Why millennials can't land jobs

[JM Aggie08]

I've got good money that says those that are complaining about having to 'conform' and wear a suit to an interview work in the service industry.

Can I get a refill on my Dr. Pepper please?

 

[OverVolt]

I've got good money that says those that are complaining about having to 'conform' and wear a suit to an interview work in the service industry.

Can I get a refill on my Dr. Pepper please?

I don't mind wearing a suit I spent all of highschool wearing dress clothes. I'm 100% comfortable in a well-fitting suit. I bet many people are not. You can't just put on your suit for one day and be comfortable in it for the job interview. You have to know how to wear a suit and still carry yourself well. So yes the people complaining about suits probably wore casual clothes their whole lives and aren't comfortable in a suit and blow their interview with bad posture and such.

 

[apac]

You got laid off because of FILO policies.

Inb4 Gen X lectures you.

None of that stuff you are listing, actually happens with any sort of serious millennial job candidates. Only in news articles. It would apply to any generation anyway, I'm sure plenty of Gen X candidates showed up in the wrong dress code as well, it just wasn't as competitive back then so if they blew their interview it wasn't as big of a deal they could just get another.

Part of the problem is HR is not filtering out bad candidates very well either, so there is that. Why not blame HR instead of millennials?

I got laid off because they shut down our satellite office and offered us relocation. Corporate didn't like managing the location due to travel expenses, etc. I chose the 6 months severance and got the new job I wanted in less than a month .

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/23/cisco-layoffs-lays-off-cuts-simplicity_n_1696600.html

All the things I listed were specifically mentioned by people in this thread, in stories from their own interview candidates. I haven't read any news articles on it.

 

[Pulsar]

Oh yea the internet and a cellphone, great. How about an affordable house can I get one of those?

Try and get a job without email or a cellphone. All that unnecessary shit. Whats your age bracket? Just curious.

When the "correcting" begins to affect you personally whats going to be your excuse then? Its easy to just say millennials got dumb degrees and baby boomers didn't save enough for retirement but its coming your way too, genius. All the excuses in the world won't pay your bills.

Goodness. Aren't you overly touchy.

You sound a lot like my youngest son - putting up walls rather than finding solutions. That seems to be common among Americans right now. I can't help you with an 'affordable' house. House prices are what they are, and it looks like you're in San Francisco, where the prices are high. Have you considered moving to a place you can afford?

You don't need internet at home, or a cellphone, to get a job. There are lots of places local to me (and I'm rural) where I can go to get free internet, starting with my local libraries. A cellphone is a nice luxury, but hardly a necessity. I might ask what age bracket that you are in that you think otherwise.

The 'correcting' has been affecting me for the last 7 years. We've cancelled Satellite, reduced our cellphone plans to a minimum, dumped our expensive AT&T land phone lines for cheap $19 a month Verizon, increased our deductibles, refinanced our home loan, changed car insurance and health insurance companies, changed heating-gas companies, added a brown-out electrical system from the electrical company for lower rates, stopped using our air-conditioning, and generally cut almost $1200 a month from our costs.

It can keep correcting - it doesn't matter to me. We've been putting away as much as we can every month for retirement. My wife has a /useful/ degree that will allow her to go back to work next-day if needed, and my degree and background will get me hired very quickly.

Go back and look over the years at the number of people who have done just fine living out of their cars while they work to get the money they need to get on their feet. I know people, even now, who are doing that and are perfectly happy.

Anyway, the end game to all of this is that if you've gotten a decent degree and worked hard, you CAN find a job. It may not be where you want, at the rate you want, but you'll find one. People are going to have to get used to the new reality of going where-ever you need to so that you can make a living. We've been very spoiled. Those that always have made it work will continue to do so, and those that complain will continue to do so. I think that's a universal truth.

 

[BikeJunkie]

I've been reading this thread over a couple days now, and I've seen a lot of really polarizing opinions, so I'll throw out another one.

I'm 28, and I've worked in software for 7 years now, not including during school. When I graduated I interviewed with 4 companies. 3 of those made me an offer. When I got laid off from my last company, I interviewed with my current one - and only my current one - and received an offer with the salary I wanted. People tell me I'm "lucky", I tell them I try to make my own luck.

My #1 rule of thumb is bring the right attitude. That boils down to a combination of confidence and respect. Be friendly, courteous, and respectful while you present why you are the best candidate for the job, and why they would be fortunate to have you aboard. The key is actually believing what you say - no bullshit, cause then your confidence drops like a rock. In order to believe what you say, you actually have to know what you're talking about. If you're an entry-level candidate, don't pretend like you know everything, they don't expect you to. If you're an experienced candidate, be prepared to talk about the things you do know about, and don't be afraid to tell the interviewer if you've entered unknown territory.

I'm not sure if I'm a 'millenial', but what I've noticed throughout the thread is interviewees that have too much of the confidence component and not enough of the respect component. Maybe this generation wasn't raised with manners and politeness in mind, and maybe that's why I haven't had the problems that others have. I always remember to be polite, and I always remember my pleases and thank-yous. It's not hard to do, but I don't always see people remembering their common courtesies, and they go a long way.

There is also a huge difference between being confident and humble, and confident and arrogant. Being humble is a balance to the confidence and makes you come across as intelligent and friendly. Humor works well. Arrogance has an aggregate affect to confidence and makes you come across as intelligent and an asshole. No one wants to work with an asshole, no matter how smart you are.

Regarding clothing, in my experience in the software field, as long as you put some effort into looking nice, clothing does not matter. I typically wear nice shoes, a nice pair of dress jeans or khakis, and a tucked in polo to a quick lunch interview. I'll wear dress pants and a tucked in button down shirt to an on site interview. I wear these things because I am comfortable in them and it helps my confidence. If I'm overdressed I tend to get fidgety and am constantly thinking about my clothing. If I'm comfortable and less formally dressed I think it gives them a much better impression than if I'm uncomfortable and more formally dressed.

Basically, I think all the 'millenial' stories can be broken down to a lack of confidence or a lack of respect.

Candidates that ...
- bring their parents: lack of confidence
- use their phone during an interview: lack of respect
- the guy that said '2 week' rather than an '8 week' agile cycle: lack of respect
- not bringing a resume, and then saying 'you brought me here': lack of respect
- putting things on your resume that you don't know: lack of confidence (you should be confident in what you know and don't know, don't lie...)
- wearing very casual clothing: lack of respect

....etc etc

This guy gets it.

 

[OverVolt]

Goodness. Aren't you overly touchy.

You sound a lot like my youngest son - putting up walls rather than finding solutions. That seems to be common among Americans right now. I can't help you with an 'affordable' house. House prices are what they are, and it looks like you're in San Francisco, where the prices are high. Have you considered moving to a place you can afford?

You don't need internet at home, or a cellphone, to get a job. There are lots of places local to me (and I'm rural) where I can go to get free internet, starting with my local libraries. A cellphone is a nice luxury, but hardly a necessity. I might ask what age bracket that you are in that you think otherwise.

The 'correcting' has been affecting me for the last 7 years. We've cancelled Satellite, reduced our cellphone plans to a minimum, dumped our expensive AT&T land phone lines for cheap $19 a month Verizon, increased our deductibles, refinanced our home loan, changed car insurance and health insurance companies, changed heating-gas companies, added a brown-out electrical system from the electrical company for lower rates, stopped using our air-conditioning, and generally cut almost $1200 a month from our costs.

It can keep correcting - it doesn't matter to me. We've been putting away as much as we can every month for retirement. My wife has a /useful/ degree that will allow her to go back to work next-day if needed, and my degree and background will get me hired very quickly.

Go back and look over the years at the number of people who have done just fine living out of their cars while they work to get the money they need to get on their feet. I know people, even now, who are doing that and are perfectly happy.

Anyway, the end game to all of this is that if you've gotten a decent degree and worked hard, you CAN find a job. It may not be where you want, at the rate you want, but you'll find one. People are going to have to get used to the new reality of going where-ever you need to so that you can make a living. We've been very spoiled. Those that always have made it work will continue to do so, and those that complain will continue to do so. I think that's a universal truth.

I'm going to do what I need to do, I'm just sick of the various narratives that are going around that I feel are way off base. Nothing is equal between the generations. Houses just cost what they cost, thats fine.

I feel there is way too much risk/debt to 'buy-in' to the previous generations lifestyles but we feel extreme pressure to do so. College costs more than it ever used to, same for houses, inflation adjusted.

That being said the average house size is much larger than in the past and I get that. I'd be perfectly happy in a pretty small house the main caveat is that other millennials won't get off their asses and so all the smaller houses are in deadbeat neighborhoods. I'm just as annoyed at other millenials and as am at anyone else.

 

[SP33Demon]

I don't mind wearing a suit I spent all of highschool wearing dress clothes. I'm 100% comfortable in a well-fitting suit. I bet many people are not. You can't just put on your suit for one day and be comfortable in it for the job interview. You have to know how to wear a suit and still carry yourself well. So yes the people complaining about suits probably wore casual clothes their whole lives and aren't comfortable in a suit and blow their interview with bad posture and such.

I own two suits, and the only time I ever wear them is when I'm giving clients a demo or an interview. Not sure where you are getting the "can't wear a suit for one day and be comfortable" thing from. Granted, you do have to try them on every now and then to make sure they still fit.

 

[purbeast0]

I own two suits, and the only time I ever wear them is when I'm giving clients a demo or an interview. Not sure where you are getting the "can't wear a suit for one day and be comfortable" thing from. Granted, you do have to try them on every now and then to make sure they still fit.

yeah i don't know what he's talking about either. i wear suits probably 3-4 times a year, and they simply aren't as comfortable as wearing shorts and a t-shirt, no matter how many times you wear them.

i've worked as a software dev where i've had to wear slacks and a button up shirt with a tie (the tie thing didn't last long though), and i've been in places where i can wear shorts and a t-shirt. from my experience, dressing up nicer actually boosts your confidence and makes you feel more "professional". i know that sounds retarded but it's the truth.

i remember my first job out of school (and i was there for 5 years) i could wear t-shirt and shorts to work. when we'd go out to lunch as a group we would not look like professionals when we would see groups of other people dressed nice.

then at my next job (where i had to dress up) and i would go out to lunch, i "felt" like a professional. and around that time is when i started to "come into my own" and where work went from feeling like a job to feeling like a career. since that job on i've been doing a lot of development on the side in my own spare time which has kept me sharp with technology as well. once i hit this job, i actually started to care about my work more than just going there, getting it done, and going home. i also never worked more than 40 hours a week other than 2 times in 2 years.

i'm not sure whether "feeling" professional due partially to the way i was dressing is what made me start to feel that way, but it happened at the same time my dress changed.

right now i'm at a job where i can wear jeans + t-shirt to work, but i choose to wear jeans (nice jeans though not some baggy shits or crap that looks like i bought it 5 years ago) and polo shirts when its warm or long sleeve sweaters/dress shirts when it's cold. i can also say that i feel more comfortable doing my job in these clothes than i do with a button up shirt and slacks on as well.

in all 3 interviews i had, i was wearing a suit and tie.

 

[Ns1]

i don't wear a suit everyday but i love wearing it. shrugs.

if i had some money i'd be like barney stinson and suit up constantly.

 

[Virge_]

Somehow I find that hard to believe unless the OP was a troll just looking to say that to begin with to be honest.

*shrug*

Thats the entire point..

 

[PieIsAwesome]

i don't wear a suit everyday but i love wearing it. shrugs.

if i had some money i'd be like barney stinson and suit up constantly.

If it were socially acceptable I would like to wear one everywhere. Also a cape. Capes are cool.

 

[BoberFett]

If it were socially acceptable I would like to wear one everywhere. Also a cape. Capes are cool.

Are we talking superhero cape or vampire cape?

 

[SP33Demon]

i don't wear a suit everyday but i love wearing it. shrugs.

if i had some money i'd be like barney stinson and suit up constantly.

Agree, except I get hot in them. Hell, if it's 60 degrees I'm hot with a polo shirt and no undershirt on. Then again I have the metabolism of a 20 yr old due to powerlifting. Sucks being hot all the time.

 

[mizzou]

Millenials can't land jobs because the older generation (x?) hasn't left yet

This is an age old commentary though. The younger generation is ALWAYS seen as rebellious, unorganized, disrespectful.

 

[88keys]

Actually, it's probably more to do with the Baby Boomers not retiring. I know some people who lost a ton of money out of their retirements when the economy crashed in '08.

 

[mizzou]

Actually, it's probably more to do with the Baby Boomers not retiring. I know some people who lost a ton of money out of their retirements when the economy crashed in '08.

Oh yeah, during the first big crash I was amazed how much my in-laws bled out.

It made me want to put my money underneath the mattress.

 

[MongGrel]

i don't wear a suit everyday but i love wearing it. shrugs.

if i had some money i'd be like barney stinson and suit up constantly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiRPBCiJg2c

But I have a company uniform I'm required to work these day's, though it's not a bad one.

Least it's Aerospace I guess.

 

[Ns1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiRPBCiJg2c

But I have a company uniform I'm required to work these day's, though it's not a bad one.

What's funny about this link is I actually do wear a lot of british clothing =X

<3 british stylin.

 

[MongGrel]

What's funny about this link is I actually do wear a lot of british clothing =X

<3 british stylin.

I've some tweed in the closet myself.

:biggrin:

 

[destrekor]

I don't mind wearing a suit I spent all of highschool wearing dress clothes. I'm 100% comfortable in a well-fitting suit. I bet many people are not. You can't just put on your suit for one day and be comfortable in it for the job interview. You have to know how to wear a suit and still carry yourself well. So yes the people complaining about suits probably wore casual clothes their whole lives and aren't comfortable in a suit and blow their interview with bad posture and such.

I could be comfortable in a suit. I've worn the Army equivalent, as well as a sport coat, just fine.

I have a slight problem that I bet does translate to appearing uncomfortable, though I take great lengths to pump myself up with enough artificial confidence to try and minimize the issue: I'm deformed.
Call it a "cereal bowl chest", a "concave chest", a "hole", whatever... my lower ribs are quite concave in the middle, and seemingly stick out further at the outer edges. It seems to push my diaphragm lower and in general makes the part of my chest/upper body that is furthest from my spine the bottom edges of some rib bones, and not the pectoral muscles. I've been working on my pecs (all over, really) to try and build up and cover this nonsense, but until that day arrives years from now, I cannot get a single tailored jacket to fit right. Hell, even slim-fitting dress shirts and whatnot don't fit right.

I'd rather not look awkward and uncomfortable in a suit, when I'm clearly not physically capable of anything else at this time. I do what I can to find the right colors and fits to minimize the appearance of my deformity, because I know it probably is causing acceptance issues.
I mean, when all of you pro-suit hiring managers and whatnot utter these opinions about looking well-groomed and confident and having clothing that fits right... you see my dilemma. There is no shirt, no jacket, that literally fits me right. The way material falls, it just ain't happening. I can get close, and I take great lengths to get there...
I just know some of you are going to be ignorant and take a first look, see my shirts fit me oddly compared to almost everybody else, and just go with your first assumption: I'm lazy, don't take the time to get dressed correctly, don't take the time to find the right fits or get things tailored... etc etc etc.
I sincerely hope I haven't lost out of a job for that reason, but I can't do a damn thing except appear confident. For the most part, I am confident and feel confident in an interview, and ensure I am presenting that physical posture... but I can't do anything except get as close to a good fit as possible, and ensure everything is at least coordinated correctly. Otherwise, hopefully they look past the fact that something seems weird about the way shirts fit me.

I have no intention of buying a suit at this point in time, mainly for that reason. Also, I have every intention of building enough muscle that getting something tailored now would be a waste, especially since it wouldn't fit right one way or the other.
I also don't suspect I can ever truly overcome the skeletal shape, not without being a barrel-chested mass of muscle, and I don't intent to go that far.

 

[DigDog]

Why not blame HR instead of millennials?

I blame not only HR, but everyone else who purports to be impartial and rational but hires based on impressions or instinct.

manager 1: "i need to hire top class personnel, who have exceptional technical skills, are motivated, dynamic and dedicated, honest, proactive, disciplined, who are great team players, superb communicators and who genuinely value our company"

manager 2: "that sounds great, how are you going to screen the candidates?"

manager 1: "i'll pick the guy who wears what i think is right"

 

[BikeJunkie]

I blame not only HR, but everyone else who purports to be impartial and rational but hires based on impressions or instinct.

manager 1: "i need to hire top class personnel, who have exceptional technical skills, are motivated, dynamic and dedicated, honest, proactive, disciplined, who are great team players, superb communicators and who genuinely value our company"

manager 2: "that sounds great, how are you going to screen the candidates?"

manager 1: "i'll pick the guy who wears what i think is right"

If you actually think that's what's been said here, you have a lot of re-reading to do.

 

[Anubis]

i don't wear a suit everyday but i love wearing it. shrugs.

i hate them, last time i wore one was for my last job interview 8 months ago (got job)

i can count on 2 hands the number of times ive worn a suit in my life
i hate them

 

[BikeJunkie]

i hate them, last time i wore one was for my last job interview 8 months ago (got job)

i can count on 2 hands the number of times ive worn a suit in my life
i hate them

I actually like wearing them as long as I don't have to wear them often. Weddings, job interviews, client interviews are enough.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I actually like wearing them as long as I don't have to wear them often.

Me too. Suits are a shortcut in a male's life.

As long as it works for you (good fashion, tailored correctly, is pressed, etc.) suits make formal stuff a breeze.

No matching shirts and pants and all that. Go with the exact suit and outfit the gay guy at the store put together for you and suddenly all those people who will judge you for your appearance get their superficial box checked without you having to put in real effort.

Heck I have been known to overdress in my suit for any occasion when jeans and a T won't work only because its my second easiest outfit to execute. The middle ground of picking and matching some button down and slacks sucks in comparison.

The only downside to this is that it only stays easy as long as you religiously dry clean (because ironing super sucks), so it can be expensive with frequent use.