Why so angry, android fans?

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CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,195
856
126
When the 2012 iPhone 5 has more usable RAM for Safari than the brand new iPhone 6 it is pretty horrible.

I don't mind if Apple doesn't want to provide "Android" or "Windows"-level hardware value in their products. I DO mind if they have products that go BACKWARDS.

I mean, iOS 7 runs better on a iPad 2 than a iPad 3. Why? Because just like the iPhone 6 and RAM the iPad 3 went BACKWARDS on GPU power per pixel.

Apple could have given us an across the board upgrade for the iPhone 6 like they did with the iPhone 5 but they didn't. Its obvious that the 6 is a good enough effort, and the 6S will be what the 6 should have been. Android doesn't matter in this conversation. Android existing or not doesn't make Safari have more RAM or make that iPad 3 run smoother.

It doesn't matter if Android phones have 2GB or 10GB of RAM, what matters is the iPhone 6 is a freaking step backwards from the iPhone 5 if you are someone like my wife who loads up Safari with a ton of tabs. What matters is that Apple has had TWO FREAKING YEARS to nail the phablet form factor (as it has been obvious that is the direction to go since 2012), and we end up with a product that bends in half.

Android doesn't matter. What matters is Apple not putting out quality products.

You do know what the "S" means, right? People have to want/need the performance improvements of the S. To expect everything across the board is to expect them to shoot themselves in the foot with the next version. The 6S will be too fast, too expensive, and will wipe out any battery life gains if they threw everything in this generation and had a higher bar to set with the S. Apple is treading that line EXACTLY as you should expect them to.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,129
1,604
126
Hatred of apple is not just limmited in scope to team Android. The vitriol against the evil of apple goes back much, much farther. Also, it is all based on rational, logical argument. These Android boys have hajacked the hate train and in their attempt to overtake, have derailed.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
You do know what the "S" means, right? People have to want/need the performance improvements of the S. To expect everything across the board is to expect them to shoot themselves in the foot with the next version. The 6S will be too fast, too expensive, and will wipe out any battery life gains if they threw everything in this generation and had a higher bar to set with the S. Appl is treading that line EXACTLY as you should expect them to.

Apple didn't cripple the iPhone 5 just to make the 5S sell better. The 5 had enough RAM, had a good enough camera, and didn't have any major flaws.

I get your point, and its infuriating because in my nuclear family alone there will be four or five iPhone six's that will run iOS 11 or whatever like crap because of not having enough RAM. They didn't gimp the 5, they could have released a better 6- especially when honestly the 5S cycle SHOULD have been when they went larger.

What Apple needs to do is provide real innovations and give good reasons for people to want the 6s, and not just coast on what by then will be a four year old dream to have an iOS phablet that doesn't suck.
 
Mar 15, 2003
12,669
103
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Apple didn't cripple the iPhone 5 just to make the 5S sell better. The 5 had enough RAM, had a good enough camera, and didn't have any major flaws.

I get your point, and its infuriating because in my nuclear family alone there will be four or five iPhone six's that will run iOS 11 or whatever like crap because of not having enough RAM. They didn't gimp the 5, they could have released a better 6- especially when honestly the 5S cycle SHOULD have been when they went larger.

What Apple needs to do is provide real innovations and give good reasons for people to want the 6s, and not just coast on what by then will be a four year old dream to have an iOS phablet that doesn't suck.

Sheesh, I've never once thought "I need more ram!" when using my iphone. Storage overpriced? Yes, 32gb really should be a minimum since they'll never have expandable storage.. but ram?
 

Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,234
136
Sheesh, I've never once thought "I need more ram!" when using my iphone. Storage overpriced? Yes, 32gb really should be a minimum since they'll never have expandable storage.. but ram?

I do not understand this. Limited RAM is a constant problem for me on my iPad mini 2 (Retina), iPhone 5s, and iPhone 6 Plus. I cringe whenever I'm forced to multi-task because I know I'm likely to lose something if it reloads.

I absolutely could not believe it when I heard that the iPhone 6 would have only 1GB. Sure enough, I have lots of issues with the new phone that are directly attributable to limited RAM.

The way I use Safari / Facebook / etc, the experience is SIGNIFICANTLY better on iPhone 5 / 5c.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
I do not understand this. Limited RAM is a constant problem for me on my iPad mini 2 (Retina), iPhone 5s, and iPhone 6 Plus. I cringe whenever I'm forced to multi-task because I know I'm likely to lose something if it reloads.

I absolutely could not believe it when I heard that the iPhone 6 would have only 1GB. Sure enough, I have lots of issues with the new phone that are directly attributable to limited RAM.

The way I use Safari / Facebook / etc, the experience is SIGNIFICANTLY better on iPhone 5 / 5c.

I have never had a single issue where it would have been solved by having more RAM on any iPhone I've used. The reloading of Safari pages isn't due to RAM, but how Safari handles tabs. If you don't have a data connection and you switch tabs, it fails. I believe you can turn this off, but I have no reason to. I am not saying you don't have RAM issues, but if you believe you're in the majority in your usage, you're wrong.
 

Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,592
7,673
136
Apple Vs. Android
Intel Vs. AMD
nVidia vs. ATI
Canon vs Nikon
Ford vs. Chevy
DougP vs. anyone that isn't a Spurs fan
Amdzen vs. anyone that isn't a Broncos fan

People turn into mouth foaming, keyboard banging morons when you insult their beloved *insert team/brand/company of choice here*.

VHS vs Beta (Beta is/was better)
Amiga vs PC (Amiga > all)
Wiping forward vs Wiping backwards
 

AznAnarchy99

Lifer
Dec 6, 2004
14,705
117
106
I do not understand this. Limited RAM is a constant problem for me on my iPad mini 2 (Retina), iPhone 5s, and iPhone 6 Plus. I cringe whenever I'm forced to multi-task because I know I'm likely to lose something if it reloads.

I absolutely could not believe it when I heard that the iPhone 6 would have only 1GB. Sure enough, I have lots of issues with the new phone that are directly attributable to limited RAM.

The way I use Safari / Facebook / etc, the experience is SIGNIFICANTLY better on iPhone 5 / 5c.

If it has been I haven't noticed it.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
I have never had a single issue where it would have been solved by having more RAM on any iPhone I've used.

You are just making excuses for them now.

Look, the point isn't that some direct task is held back. The point is that the 2014 iPhone 6 has less usable RAM with Apple applications than the 2012 iPhone 5. I don't care if "the average person can't tell" or that "you don't need it anyway."

I care that a flagship product and probably the top selling computer of the year is a step BACK from a TWO YEAR OLD MODEL.

If people want to justify that to feel better about their iPhone 6 then more power to them. I just can't WAIT until people bitch that the iPhone 6 and 6+ doesn't run iOS 11 well because I am going to go on a "I TOLD YOU SO" rant like this forum has never seen.
 

NoStateofMind

Diamond Member
Oct 14, 2005
9,711
6
76
You are just making excuses for them now.

Look, the point isn't that some direct task is held back. The point is that the 2014 iPhone 6 has less usable RAM with Apple applications than the 2012 iPhone 5. I don't care if "the average person can't tell" or that "you don't need it anyway."

I care that a flagship product and probably the top selling computer of the year is a step BACK from a TWO YEAR OLD MODEL.

If people want to justify that to feel better about their iPhone 6 then more power to them. I just can't WAIT until people bitch that the iPhone 6 and 6+ doesn't run iOS 11 well because I am going to go on a "I TOLD YOU SO" rant like this forum has never seen.

Looks like you want the specs more than the functionality. Go android then. They'll throw you all the fancy bells and whistles you apparently can't live without. Take your iphone back, sell it or for the love of god GET OVER IT.

EDIT: iOS 11? GTFO! Thats what? 3yrs away? smmfh
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
You are just making excuses for them now.

Look, the point isn't that some direct task is held back. The point is that the 2014 iPhone 6 has less usable RAM with Apple applications than the 2012 iPhone 5. I don't care if "the average person can't tell" or that "you don't need it anyway."

I care that a flagship product and probably the top selling computer of the year is a step BACK from a TWO YEAR OLD MODEL.

If people want to justify that to feel better about their iPhone 6 then more power to them. I just can't WAIT until people bitch that the iPhone 6 and 6+ doesn't run iOS 11 well because I am going to go on a "I TOLD YOU SO" rant like this forum has never seen.

What does more usable RAM even mean? Are you complaining that other applications are using more RAM than in previous iterations of the iOS? Is that what you're getting at? It is ideal for something to use as much RAM as available and then free up RAM for other things than to be sitting around with a bunch of unused RAM. It makes absolutely zero sense. Especially, when there are no problems with how the iPhone is using it's RAM. My iPhone 6 is faster than my iPhone 5, which was faster than my iPhone 4.
 

NoStateofMind

Diamond Member
Oct 14, 2005
9,711
6
76
what does more usable ram even mean? Are you complaining that other applications are using more ram than in previous iterations of the ios? Is that what you're getting at? It is ideal for something to use as much ram as available and then free up ram for other things than to be sitting around with a bunch of unused ram. It makes absolutely zero sense. Especially, when there are no problems with how the iphone is using it's ram. My iphone 6 is faster than my iphone 5, which was faster than my iphone 4.

in response

"OMGZ Y U NO 2GB!!11!"
 
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Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,234
136
What does more usable RAM even mean? Are you complaining that other applications are using more RAM than in previous iterations of the iOS? Is that what you're getting at? It is ideal for something to use as much RAM as available and then free up RAM for other things than to be sitting around with a bunch of unused RAM. It makes absolutely zero sense. Especially, when there are no problems with how the iPhone is using it's RAM. My iPhone 6 is faster than my iPhone 5, which was faster than my iPhone 4.

Helloooo? It's well known that it uses more RAM with different code loaded simultaneously to support both 32-bit and 64-bit binaries.

An iPhone 5 (A6) or iPhone 5c (A6) has more usable RAM than iPhone 5s (A7), iPhone 6 (A8), iPhone 6 Plus (A8), iPad Air (A7), and iPad mini 2 (Retina, A7).

That's a fact. I can tell the difference when I use it. For my particular usage, iPhone 5 / 5c is waaaay better. The only way to resolve this is more RAM.

Memory capacity is impacting iOS devices noticeably. People who feel that it's not haven't experienced enough iOS devices to speak on the issue.
 
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poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
What does more usable RAM even mean?

That the 32 bit apps on the iPhone 5 don't hit the RAM ceiling as quickly as the 64 bit apps on the 5s and 6. Anand very clearly laid this out last year, and said that Apple would need to put 1.25GB of RAM in their 64bit devices to equal what the 32bit devices have.

Now here we are two years and two cycles later and they STILL haven't covered this difference. Every new iPhone basically has 768MB of RAM, not 1GB, when you count the 64 bit overhead.

But hey, its BIGGER! That has to be enough? Right?
 
Mar 15, 2003
12,669
103
106
I do not understand this. Limited RAM is a constant problem for me on my iPad mini 2 (Retina), iPhone 5s, and iPhone 6 Plus. I cringe whenever I'm forced to multi-task because I know I'm likely to lose something if it reloads.

I absolutely could not believe it when I heard that the iPhone 6 would have only 1GB. Sure enough, I have lots of issues with the new phone that are directly attributable to limited RAM.

The way I use Safari / Facebook / etc, the experience is SIGNIFICANTLY better on iPhone 5 / 5c.

Meh, I don't understand having dozens of tabs open on a 4.7" screen. I don't find maintaining 3 or 4 tabs a setback at all, and it's simply never been a problem for me. My iPad 2 does choke sometimes, but I suspect it's the dated cpu running ios 7 more than anything. Sure, more ram would be nice in general. More of anything would be nice. More nachos! But my iPhone 6 has been buzzing along smoother than any phone i've ever had (from android to windows phone 7.5), I just can't complain and especially don't think it's the holocaust you're making it out to be. Feels a bit entitled. don't like it? go get a droid, they probably come free in cereal boxes these days!
 
Mar 15, 2003
12,669
103
106
You are just making excuses for them now.

Look, the point isn't that some direct task is held back. The point is that the 2014 iPhone 6 has less usable RAM with Apple applications than the 2012 iPhone 5. I don't care if "the average person can't tell" or that "you don't need it anyway."

I care that a flagship product and probably the top selling computer of the year is a step BACK from a TWO YEAR OLD MODEL.

If people want to justify that to feel better about their iPhone 6 then more power to them. I just can't WAIT until people bitch that the iPhone 6 and 6+ doesn't run iOS 11 well because I am going to go on a "I TOLD YOU SO" rant like this forum has never seen.

They're very smart and consistent with upgrade cadence. The 6 will be locked out of upgrades when the 8 comes out. At that point I'll use my iPhone 6's excellent trade in value to get a shiny new 8, for 2 more solid years of relatively worry free performance. Heck, if t-Mobile's jump is still around (costs me only $2 more than standard insurance) I'll just get the 6s, then 7, then 7s,.. etc, so I personally never plan on worrying about some artificial ram ceiling concern.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
so I personally never plan on worrying about some artificial ram ceiling concern.

That is quite an assumption you are making there.

Customers that bought an iPad 3 in September 2012 didn't benefit from Apple's "smart and consistent" cadence on upgrades. Nope, exactly a year later in September 2013 when iOS7 was released their then one year old tablets basically turned to junk overnight.

You HOPE that Apple doesn't screw you within the 2 year period, just like I HOPED they would put 2GB of RAM in their devices. Point is, no one knows.

Actually it makes sense for Apple to release an update in about 18 months that makes iPhone sixes lag so all those people who waited for a large screen iPhone have to turn around and buy the S model. Otherwise the S will have mediocre sales as much of the big screen demand will get satisfied this cycle.
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
29,699
43,965
136
The new samsung note commercials are as annoying as those old pc vs mac commercials
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,235
117
116
The new samsung note commercials are as annoying as those old pc vs mac commercials

Ugh, yeah, freaking hate those stupid commercials. They seem to be on a lot too.

KT
 

Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,234
136
They're very smart and consistent with upgrade cadence.
Oh really? I'd argue that Apple is anything but consistent. It seems Apple takes delight in naming confusion.

iPhone / Phone 3G - 128MB?
iPhone 3GS - 256MB?
iPhone 4 / 4S - 512MB
iPhone 5 / 5s - 1GB
iPhone 6/Plus - 1GB

Some A4 devices had only 256MB RAM and never got iOS 7.

The naming is the least consistent thing of all. Due to iPod naming conventions, the iPhone 3G seemed like it must have been the third iPhone. People retconned the original iPhone as "iPhone 2G." People thought the iPhone 4 was a 4G phone (lots of major accessory makers referred to it as "iPhone 4G"). The 3GS counted as the iPhone 3, but the 4S and 5s didn't count as iterations (even though the processors and OSes iterated). So iPhone 4 with A4 and iOS4 was the last time everything was in-sync.

Notice how the "S" was upper-case with the 3GS and the 4S...then Apple started using lowercase for the 5s and the 5c. I feel sorry for accessory manufacturers. A huge rack at AT&T with multiple different brands didn't say "iPhone" or "6" anywhere on the packages. So many of them thought the iPhone 5 would be called "the new iPhone," I still see it printed on the packages. I saw an Incipio rack at Walmart where multiple units of the same product have different printing on the packages for their iPhone 6 cases. Some said "iPhone 6." Others said "The New iPhone" (?!). Others said "The New iPhone 2014 (4.7")."

iPad naming is all screwed up too.

  • iPad
  • iPad 2
  • The New iPad / iPad with Retina Display
  • iPad 4th generation
  • iPad Air

The latest iPad and the latest iPhone typically have equal RAM capacity, but that hasn't always been the case. The first iPad came out with an A4 processor and only 256MB RAM several months before the iPhone 4 was released with A4 + 512MB RAM. The iPod touch 4th gen had only 256MB. Apple eventually tightened their product release cycles, another inconsistency that pissed-off many people who purchased The-New-iPad/iPad-with-Retina-Display/iPad-3.

iPad mini skipped from A5 to A7.

A4 - 256MB
  • iPad
  • iPod touch 4th gen
    (and these guys can't run iOS7)


A4 - 512 MB
  • iPhone 4

A5 - 512MB
  • iPhone 4s
  • iPad 2
  • iPad mini
  • iPod touch 5th gen

A5X - 1GB
  • The New iPad (third gen, Retina)

A6 - 1GB
  • iPhone 5
  • iPhone 5c
  • iPad 4th generation (A6X, Lightning)

A7 - 1GB
  • iPhone 5s
  • iPad Air (fifth gen)
  • iPad mini (second gen, Retina)

I don't want to try to fit-in the A4/A5(single-core) Apple TVs. No clue about their memory capacity, but it's not standard iOS anyway, so there's no sense comparing them.
 

Crono

Lifer
Aug 8, 2001
23,720
1,501
136
Hey, now, Apple has a very good reason for keeping the memory low. They need to keep costs low, so that that money can go to good use elsewhere...

... to pad their pockets and keep shareholders happy. But most users actually don't notice the difference and don't heavily multitask, so it's not really hurting all that much. And those that do are probably happier when they switch to Android.
 
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CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,195
856
126
Meh, I don't understand having dozens of tabs open on a 4.7" screen. I don't find maintaining 3 or 4 tabs a setback at all, and it's simply never been a problem for me. My iPad 2 does choke sometimes, but I suspect it's the dated cpu running ios 7 more than anything. Sure, more ram would be nice in general. More of anything would be nice. More nachos! But my iPhone 6 has been buzzing along smoother than any phone i've ever had (from android to windows phone 7.5), I just can't complain and especially don't think it's the holocaust you're making it out to be. Feels a bit entitled. don't like it? go get a droid, they probably come free in cereal boxes these days!


Did someone mention nachos and iPad in the same post?! You forgot the Jalapeños!
http://youtu.be/EEs7Bu9c2GI
 
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