Why isn't there a backlash against DDR SDRAM like there was with RDRAM?...RE: VIA KT133A

[NFS4]

Seems as though the stuff ain't living up to the hype and it costs much more than dirt cheap PC133 memory now. Same thing happened with RDRAM in '99 (but it was a bit higher).

After reading Anand's KT133A review, it seems that a bulk of the DDR SDRAM "advantage" was coming from the 266MHz FSB on the Athlon and not the PC2100 DDR SDRAM. And we won't see a real advantage until programs begin to use the extra bandwidth (haven't seen any yet with the exception of synthetic benchmarks).

I feel like I was sucked into the DDR SDRAM hype and if I were to buy a system in the coming months, you can be sure that it will be KT133A + dirt cheap PC133.

 

[fkloster]

You speak not with forked tongue Two-Dogs...(fklosters poor attempt to impersonate a wise indian chief )

 

[Impact55]

Yeah I just bought my new system, the prices were right, didn't want to even wait for VIA KT133'A', I'm sure I'll be happy with my system though.

 

[Noriaki]

I have 384MB of PC100 2-2-2 SDRAM...I'm hoping it will do PC133 @ 2-2-2 and I intend to buy a KT133A board and a socket A athlon probably 2-3 months from now. I'm going to try and sell my TBird 700 to a guy I know that wants one. Use my 550 K7 and K7M for a linux machine me and my roommate are putting together. And get a K7T Turbo (that's KT133A right?) and like a Duron 700 and overlock it to 133FSB. That'll be pretty sweet really.

I have very little interest in DDR now.




<< Why isn't there a backlash against DDR SDRAM like there was with RDRAM?... >>

Because people are to proud to admit they were wrong, and DDR isn't the cat's meow either.
Well I thought that DDR would kick some ass and rip rambus a new one. I was wrong.
I also thought 3dfx would live on, I was wrong about that to.
I'm wrong about lots of things, I'll admit it

 

[fkloster]

<< Well I thought that DDR would kick some ass and rip rambus a new one. I was wrong. >>



fkloster wishes more people around here had huge seeds the size of Noriaki's and would come clean about their impressions about how DDR would spank rambus in the arse! I was sure stupid to buy Rambus back in January. It should be easy to admit when you are wrong. Going against the grain in these forums seems to be quite difficult for some peeps. I commend Noriaki for his bravery!

 

[PG]

I think there will be a backlash, especially after everyone has time to read Anand's benchmark results. I don't see any reason to get DDR for quite a while.

 

[BoberFett]

Part of the resentment towards RDRAM was the fact that it appeared that Intel wanted to force it on the industry. They were seemingly on their way to dropping SDRAM support, (see: i820 debacle) and between the high price (at the time) and negligible benefits of RDRAM that created angry consumers.

 

[Nelmster]

I would agree...I think the &quot;timing&quot; of the article (right before the holidays) has probably led to relatively few people reading it. I think next week or after New Year's Day, there will probably be some more posting on this.

I know that I was going to go DDR until I read this article. I would like to see maybe 1-2 more studies from others on this, but something tells me they will find the same thing. No disrespect to Anand at all; I just like seeing a general consensus before I decide.

fkloster, when did you decide to talk in the 3rd person?

 

[Noriaki]

BoberFett: I agree with you...but the AMD760 doesn't support SDR SDRAM anymore than the i820 did....AMD hasn't been pushing DDR the same way Intel pushed RDRAM but then, AMD isn't in the same position as Intel to be able to do so....Intel was just higher profile because they are a bigger company more in the public eye (especially at the time of the i820 debacle). I don't see a whole lot of difference between now with AMD and then with Intel. Different names...maybe not quite as steep of a price difference...but it looks like the same story really. In both cases it's really Via that saved our arses....Via eventually forced the i815 with the Pro 133A, and they have the KT133A to bail us out now...
Intel still had the BX to support their CPUs but they had nothing but Rambus for the 133FSB ones...AMD still has AMD750/KT133 to support their CPUs, but nothing for the 133FSB but DDR, until Via's new guy here.

DDR still has a solid place in the market, the GeForce2 but I don't think it's going to be a main memory for a while.

Maybe AMD's next will do the same thing the P4 did, the P4 shows the benefit of Rambus, maybe it's like Anand said and the K7 and P3 are just designed for SDRAM and can't take advantage of newer high-bandwidth memory technologies.

 

[BoberFett]

Also, As far as a DDR backlash, DDR SDRAM is still an option, not a requirement. That's the difference. In every area of computer, there's an option that adds minimal benefits, but adds greatly to the cost. You don't see people actively protesting GeForce 2 Ultra cards, even though the speed difference is relatively small compared to the price difference. If you don't want it, don't buy it. You can still get non-DDR chipsets for the Athlon.

 

[Adul]

I was wondering the same thing last night. Which brings another question to mind. Will VC SDRAM make a differnce now? What effect does memory interleaving havenon VC SDRAM. Anand, please read my e-mail

 

[Sohcan]

I think we were so excited about DDR SDRAM because we saw what it did for the GeForce. DDR SDRAM is great in bandwidth limited senarios (like video memory at high resolutions and color depths), but evidently that's just not the situation with main memory.

In a few months, when DDR SDRAM DIMM prices fall and 760/KX266 motherboards are readily available and you're building a new system, DDR SDRAM will be the logical choice. But I see no reason to drop your current motherboard and memory just to go DDR.

 

[BenSkywalker]

D@mn shame we couldn't see some Quake3 NV15 numbers, that may change a few people's minds on what DDR(or RDRAM if you want to post some fkloster) has to offer. It's pretty easy to say that memory bandwith doesn't matter when memory bandwith isn't the issue.

We have seen and heard a lot about hardware T&amp;L and big jumps in geometry, increased bandwith whether it be via DDR or RDRAM is a very important factor in that equation.

 

[NFS4]

<< You don't see people actively protesting GeForce 2 Ultra cards >>


Where've you been for the past few months


<< the difference. In every area of computer, there's an option that adds minimal benefits, but adds greatly to the cost. >>


The problem is, DDR SDRAM is looking to be the &quot;next&quot; standard just like RDRAM. We all know what happened to Rambus. DDR SDRAM has a better chance as it is supported by more manufacturers, but I still don't see the benefit in using the stuff until some time down the road.


<< Also, As far as a DDR backlash, DDR SDRAM is still an option, not a requirement. >>


If the &quot;option&quot; show's only a 0 - 5% increase in performance, it's not an &quot;option&quot; it's a waste of money. And I do believe that the Ultra gives more than a 5% increase (more like 20-30%) in high rez's.

I mean when I can get 256MB of some decent PC133 memory for less than $90, DDR SDRAM makes no sense to me....for now. Maybe in '02 it will

 

[fkloster]

This is my only benchmark I have published showing HW T&amp;L results...

10058 default 3DMark score.

DX 8.0
Ultra 300/505 using 7.17
WinME

 

[Charles]

Well, I think both DDR and RDRAM will show their strength in future applications which likely will require more bandwith. Agree?

Who is the winner?

 

[etech]

The manufacters of DDR ram are not suing everyone in site trying to force everyone to use it.

Rambus still sucks, both the company and the product.

 

[fkloster]

<< Rambus still sucks, both the company and the product. >>



Rambus, the product, does not suck. Rambus memory is based on serial architecture which could very well prove to be the FUTURE of ALL PC infrastructures... as opposed to current and legacy parrallel communications.

 

[Charles]

<< Rambus still sucks, both the company and the product. >>

I don't care if Rambus corp is sucks, but I disagree if you say that the product sucks. It's true though that it is not the product that everyone will buy, but it's not a piece of crap either.

<<Rambus, the product, does not suck. Rambus memory is based on serial architecture which could very well prove to be the FUTURE of ALL PC infrastructures... as opposed to current and legacy parrallel communications.>>

Let's see. RDRAM/Rambus as well as Pentiums/Intel has a very strong competitor.

 

[Noriaki]

<< Let's see. RDRAM/Rambus as well as Pentiums/Intel has a very strong competitor. >>

They sure do, but fkloster didn't say Rambus would be the future of all PC communciations. he said serial would be.
DDR-II is expected to be Serial in nature. Serial ATA is coming. USB and IEEE1394 are both Serial connection types, replacing COM ports (which are serial themselves) and LPT...the only major parrallel strong hold left are the PCI and CPU's Front Side Busses. It looks like PCI-X is still Parallel, and the P4 is still parrallel, so those two channels will probably stay that way for some time, but many other traditionally parallel channels are being swapped out in favour of high speed serial.
Ethernet is serial to...though it's hardly what one could call new...

 

[NOX]

Hahaha NFS4, that's what I asked here.

But I?ll admit I was one of them, though I think my question now is where's the consistency? :Q

[EDIT]

etech,

<< The manufacters of DDR ram are not suing everyone in site trying to force everyone to use it. >>

People attacked RDRAM way before Rambus started suing everyone.

 

[Charles]

You are right, Noriaki. I should have read it more carefully.

 

[Charles]

TBird 700, Alpha P7125, Asus K7M, 384MB PC100 2-2-2...

You bought the Slot 1 Tbird, huh?

 

[Noriaki]

Yup now I have to try to overclock it.

Got a GFD a few days ago, just haven't had time to play with it hehe

 

[Charles]

Can I have a picture of your case w the power supply? D@mn, 450 Watts?