Why Muslims Hate the US?!

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: dwell

Originally posted by: NFS4
They hate us b/c we have porn.

Even Hasidic Jews have pr0n.

http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/bbzzdd/pr0n.jpg

Let's not forget The Amish.

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: NFS4
They hate us b/c we have porn.

And alcohol.

 

[miniMUNCH]

Having spent some time in the middle east...my opinion is that Israel is a large part of the reason we are targets of muslim terrorism and hatred.

I think in the future it would be good for the US to limit and eventually stop aid to Israel and stick to helping them on the same grounds as any other foreign country.

It is odd to me that US citizens (not all but many) wanted an increased separation of religion and state, yet the support of Israel and a somehow God mandated state continues. The entire movement to "get Israel back for Israel (those of Jewish herritage)" started out a religious fevor in both Judaism and some veins of protestant Christianity. Well, that's done...Israel has Israel and should be perfectly capable of defending it themselves by now.

I'm not jewish nor do I believe in Judaism and the same goes for a strong majority of taxpayers in the US...so why are our tax dollars going to Israel to pay for their millitary.

All that being said, Islam is not about love or peace...in my experience, Islam is about hate, domination, and suppression. My father used to be Muslim and I have significant experience with the religion and it manifestations in various forms/places. Are all muslims haters? No...I've met some fantastic people who practice a form of Islam and are peace loving. But these folks are a minority in my experience.

Also, a lot of "Muslim" people are not really muslim at all...they simply practice the letter the law to go with the flow. I don't want to go in details but if your interested there is tons of dirt on Islam: they way they treat women, militant history, Muslim fathers [in France for instance] killing their daugthers because they want to date men (of all things).

I'm out

 

[fredtam]

miniMunch although I agree with most of what you said I think you should do more research into the history of Isreal and Palestine. So should the Palestinians. We don't back them because it is the "promised land" and if we weren't actively involved let us just say there would be a lot more glass over there.

 

[0roo0roo]

course they hate us. their religious faith would have them believe that they are the true owners of civiliazation, and the success of the US just pisses all over that. it all comes down to religion. people around the world have suffered far worse without sinking as low as those in that area. a good number don't even believe they are responsible for acts of terror, always coming up with absurd conspiracy theories about the jews and cia

look put it this way. these are people who sided with hitler in ww2 and were never punished for it. thanks to their oil we blindly let them continue seeding their populations with hatred and bigortry whereas efforts were made to stamp such ideas out in europe. perhaps a little gunshy after going too far with colonialism, the powers took the opposite extreme with the inability to see right from wrong. and now after festering for 50 years... our hands off attitude to their culture has reaped these wonderful rewards

 

[fredtam]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
course they hate us. their religious faith would have them believe that they are the true owners of civiliazation, and the success of the US just pisses all over that. it all comes down to religion. people around the world have suffered far worse without sinking as low as those in that area. a good number don't even believe they are responsible for acts of terror, always coming up with absurd conspiracy theories about the jews and cia

look put it this way. these are people who sided with hitler in ww2 and were never punished for it. thanks to their oil we blindly let them continue seeding their populations with hatred and bigortry whereas efforts were made to stamp such ideas out in europe. perhaps a little gunshy after going too far with colonialism, the powers took the opposite extreme with the inability to see right from wrong. and now after festering for 50 years... our hands off attitude to their culture has reaped these wonderful rewards

Sarcasm or just out of character?

 

[Cerb]

First, this really should be in P&N. Don't mind that light bends around P&N, or those gamma jets or any of that.

1. I hope so.
1.1. Yes, and I think that's a problem. The most powerful foreign policy folks (Pres and cabinet) are elected representatively, as in our federal republic system, NOT democratically. Most US citizens even are under the false impression that we have a democracy.

2. Yeah, it's sad. If they're the chosen people, they can be w/o us. They are, however, our only real ally over there. Damned if we do, damned if we don't, in that case.
2.1. Oh, they would last. They just wouldn't have a wall built around them, or better equipment than the others.
2.2. No. News outlets and Msulims over here with the same radical ideas are to blame. We see theU.S. people supporting the destruction of U.S., but we never hear or read of the Muslim leaders who condemn the attacks, the beheadings, etc.. A goog google search or two will come up with such articles--but with all the TV and radio stations, you won't find them there. You must actively look.
2.3. We have double standards dealing with anything and anyone! Our government is a frickin' Hydra!

3. This is something many actual citizens have been against for a long time. Career politicians, by their very nature, should not be in roles of military leadership.
(break for Suite/Sister Mary)
3.1. Yup. Great world we live in.
3.2. Believe? Come on...one guy vs. committies. Not a hard decision.
3.3. I have no real backing for this, but I firmly believe China will become that enemy. I don't think we're looking for an enemy as much as the President's cabinet can only waste so much time with domestic matters before they feel the need to blow things up (by proxy).
3.4. Yes ('). This is ultimately the crux of biscuit. Isolationism is bad, but so is this new colonialism.

4. Dunno. I don't know a Muslim to ask, nor have read anything of the sort. I think too many people on both sides are just too arragant to admit their ignorance (many people wanting Bush out, no matter who else comes in, and blind GOP supporters included).
4.1. All religion rejects other religion. That's why many people, like me, have gone to not being affiliated with any of them. I think 0.1 alpha was best. Humanism. Deal with the people here and now, for the betterment of them, and don't worry about what will happen once you are gone. Even with that narrow focus, there are plenty of unknowns.

I think NSF4 might be on to something, though...

One thing otherwise not addressed is that Islam has been twisted like Christianity, into a way of dominating a populace and blinding them to any light in the world, but has done so on a fast-track, so is much more apparent to the average person. If you take away all the Dogma, for example, Christianity would be a near perfect religion, teaching good to your fellow man, helping them out, rewarding learning and experience...and not really concerning itself over things like contraceptives (and alcohol for the protestants).

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: mans
I read the other thread talking about Islam and Muslims and was astonished by the deep misunderstanding among people of the two cultures. I think Internet is an ideal tool to spread peace and respect between people living on this small planet.

Now, let me try to answer the question appearing in this thread's title:


2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

No, the terrorists are giving me that bad image.

3) The US government supports the dictatorial leadership in the Islamic world. The deal between the US and any dictator is: we give you what you need to govern your people and to stay in power and in return you give us what we need, such as cheap oil or gas, political support, and territories.

3.1) The ordinary Muslims are not part of the deal! Their governors stay in power, enjoy the life, and not give any attention to Islam. The US protects them from their people and takes whatever it wants. This situation contradicts Islam and must end. Hence, Muslims hate the US and try to force it to change this policy.

3.2) Many Muslims believe it is easier for the US to deal with a dictator instead of dealing with a country or nation. It is easier to convince one man or a small group than to convince a country that puts its people and law at the first priority.

After looking at the situation in Iraq you may be correct. The middle east does not know what to do with freedom.

3.3) Many Muslims believe that America is searching for an enemy after the collapse of Soviet Union. It found Islam as a good candidate to be its next enemy and competitor. So, for many Muslims, the war on terrorism means the war on Islam.

within the exception of the likes of Timothy Mcveigh, 99.9995% of the terrorists are muslim.

4) Many Muslims believe that Americans hate them because of their beliefs and way of life. Some Muslims think like this: if other people dislike my way of life, then they hate Islam, and this makes them my enemy! Good Muslims who fully understand Islam cannot think this way, but because of bad education and despair introduced by bad governors, many people may think this way.

There is absolutlely nothing wrong with oppressing women. And they should be stoned if they get raped because it dishonors thier family.

 

[phantom309]

They hate us because they think we're going to kill them and take their oil. It's proving very hard to convince them otherwise, considering that we are in Iraq right now killing them and giving control of their oil fields to US corporations.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Doesn't this belong in P&N?

Why is it that anytime someone posts something in Off Topic that might actually spawn a serious discussion, people yell at them to take it to P&N? This is not politics, and it's not news.

 

[cucumber]

I understand the fact that you are not blowing off a lot of crap about how evil the US is, and respect that you're trying to be objective and fair while pointing out a different point of view.

I also have to say though that much of what you said seems to be trying to justify the actions of those who use Islam as an excuse to kill and justify their hatred of western culture.

Why is it ok for muslims to view any American action as a direct aggresion to Islam itself when this is not the case? Is it ok for muslims to misinterpret ideas and actions and act in a violent way against it when the Western world has to see and respect all points of view? Why can't the muslims open their minds and learn to respect western views?

It looks to me that the militant muslims expect and demand respect from the world while not giving the same respect and tolerance to cultures that differ from theirs.

I'm not trying to dabate Iraq or Afganistan.....etc.... The hatred that many within Islam have towards the West has existed long before GW Bush and the wars he's gotten the US into.

 

[Attrox]

Originally posted by: mans
4.1) To understand how Islam looks at other religions, let me assume Religion as a manual for human beings. Judaism is version 1.0 to 1.1 of that manual. Christianity is Religion version 2.0. Islam is version 3.0 and it the last version. This means Muslims must believe in older versions, Judaism & Christianity, and they come from the same source.

:thumbsup: Good way to contradict yourself.
Isn't that just another way of saying Islam is better than other religions? It's understandable that you will hold the highest regard for your own religion but that is not an excuse to look down on others. This kind of crap is the source of most of the hatred in this world :|

I've lived most of my life as a minority in a country where the >98% are muslims and I can tell you that most (not all) of the muslims I've encountered can't tolerate difference.

 

[TheAudit]

Oh no.

 

[thirdlegstump]

um..dude, everyone hates the US. It's the current IN trend in fashion.

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: Attrox

Originally posted by: mans
4.1) To understand how Islam looks at other religions, let me assume Religion as a manual for human beings. Judaism is version 1.0 to 1.1 of that manual. Christianity is Religion version 2.0. Islam is version 3.0 and it the last version. This means Muslims must believe in older versions, Judaism & Christianity, and they come from the same source.

:thumbsup: Good way to contradict yourself.
Isn't that just another way of saying Islam is better than other religions? It's understandable that you will hold the highest regard for your own religion but that is not an excuse to look down on others. This kind of crap is the source of most of the hatred in this world :|

i think you misunderstood. i believe he's talking about version 1.0 through 3.0 in terms of chronological, not in terms of 'revised for the better'. newer not necessarily means better (hint: fusetalk ). at least this understanding is what i would agree with the OP.

I've lived most of my life as a minority in a country where the >98% are muslims and I can tell you that most (not all) of the muslims I've encountered can't tolerate difference.

you've encountered stupid muslims (yes, there are a lot of them) that are not educated correctly about their own religion.

 

[ArmchairAthlete]

2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

Yea, I mean those countless terrorist acts couldn't have anything to do with it.

 

[JDub02]

Originally posted by: EULA
Muslims don't hate america. Some people do... and some of them happen to be muslim...

the rest are french.

 

[Attrox]

Originally posted by: saxguy
i think you misunderstood. i believe he's talking about version 1.0 through 3.0 in terms of chronological, not in terms of 'revised for the better'. newer not necessarily means better (hint: fusetalk ). at least this understanding is what i would agree with the OP.

Then why is he saying that "Islam is the last religion"? There are other religions that came after Islam. I think he is saying it like Islam is the last revision which include all the patches for the earlier version.

you've encountered stupid muslims (yes, there are a lot of them) that are not educated correctly about their own religion.

That's why the U.S need to invade & "educate" them
Seriously though, I think ignorance and poverty is what driving the uneducated muslims to so much hatred.

 

[Attrox]

Originally posted by: ArmchairAthlete

2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

Yea, I mean those countless terrorist acts couldn't have anything to do with it.

LOL.
Since Israel is giving the U.S a bad image about us, why don't we bomb some places and kill some people to improve our image

 

[Doboji]

Originally posted by: mans
I read the other thread talking about Islam and Muslims and was astonished by the deep misunderstanding among people of the two cultures. I think Internet is an ideal tool to spread peace and respect between people living on this small planet.

Now, let me try to answer the question appearing in this thread's title:

1) Most of the people living in Islamic world differentiate between the US people and US government. They do hate the government for the reasons listed in number 2 and beyond below, but on the other hand, they do respect the people.

1.1) Some Muslims think US governments are democratically elected and representing their people, therefore, the people agree on whatever a government does and finance that by taxes. So, the government and the people must go in the same basket. 9/11 was committed based on this view. But when looking deeply, we can see this is almost true for US national policy, but it doesn't always ably for international policy. I think the people of the US can greatly enhance their image and bring some peace to this world if they just give little attention to what their government does outside and inject some of their values in its policy.


2) The US government supports Israel. Israel is Muslims' enemy. To them, it is an occupying power taking over their land and holy places. It has killed, arrested, and displaced millions of Palestinians and raped homes, farms, and women. They think Israeli innocent simply doesn't exist because living on the land of Palestine is a crime by itself. The people of Israel are also armed, militarily trained, and have fully supported and committed lots of crime over the history of Israel and during the recent days as well.


2.1) Many Muslims think Israel is just another state of the US. They think Israel cannot last a single day without the finical, military, and political supports it receives from the US. It also greatly influences the US' outer policy against Muslims.

2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

2.3) Muslims think that the US has double standards when dealing with the Islamic world. It works against Muslims' interests in international organizations such as the UN and force Islamic countries to do UN resolutions. On the other hand, it prevents any law or resolution contradicting with Israeli's. For example, it has used its veto right tens of times for the interest of Israel. The US government also does not even ask Israel to obey with the international law or to perform the few old UN's resolutions that had been issued against its will.


3) The US government supports the dictatorial leadership in the Islamic world. The deal between the US and any dictator is: we give you what you need to govern your people and to stay in power and in return you give us what we need, such as cheap oil or gas, political support, and territories.

3.1) The ordinary Muslims are not part of the deal! Their governors stay in power, enjoy the life, and not give any attention to Islam. The US protects them from their people and takes whatever it wants. This situation contradicts Islam and must end. Hence, Muslims hate the US and try to force it to change this policy.

3.2) Many Muslims believe it is easier for the US to deal with a dictator instead of dealing with a country or nation. It is easier to convince one man or a small group than to convince a country that puts its people and law at the first priority.

3.3) Many Muslims believe that America is searching for an enemy after the collapse of Soviet Union. It found Islam as a good candidate to be its next enemy and competitor. So, for many Muslims, the war on terrorism means the war on Islam.

3.4) After 9/11, the US government believed that Muslims' governors can protect themselves from their own people but they cannot protect the US from them! So, it asked these governors to enhance their people lives. The US did not stop at this level but went ahead and set the way to enhance their lives. This creates more enemies for the US because the way it set contradicts with what the people want!


4) Many Muslims believe that Americans hate them because of their beliefs and way of life. Some Muslims think like this: if other people dislike my way of life, then they hate Islam, and this makes them my enemy! Good Muslims who fully understand Islam cannot think this way, but because of bad education and despair introduced by bad governors, many people may think this way.

4.1) Somebody in this forum think that Islam rejects other religion. This is totally wrong! To understand how Islam looks at other religions, let me assume Religion as a manual for human beings. Judaism is version 1.0 to 1.1 of that manual. Christianity is Religion version 2.0. Islam is version 3.0 and it the last version. This means Muslims must believe in older versions, Judaism & Christianity, and they come from the same source.


At the end of this I want to say this is just a brief of the opposite view. I'm not asking you to believe it. All what I want is to fully read it and try to understand it. By doing this, we can meet in the middle and find a solution.

Sorry for my bad English.

This is a classic example of the ridiculously distorted view of the world so many muslims have. Especially your view of Israel... let's pause and review what you just said...

"They think Israeli innocent simply doesn't exist because living on the land of Palestine is a crime by itself."

Apparantly this includes young children? Secondly if the crime of Israel is existence, what can Israel do to not commit this crime, other than ceasing to exist? And how could you possibly expect Israel to meet this ridiculous request with anything other than self defense?

Lastly, you pay such close attention to the violence between Israelis and Palestinians... but you absolutely ignore the violence of Palestinians to Israelis, and more importantly you ignore the violence of Syrians to Palestinians, or Jordanians to Palestinians or Lebanese to Palestinians.

-Max

 

[ArmchairAthlete]

Originally posted by: Attrox

Originally posted by: ArmchairAthlete

2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

Yea, I mean those countless terrorist acts couldn't have anything to do with it.

LOL.
Since Israel is giving the U.S a bad image about us, why don't we bomb some places and kill some people to improve our image

You're getting the cause and effect mixed up.

Attacking us = cause
Actively fighting terror = effect

Not "we bombed them first and now they hate us so they attack us".

 

[Dedpuhl]

The world will be a safer place when peace-loving Muslims wake up and realize their religion is vile.

 

[Attrox]

Originally posted by: ArmchairAthlete

Originally posted by: Attrox

Originally posted by: ArmchairAthlete

2.2) Muslims think Israel and its lobbies inside the US are responsible for the bad image and stereotype the American have about Islam and Muslims.

Yea, I mean those countless terrorist acts couldn't have anything to do with it.

LOL.
Since Israel is giving the U.S a bad image about us, why don't we bomb some places and kill some people to improve our image

You're getting the cause and effect mixed up.

Attacking us = cause
Actively fighting terror = effect

Not "we bombed them first and now they hate us so they attack us".

I merely tried to point out that OP's 2.2 statement is stupid, I agreed with you 100%
If the muslims think that Israel are responsible for the bad image Americans have about Islam then they should do something to fix it. Hating us and attacking us will just cemented that bad image we have about them.

 

[Aimster]

The world of Muslims doesn't hate the U.S. Arabs hate the U.S because of the Israel conflict. The ones you see blowing up buildings and strapping bombs to their chest are all living around Palestine. The Arabs who live a few countries away from Palestine are not as involved. Arabs are 20-25% of the Muslim population. We don't seem to be having problems from the other 75% which are Asian, Indians, African Americans, Etc.

Peace can work. Egypt Jordan Turkey have relations with Israel while Palestine and their horrible neighbor to the east Saudi Arabia spreads their hate. Why we are friends with Saudi Arabia I will never figure out.

There are 1.3 Billion Muslims in the world. It's a big religion which is spread all over the globe with 7-8 Million of them living in the U.S.

 

[Beattie]

Originally posted by: zimu
a) why do the states hate the muslims so much (look at fretam's post)
b) you cannot call a couple of rogue terrorists muslims, nor say that they represent the virtues of the typical muslim. they represent the muslim population about 1/100th of how much the US govt represent the people.

B) Text

But you can call 93% of Muslims representative of their way of life.