Why is Isreal such a big deal to US Politicians?

Hugo Drax

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2011
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Republicans,Democrats will fight over each other to claim who will do more for Israel. These guys will grovel like starving Ethiopian schoolchildren over a bowl of rice in regards to Israeli interests.

What is the reason for this, they are practically a dot on our planet, they produce nothing we need, have no natural resources we need?

We don't seem to fall over other countries interests as much as we do for Israel.
 

Anarchist420

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Feb 13, 2010
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Republicans,Democrats will fight over each other to claim who will do more for Israel. These guys will grovel like starving Ethiopian schoolchildren over a bowl of rice in regards to Israeli interests.

What is the reason for this, they are practically a dot on our planet, they produce nothing we need, have no natural resources we need?

We don't seem to fall over other countries interests as much as we do for Israel.
While some of their citizens acting privately have contributed to society, you're right about everything else. We could trade peacefully with them (I think anyway) without our govt being a militant military ally of their militant military govt.

I think that there are definitely common traits between both countries (i.e., the majority of the Americans and the majority of Israelis) and both of their govts. The fact that the govts are so similar is the biggest factor. The other two smaller, but still significant factors are probably gentile guilt over the persecutions Jews have suffered and the fact that Jews vote more and contribute more to campaigns and strong govt can't exist for an incredibly long time without things that majority (but not all of them) of Jews like. I don't like all of this Holocaust shit shoved down my throat because it's putting us in debt, but I don't blame all Jews for that (Congress is ultimately responsible for taking everyone else's money due to Congress's own guilt; if Congress is so guilty, then they can pay for the museum, memorials, field trips, etc., etc. themselves) and I understand that it's very hard for most Jews to live with... in spite of how hard it may be to live with, that doesn't mean anyone should be forced to foot the bill.

I wish the Church of Rome hadn't banned its members from loaning money at interest because that meant that most people would be opposed to it and that only one small group of people would get accustomed to it more and always be more accustomed to it than everyone else ... it should at the same time, however, be noted that the vast majority of Jews in this country before the counter-revolution were actually opposed to big finance. I know that they were opposed because they were very predominantly Jacksonians and Jeffersonians before that rather than Hamiltonians. So the business plot we live under is actually the fault of Anglicans/Episcopalians primarily, rather than Jews. I'm actually celtic myself even if not predominantly, and I think the Scots-Irish Presbyterians rather than Jews and Anglos contributed more to this country than any one else... however, the Jews did not destroy what the Scots Irish did for the people, so they're neither bad like the very blue blooded and plutocratic New Englanders, nor are they good like the Scots-Irish.
 
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cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
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Republicans,Democrats will fight over each other to claim who will do more for Israel. These guys will grovel like starving Ethiopian schoolchildren over a bowl of rice in regards to Israeli interests.

What is the reason for this, they are practically a dot on our planet, they produce nothing we need, have no natural resources we need?

We don't seem to fall over other countries interests as much as we do for Israel.

This question is repeatedly asked, but the answer is quite simple...votes and money.

Most of the US is Christian. Most Christians believe that the following line in Bible from God is true (paraphrased): "Those who curse you, I will curse and those who bless you, I will bless (referring to Israel)". Therefor, to make the Christian majority (vast majority) happy, politicians take care of Israel and support her.

Also, many politically active Jews are wealthy. Their political funding causes them to have a greatly disproportionate control in politics for the low number of Jewish voters. Supporting Israel is a requirement to keep them happy.

Add to it that the majority of the enemies of the US currently are Muslims. It is easy to paint anyone who does not support Israel as supporting Israel's enemies - who are also our enemies.
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
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Oct 30, 2000
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The enemy of our enemy is our friend/ally

Start during WWII.
Continued with the Soviets during the cold war - the Soviets supported the Arab block; we ended up supporting those who were against the Arab block (and in reverse from Soviet perspective)
Also the fact that support for the under dog who stands up against the bully.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Christian fundies must see Israel go up in a mushroom cloud for the rapture to happen.

Nothing new from right wingers, they just have to be a little on the down low about the Jew thing since Hitler was such bad PR being so up front.

They still use the old "It's all a big Commie/socialist plot" commie/socialist is the politically correct way of saying Jews/liberals/catholics nowadays, but this was common back in the day also, they never even bothered to change out their conspiracies much.
 
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cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
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Christian fundies must see Israel go up in a mushroom cloud for the rapture to happen.

Nothing new from right wingers, they just have to be a little on the down low about it since Hitler was such bad PR.

Your ignorance is on display.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
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http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Neo-Commie

1. neo-Communist 80 up, 24 down

A Neo-Communist per.se is pretty easy to define and hard at the same time.

Why this is so: As the word implies, it is a 'new' generation of Communist, albeit most are students (as where it learned from), few are more and less anti-Authitorian proletars (low class workers), and pledge alliance to Marx's theories, but defy Soviet and the like (China, perhaps Cuba) as inferior attempts on it, not genuine ones, and state-capitalistic enterprises with vague socialistic elements. They often share sympathies with workers, activists and anarchists. Most neo-Communist are so presumably because of a rebellish fad, or attitude, but most of them reject Totalarianism, saying it was never a part of leftism. Transistionary states are a heated subject, and neo-Communists are often followed for their ideology, because they are placed in the same class of despot-supporters. Neo-Communists are often atheists or agnostics.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81

I have no problem with this for Marxists and the like.

Left Libertarians have not needed to change their views for around 200 years unlike Marxists/Social Democrats.

So this is silly, a Libertarian is a Libertarian, the only confusion is bircher/ayn rand cultists in the USA who squat the same term since the 1950s which causes some confusion in the US political realm.

Neo-Libertarian would be a much more accurate description of fundamentalist free marketeers who use the term in the US. But they already have a term in common use for them worldwide Neo-liberals. Which gets to the point much more accurately without all the explanation of the historical backstory of why two literally opposite ideologies are using the same term suddenly since the 50s.
 
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bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
0
imo steeplerot is only as commie as he allows us to perceive. imo he's more devious than he lets on
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
imo steeplerot is only as commie as he allows us to perceive. imo he's more devious than he lets on

Maybe.

But then when it comes down to it, we all bleed red comrade.

Maybe someday you will join us -and the world will be as one. :whiste:
 
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RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
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Because a couple of thousand years ago, a few sheep herders and other primitive men got together and wrote a book about that day's David Koresh in an attempt to explain "miracles" and other wonders of the world that they couldn't explain and convinced a large following of people that, as the writers of the book, that they were the "chosen" ones.

Today, a lot of other primitive-minded people would rather ignore the advancements made in science and instead, think that the sheppards who didn't even know enough to invent toilet paper yet somehow knew the real answers to the universe.
 

EXman

Lifer
Jul 12, 2001
20,079
15
81
Christian fundies must see Israel go up in a mushroom cloud for the rapture to happen.

Nothing new from right wingers, they just have to be a little on the down low about the Jew thing since Hitler was such bad PR being so up front.

They still use the old "It's all a big Commie/socialist plot" commie/socialist is the politically correct way of saying Jews/liberals/catholics nowadays, but this was common back in the day also, they never even bothered to change out their conspiracies much.

Is my sarcasm meter broken? I hope so for your sake.
 

EXman

Lifer
Jul 12, 2001
20,079
15
81
Because a couple of thousand years ago, a few sheep herders and other primitive men got together and wrote a book about that day's David Koresh in an attempt to explain "miracles" and other wonders of the world that they couldn't explain and convinced a large following of people that, as the writers of the book, that they were the "chosen" ones.

Today, a lot of other primitive-minded people would rather ignore the advancements made in science and instead, think that the sheppards who didn't even know enough to invent toilet paper yet somehow knew the real answers to the universe.

Bigot
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
The thread question is why is Israel such a big deal to US politicians is indeed a good question. But somewhat hats off to Israel for conducting such a good public realtions campaign dating from the days prior to the formal recognition of the State of Israel in 1948. And the Israeli lobby called AIPAC flies under the lobbying ruler for other foreign governments because it does not directly distribute money to US politicians, and instead acts as a clearing house for other entities that do. Another stroke of PR brillance.

But still IMHO, Israel has two very good causes to worry.

1. Israel PR is entirely has invested everything in the USA. As the rest of the world has no equivalents of AIPAC as their governments and their people more clearly see the phony in Israeli foreign policy. Which extends especially two the 2/3 majority of non-allaigned nations in the UN general assembly. But as long as the USA is the so called leader of the free world and has such economic trading power, most alpha nations will follow the US lead as long as UNCLE SUCKER foots the bill and is the only nation that spends itself into poverty to side with only Israel. At the cost of alienating 300+ million Arabs who have a strangle hold on the supply, transport, and price of oil as a world commidity. Which IMHO, gets to the crux of it. Other than the USA blowing
over 3 trillion dollars+++, in two fruitless quagmires, and over 6000 lives, the Arabs and other nations have yet to say, Israeli government policy is grossly unfair, and used the economic power to make sure US government policy is more fair and even handed rather than siding only with Israel for no rational reason. Twenty years ago, the Arab nations looked to the United States to try to resolve and end the Israeli occupation of disputed territories dating back to 1967, and now USA cred in the mid-east is at zero. As the events of the Arab spring now make the entire mid-east more volitile than 1948. And if wars are started in the mid-east oil patch, due to anyone's fault, its certain to result in a world wide deprecession in evey oil dependent economy in the world. As it will also become very likely the USA and Israel will share the lions share of the blame. In short, Israeli PR support may stay the same until it starts costing the American consumer in the pocketbook which may start happening very soon.

2. Positive PR is something to be cultivated and not wisely squandered, look at how fast Pee Wee Herman went from a positive American parents role model to the hated phony he is now. Maybe the Pee Herman example may not sound as all too typical, but in foreign policy such shifts can happen at the speed of light.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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The US and western nations have just one country in the region thats not going to attack their embassies and thats Israel. Besides a few alternate reality people, we realize that Israel is surrounded by nations not friendly or at best ambivalent about western democracies. For example Israel is the only safe place for gays.
 
Apr 27, 2012
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The US and western nations have just one country in the region thats not going to attack their embassies and thats Israel. Besides a few alternate reality people, we realize that Israel is surrounded by nations not friendly or at best ambivalent about western democracies. For example Israel is the only safe place for gays.

Yet many leftists attack it while at the same time supporting those other countries where gays are attacked
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
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Othadox Jewish rabbis are not exactly Gay friendly, and tell many US Jews they are not qualified to be Jews. As the present Israeli government intervene in US politics and refuse to agree to a settlement freeze in disputed territories.

As we are supposed to ignore the fact that Israel attacked the the US Liberty and sells US defense secrets to China.
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
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Oct 30, 2000
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Othadox Jewish rabbis are not exactly Gay friendly, and tell many US Jews they are not qualified to be Jews. As the present Israeli government intervene in US politics and refuse to agree to a settlement freeze in disputed territories.

As we are supposed to ignore the fact that Israel attacked the the US Liberty and sells US defense secrets to China.

Evidence to the bolded. Or is it just because Israel sells its own technology that you think it is selling US secrets.
 

marincounty

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2005
3,227
5
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As we are supposed to ignore the fact that Israel attacked the the US Liberty and sells US defense secrets to China.
Uh, that was in 1967? What does that have to do with anything now?

Israel is our only real ally in the entire middle east and the few billion we spend there is cheap when compared with our total military budget. Not to mention a lot of the support is military hardware, which is an indirect subsidy to US military contractors.
 
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