by pointing out some of the most obvious ways that it needs to be.

The reason for doing that is that once you establish that, then you are in the realm you should bein, which is discussing the specifics of the interpretation of it *given that there are clearly things that are a 'living document*, and youhave shut down the idiotic, and wrong, Manichean position of the right wing where they self righteously apply their absolutist claims it's not a living document at all to attack any interpretation they don't like, and they avoid and refuse to discuss the specifics of the interpretation at hand.

For example, take the Griswold decision. That is a very thoughtful, and in my view correct, recognition of the 'penumbra' of a right in the US constitution - the very sort of thing that the right wing objects to not by looking at the spirit of the constitution as the founding fathers wrote it, but with their argument that 'it's not a living document', which *they use selectively*.

So my point was to show that they are wrong in their absolutist claim, in order to force them to say well, yes, those examples are a 'living document', to they have to actually debate the other issues' merit too and stop the dishonest claim that any modernization at all is not right.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: iFX
1. I'm voting Democrat because I believe the government will do
a better job of spending the money I earn than I would.



2. I'm voting Democrat because freedom of speech is fine as
long as no Democrat is offended by it.



3. I'm voting Democrat because if we pull out of Iraq and
Afghanistan immediately, I trust that the bad guys will stop what they're
doing because they now think we're good people.



4. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that people who can't
tell us if it will rain on Friday CAN tell us that the polar ice caps will
melt away in ten years if I don't start driving a Prius.



5. I'm voting Democrat because I'm not concerned about the
slaughter of 45 million babies so long as we keep all death row inmates
alive.



6. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that a business should
not be allowed to make a profit for themselves. They need to break even and
give the rest away to the government for redistribution as they see fit.



7. I'm voting Democrat because I believe three or four pointy
headed elitists need to rewrite the Constitution every few days to suit some
fringe kooks who would never get their agendas past the voters.



8. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that when the
terrorists don't have to hide from us over there any longer, and they come
over here, I don't want to have any guns in the house to fight them off
with.



9. I'm voting Democrat because I love the fact that I can now
marry whoever I want. I've decided to marry my horse.



10. I'm voting Democrat because I believe oil companies'
profits of 8% on a gallon of gas are obscene but the government taxing the
same gallon of gas 15% isn't.



11. I'm voting Democrat because I believe government is wiser
than I am, regarding the raising of my children.



12. I'm voting Democrat because I believe in religious freedom,
as long as we're not talking about Christianity.



13. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that the Constitution
is a 'living document' that changes with our society.



14. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that 'separation of
church and state' is in the Constitution.



15. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that the government
has the right to allow my daughter to have an abortion without my knowledge,
even though I have to give MY permission for her to get her ears pierced.

After reading that I can feel the IQ points slipping away. When I lose forty or fifty points, will I see the genius of your post?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: CSMR

Originally posted by: Craig234Yes, obviously anything in the constitution regarding transportation is limited to horses and buggies; anything about arms, to flintlocks; free speech doesn't include tv or internet, etc.

The "living document" theory goes much beyond that as you should know. It doesn't just mean we should find how the document applies to new situations. It means the words are flexible in the hands of the judges, even concerning the same situations that existed in the past.

So, you mean things like that the same situation that existed regarding blacks and whites just over a century ago, when Plessy v. Ferguson was decided that said "separate but equal" was a perfectly fine policy the constitution allowed, was wrong to change position on about 56 years later by the Earl Warren Court who said 'on second thought, separate but equal is inherently unequal, and NOT allowed under the cosntitution'?

The subject of the constituion as a 'living document', as it is, is far more complicated than the knuckle draggers who try to just say 'no it's not'. I fully understand and agree with the concern that you also can't simply make the constitution meaningless by saying you can say it means anything you like, so tomorrow the right to bear arms meas the things with hands and fingers on them and not guns, but it also does not mean, as I explained in my other post that free speech rights only include printed materials like when it was written.

My point is that there is a middle area which is complicated. We didn't do too badly when we had good people on the court working through those issues; Warren was able to get a unanimous decision for reversing the Plessydecision. But oday, we have these radical Federalist Society people on the court who are not reasonable, who use the constitution in just that 'flexible' way for pollitical agendas even while decrying doing so the most.

My point is for there to be a real discussion of the interpretatin, not to avoid the discussion by pretending 'it's not a living document'.

 

[her209]

I could have sworn Spec007 created this thread.

EDIT: It was Pale Rider, not Spec007.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: CSMR

Originally posted by: Craig234
Question: what's the sort of idiotic propaganda that keeps weak links from voting democratic in their own best interest? Answer above.

Some of the points are misguided but some are good, particularly 5,6,11,13,15.

Just for you:

5. I'm voting Democrat because I'm not concerned about the
slaughter of 45 million babies so long as we keep all death row inmates
alive.

This is basically just saying that if you are anti-abortion rights, then you disagree with democrats, but it says it very poorly - as if when the death penalty is allowed, then abortion will be ok as well. And by the way, hello, we DO have the death penalty now in ths country (one of the few left with it), and many leading democrats, I think Barama included, support it. So, the way it's written, it's BS.

6. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that a business should
not be allowed to make a profit for themselves. They need to break even and
give the rest away to the government for redistribution as they see fit.

You think the claim that democrats oppose profitable business is a 'good point? I'm sorry, you have a head injury.

And of course the point it's hiding is that the radical right denies practically that there is any common obligation at all.

Fact:

If you look at the modern US economy from 1948 to 2007, under Republicans the avergage economic growth is 1.64%; under democrats it's 2.78%.

That's a fact that the lie of the Republican myth tries to deny.

And oh by the way, the democrats did that while *decreasing* concentration of wealth - in other words, everyone gets richer - while the Republicans' lower growth was done at the same time they were greatly increasing the concentrationo of wealth - read the rich getting richer at the expense of most Americans. Ya, 'good point'.

11. I'm voting Democrat because I believe government is wiser
than I am, regarding the raising of my children.

I don't even know where to start on the idiocy of this one. Let's get rid of child protective serves, I guess. Another 'good point'.

13. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that the Constitution
is a 'living document' that changes with our society.

See my other post addressing this at length. Or perhaps you believe it's not, and that 'free speech' applies doesn't apply to tv and the internet.

Another idiotic, not 'good', point so typical of this garbage that hides te issue of interpreting the constitution behind an idiotic claim.

15. I'm voting Democrat because I believe that the government
has the right to allow my daughter to have an abortion without my knowledge,
even though I have to give MY permission for her to get her ears pierced. [/q

Perhaps the only one of the bunch with any point to it IMO - but of course it's copletely silent on the actual substance of tthe issue why may experts support that policy. The counter might well point out the huge harms to many girls that happen when this is not allowed. It needs ah honest discussion looking at the facts, not an idiotic analogy to ear piercing as if that's the whole issue. So it's terribly writen for the topic.

Not one 'good pioint' in the bunch.