why not tax net worth in addition to income?

[Attic]

:thumbsup:

This, keep the brackets (with different percentages), get rid of deductions, credits, etc. I.e you make $100,000, you owe $15K, period. You make $1M, you owe 200K, period. No games, no loopholes, no BS.

Companies would be a little harder because you have to let them deduct costs from revenue, but it seems like you could much more easily define what a cost is and what can be deducted.

I generally find this the best solution to empower people at the expense of bureacrats.

Let people spend the money on what they want/need and knock out all deductions for what government things is worthwhile or best.

Keep a progressive tax rate and add more tax brackets. Give businesses that employ many min wage workers harsher tax rates than business that employ people with liveable wages.

For personal. No tax on earnings up to poverty level, very low tax, 5%-10% up to 40k-50k. Up to 50% at excess of 10million mark and 80% at excess of 30million. Rough numbers. But we need tax brackets that exist to isolate earners higher than 250k a year so that folks earning 10million+ a year are not sharing tax rates with guys at 250k.

A lot of talk of wealth inequality has picked up since the GFC.

The wealth inequality has been growing for the past 30 years and accelerating since the Global Financial Crisis (appears due to Fed easy money benefiting those at the top with assets in equities and real estate). But something has been happening in a big way since the 70's. Now after the most recent recession the income growth numbers speak for themselves. A lot of folks never left the recession. The accumulation of wealth begets wealth in our system, this causes a fleecing of those in middle and lower classes as wealth buys production in our profit driven system. Those without wealth are left with little means to gain it and are in a perverse way servants to it.

Progressive tax rates , when done right and uncorrupted by bureaucratic inclinations (lobbyists/special interests), can even the economic playing field for a majority of folks.


Doubt very much we'll see any real tax reform for 10 years or more. There is a strong reason and resolve to where we are now.

 

[BoberFett]

Terrible idea. How about we just close the big loopholes in the tax code that we already have? No more $1 wages with $100 million stock options for CEOs that they can then place overseas and avoid taxes on. Make the punishment for not paying taxes and illegaly hiding funds in offshore accounts expatriation. Quit giving huge tax breaks to large corporations that are bringing in billions of profit per year. Quit allowing people huge rebates so they get more out of the system than they put in. No deductions for corporate jets and $50,000 parties for employees.

I think, left or right, we can all agree that tax loopholes are fucking almost everyone in this country.

To play devil's advocate...

You see a corporate jet as something that shouldn't count as a deduction? Why not? Because you personally feel it's too extravagant? Corporate officers should fly commercial if they want the deduction?

What about the company car? Should Fords and Toyota be allowable business expenses, but not Mercedes or BMW? Is a $40K Ford allowable? What about a $30K BMW?

And $50K parties are not acceptable either? So what you want is to end the practice of a company spending $50K on employee appreciation day to send 1,000 employees to the local baseball game and give them concession money. But a $49K party for the executives is OK.

You're getting down into details that make things very complicated. And where there's complexity, there's loopholes.

As someone who in the past has talked about his business experience, I'm disappointed in your overly simplistic views Apple.

 

[Slew Foot]

While I am not entirely against the idea, I feel that the implementation would be difficult and create more problems than it solves.

 

[brianmanahan]

thanks guys, very good thoughts and discussion

the %2 was just an dart at the wall, maybe it makes more sense lower or higher. plus the limit could be adjusted as needed.

 

[glenn1]

Congratulations on being a high earner. My complaint about the estate tax is for the truly wealthy who can build up portfolios into the hundred million or billion dollar range. Serious question; do you believe that your hard work entitles your descendants to a lifetime of leisure forever? I don't. I think if you've built a sizable estate, you should be able to leave a portion to your offspring or next-of-kin, but I would hope you would have also instilled in them the same drive and ambition that helped you achieve success yourself so that they can continue in that tradition and earn their own success, not simply have it handed to them through genetic lottery. Anyone who is in favor of a meritocracy (which seems like the most just system) should be in favor of an estate tax that ensures that some people aren't starting out the marathon with a 26.1 mile head start. As Warren Buffett put it, "I want to give my kids just enough so that they would feel that they could do anything, but not so much that they would feel like doing nothing."

If you want to end the "genetic lottery" then bring back child labor and force anyone old enough to hold a broom to work on the factory floor. It's not fair that middle class Atomic Playboy got to go to some fancy school and have nutritious meals when he was a teenager and didn't have to "earn his own success."

And not even Warren Buffet is stupid enough to let the government tax away his estate, regardless of how much of it he leaves to his kids.

 

[glenn1]

For personal. No tax on earnings up to poverty level, very low tax, 5%-10% up to 40k-50k. Up to 50% at excess of 10million mark and 80% at excess of 30million. Rough numbers. But we need tax brackets that exist to isolate earners higher than 250k a year so that folks earning 10million+ a year are not sharing tax rates with guys at 250k.

Why stop at 80%, for that matter why leave them any money at all? Make it 100% and watch the tax revenue roll in.

 

[soulcougher73]

Why stop at 80%, for that matter why leave them any money at all? Make it 100% and watch the tax revenue roll in.

Typical shill response.

 

[Newell Steamer]

I am all for taxation - but, not on what you already have (net worth).

If I earn $10 million a year, yes - tax the shit out of that. But, if I have the remainder of what I earned,.. leave it alone.

Net worth is done and dusted. I don't think anyone would even want to go after that. And, if they do, they are wrong in their thinking.

 

[nehalem256]

If I give my daughter $20 should the government get a cut?
What about $100?
$1M?

At what point should you get a cut? It is my money, and if I leave it to someone in death it is now their money. I transferred ownership. I didn't sell it to them; it isn't income. It is now just theirs, same as if I gave her a necklace or a painting off the wall.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gift_tax_in_the_United_States

 

[bshole]

Fucking Reagan and his trickle down economics. The biggest lie ever sold.

 

[child of wonder]

How about the government doesn't spend what it doesn't have, uses our money responsibly, and pays down the national debt? Then lower everyone's taxes rather than finding new ones to enact?

 

[nehalem256]

How about the government doesn't spend what it doesn't have, uses our money responsibly, and pays down the national debt? Then lower everyone's taxes rather than finding new ones to enact?

How about the government hand out unicorns to everyone?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

many people think that rich people dont pay enough in taxes. a lot of this comes from the fact that their net worth is much higher than their income. one solution to this would be to start taxing peoples net worth as well as their income. say, %2 of net worth each year. it would be great for the deficit.

So basically, people that are responsible and have a saving's account should pay taxes on their savings too? Yeah go fuck yourself OP.

You must be a scumbag living paycheck to paycheck wondering? WHY CAN'T I SAVE?! DUR HUR?! All the while can't balance a check-book to save your life.

 

[OverVolt]

To answer the OP directly, its because people already don't save enough money. Don't be jelly someone actually saved enough money to make a return on it in the stock market. There is risk involved. The 1% will lose their shirt one day.

 

[nehalem256]

So basically, people that are responsible and have a saving's account should pay taxes on their savings too? Yeah go fuck yourself OP.

You must be a scumbag living paycheck to paycheck wondering? WHY CAN'T I SAVE?! DUR HUR?! All the while can't balance a check-book to save your life.

Liberalism in a nutshell. Screw people who are responsible. Reward people that make bad choices...

Does that seem like a sustainable way to run society to you?

 

[Hacp]

I am all for taxation - but, not on what you already have (net worth).

If I earn $10 million a year, yes - tax the shit out of that. But, if I have the remainder of what I earned,.. leave it alone.

Net worth is done and dusted. I don't think anyone would even want to go after that. And, if they do, they are wrong in their thinking.

So you're in favor of keeping the already wealthy up there while stamping down on the aspiring affluent? That is the worst attitude to have. Its always better to have new blood.

 

[OverVolt]

So you're in favor of keeping the already wealthy up there while stamping down on the aspiring affluent? That is the worst attitude to have. Its always better to have new blood.

So make it easier for new and small businesses to start, thats the real problem.

Do you have any idea of the kind of financing troubles small businesses are having right now? As in, they can complete a job and have to wait 6-8 months or more for the money to clear by the big banks because the big banks don't give two shits about small businesses. I know some people who run small businesses and its like eating ramen for 5 months then a $50,000 check clears for work they did last year and they are finally in the clear and have the capital to go work new jobs again. It never used to be so difficult to actually get paid for the work you already did with supplies you already paid for. Meanwhile GE has instant access to like millions of dollars on credit at 0.25% per day or whatever and its the big businesses who are putting their thumb up their arse and holding onto money owed for way too long. I guess they are hoping whomever they owe money to will go out of businesses and won't have the money to sue them.

The 1% are getting old and disconnected for a reason other than woohoo super stock market returns. The stock market has always been around and wasn't causing wealth inequality like this for decades so its not the direct fault of the stock market.