why shouldnt microhousing be allowed

[Newell Steamer]

,.. don't these people come from a place where there are tons of empty cities??

 

[poofyhairguy]

There's so much fucking unused land in the US, hell there's unused CITIES.

But sure, let's build up (or rather in) instead.

Who is going to be this dictator that will force where people will live and what parts of the nation will be developed? You?

 

[mnewsham]

There's so much fucking unused land in the US, hell there's unused CITIES.

But sure, let's build up (or rather in) instead.

gonna go ahead and lay fibre, gas lines, electrical, plumbing etc?

Much easier to consolidate your resources in smaller areas, cheaper to build infrastructure.

 

[Phoenix86]

Who is going to be this dictator that will force where people will live and what parts of the nation will be developed? You?

Dictator? Please. City zoning laws already dictate who can live where. The whole point of this thread is basically "should city zoning laws allow/encourage micro-housing".

Don't allow high density residential zoning and guess what happens? They build additional housing elsewhere. People move to more affordable housing (which also has to be encouraged).

Federal government can encourage larger scale changes.

 

[nageov3t]

tax breaks for companies encouraging telecommuting, imho.

I'm sure there are tons of people who'd happily move out to the middle of nowhere if it didn't mean giving up their big city jobs/paychecks.

 

[Phoenix86]

gonna go ahead and lay fibre, gas lines, electrical, plumbing etc?

Much easier to consolidate your resources in smaller areas, cheaper to build infrastructure.

Small towns aren't viable? Suburban cities aren't viable?

When you look at mega cities, they built up because of lack of space, not because it was efficient to deliver city services.

Currently I live out in the sticks, but near Dallas/Fort Worth. I have equivalent services as when I live in the suburbs or just outside of downtown. They actually had fiber (u-verse) here about a month before the suburbs...

 

[Broheim]

Actually, probably not. In the scenario laid out, I'd "splurge" and spend a little more to get a bigger place. Not $3000, but more than that 240 sq. ft. apt.

my apartment is 350 sq. ft. and that's about as small as I'd go, unless it was really well designed.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Dictator? Please. City zoning laws already dictate who can live where. The whole point of this thread is basically "should city zoning laws allow/encourage micro-housing".

That is not what I got out of it.

There is certainly a stigma associated with small housing in America. I took this thread as "maybe we should be more accepting of alternative housing in America."

The zoning part is the last step that follows after the stigma is gone....

 

[Phoenix86]

That is not what I got out of it.

There is certainly a stigma associated with small housing in America. I took this thread as "maybe we should be more accepting of alternative housing in America."

The zoning part is the last step that follows after the stigma is gone....

There's likely a stigma, sure. That doesn't mean opposing micro housing means someone is a dictator though, right? At least you didn't call me Hitler.

The point is, zoning is the goal and that's controlled by existing government. Even if micro housing is accepted, if it isn't zoned what's the point? There are plenty of things that are accepted by society, yet illegal by law.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

. Even if micro housing is accepted, if it isn't zoned what's the point? There are plenty of things that are accepted by society, yet illegal by law.

winner winner chicken dinner

Zoning in metro areas scales vertically not horizontally

 

[poofyhairguy]

There's likely a stigma, sure. That doesn't mean opposing micro housing means someone is a dictator though, right? At least you didn't call me Hitler.

I would never stoop so low! Godwin's is my most sacred law...

The point is, zoning is the goal and that's controlled by existing government. Even if micro housing is accepted, if it isn't zoned what's the point? There are plenty of things that are accepted by society, yet illegal by law.

Good point.

 

[ElFenix]

probably because there's a bunch of laws that were set up to discourage similarly small housing at the turn of the last century after there had been issues with fires/sanitation/squalor etc when people did use to live in tiny apartments with shared bathrooms.

 

[Red Squirrel]

That's retarded so you think only rich people should be allowed to live in the city? If average people want to live there, and it turns out these allow them to, then why the hell should they not be allowed too? If I lived in a big city and this was an option I'd consider it.

Though I don't like big cities so I'll stick to my smaller city where it takes me 5 minutes to get to work and houses cost 100's of thousands, not 10's of millions. Heck if I was not tied to a job I'd consider moving into a even smaller town where I can get a bigger land and house for less than 100k.

 

[BladeVenom]

They need to escape from NY. At $9 a night, two or three people could get a decent small apartment in a more civilized city.

 

[pete6032]

That's retarded so you think only rich people should be allowed to live in the city? If average people want to live there, and it turns out these allow them to, then why the hell should they not be allowed too? If I lived in a big city and this was an option I'd consider it.

Though I don't like big cities so I'll stick to my smaller city where it takes me 5 minutes to get to work and houses cost 100's of thousands, not 10's of millions. Heck if I was not tied to a job I'd consider moving into a even smaller town where I can get a bigger land and house for less than 100k.

I didn't realize that my only options were to pay hundreds of thousands or tens of millions.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I didn't realize that my only options were to pay hundreds of thousands or tends of millions.

It was just an example. Big cities like Toronto and NY houses are in the millions, smaller cities they're typically in the 100-200k range. What I'm trying to say is, if these micro houses make it possible for someone to buy a house without paying millions in a big city, then why the hell not, I think it's a great idea. If I was stuck in a big city I would rather live in a tiny house like that and be able to walk to work than to have to live far away and spend 2 hours in a car both ways.

 

[slackerinabox]

They need to escape from NY. At $9 a night, two or three people could get a decent small apartment in a more civilized city.

Are you implying that NYC isn't civilized? Fuck you!

 

[IAteYourMother]

Small towns aren't viable? Suburban cities aren't viable?

When you look at mega cities, they built up because of lack of space, not because it was efficient to deliver city services.

Currently I live out in the sticks, but near Dallas/Fort Worth. I have equivalent services as when I live in the suburbs or just outside of downtown. They actually had fiber (u-verse) here about a month before the suburbs...

To be honest, surburban housing shouldn't be viable except that it's heavily subsidized by the expensive federal highway system.

 

[JamesV]

When I was younger, I always opted for the low rent small efficiency apartments, even though the savings was not proportional to the size difference.

That extra $100 a month I saved by not having a bedroom was fine for a single guy living alone.

Then, many of these places started having those of us in smaller apartments subsidizing the larger apartment renters, which aggravated the hell out of me.

Water bills were first; instead of charging for what you used, you paid a set amount each month... the people with 3 bedrooms and 5 people living there paid exactly the same amount for water that I did as a single guy that rarely ever was home. When your building has 10 efficiency apartments compared to 100 1-3 bedrooms, you don't find many people willing to take your side.

Then it was parking. Instead of allowing me to rent a space, I had to rent a package along with the apartment... that other people used to park in since I only had one car.

Can't help it, but it makes me grin hearing that people in large apartments might have to pay more next to micro housing.

 

[poofyhairguy]

To be honest, surburban housing shouldn't be viable except that it's heavily subsidized by the expensive federal highway system.

I don't drive on a single interstate and I pay a ton of tolls for my daily suburban commute. Your generalization is inaccurate.

 

[IAteYourMother]

I don't drive on a single interstate and I pay a ton of tolls for my daily suburban commute. Your generalization is inaccurate.

It's not just about your commute, it's how goods are transported to sustain suburban communities.

 

[halik]

Honestly, give me a 250Sqft. apartment with a good convertible storage/bed/kitchen type area and i'm good. Problem is the only places to get a place like that seem to be new york, hong kong, tokyo, and similarly massively expensive areas. So that even your 250sqft apartment can be $750-1000+ rent.

I would like to a developer actually start making 200-400 sqft apartments from scratch built from the ground up to be that size.

They have those in manhattan, 600-800 bucks a month. Kinda of neat:
http://ny.curbed.com/tags/micro-apartments

 

[poofyhairguy]

It's not just about your commute, it's how goods are transported to sustain suburban communities.

Isn't that same federal highway system used to transport goods to the cities as well?

I fail to see the distinction you are trying to make.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Isn't that same federal highway system used to transport goods to the cities as well?

I fail to see the distinction you are trying to make.

Large urban center will generally have ports or major distribution centers. And obviously they will have a far higher population density which makes such distribution easier versus surburban areas spread out over much larger distances. The general concept is pretty apparent.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Large urban center will generally have ports or major distribution centers.

In many cases these "distribution centers" (aka warehouses) are based in the suburbs of an urban area and not the main city because land in the main city has a premium associated with it.

And obviously they will have a far higher population density which makes such distribution easier versus surburban areas spread out over much larger distances. The general concept is pretty apparent.

Sure higher population density means that a single store is serving a larger customer base, but the inverse is not unique to suburbs. Smaller towns and rural communities benefit in the same manner. Not everyone can live in a city.