Why would anyone buy a card besides 4200, 9800 pro or X800 pro?

[Shamrock]

LOL :beer:

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: fsstrike
wah wah wah wah!
wah wah wah.
wah wah!
wah wah wah! wah wah!!
wah wah wah!!
wah!!

Here's a bottle - now go to sleep, Junior, it's past your bedtime.

- M4H

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: shady06
i really dont understand the argument about R420 being old tech.

i mean really, who cares? if it is able to compete with NV40 i dont understand why its such a big deal

also, when the 9800 pro was killing the 5900 is PS2.0 nvidia fanbois were crying out "who cares, there are so few PS2.0 games"
now NV40 has PS3.0 with absolutely no PS3.0 games available and the same fanbois are saying " who cares about R420 and their old tech, we want NV40 and its PS3.0 support" although there are absolutely no PS3.0 games

Yes there are no PS3.0 games right now but what you seem to forget is that PS2.0 games can be patched to PS3.0 and that will happen much sooner than PS3.0 games will become available!

 

[Ackmed]

ATi's adaptive trilinear filtering isnt a cheat to me. It does not degrade IQ, and if people actually read ATi's chat script, or some of the devs opinions on it, they would probably think the same.

There is no denying the 6800 GT is a good card. Some things wont be played out for some time. Will PS 3.0 really give it a boost, and if so, how much? Will it keep the trend of performing better in OpenGL games when Doom3 hits, and if so, by how much? Will the X800 Pro be faster in HL2, and if so, by how much? Will 3Dc look noticably better in HL2 with the X800 Pro, and if so, how much of a hit on performance will it take? The simple fact to me is, that in todays games, they are pretty much even, with the slight edge to the 6800 GT. IF they can keep their performace gains in the new drivers, and squash the bugs it will be a huge hit.

We wont know fully till Fall or so, when the other things play out. But you really cant go wrong with either card, except only one of them is out :/ They now have beta drivers for 64-bit WinXP for Ati cards, so thats going to be a non issue as well. Ive yet to see any benchmarks from either side in it though. But performance should be close, as it is now.

 

[RandomDude]

The x800 is better then the 6800 in dx9 games. Although the 6800 is better at dx7 and dx8 games i would go for the x800 cause its ati.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: fsstrike
Its obvious that you know nothing about computers, if you did you wouldnt be using the 5800. You seriously have some issues. What kind of a retard upgrades a 9700 to a 9800? Then, downgrades to a 5800? I think you need help buddy, big time. Please, find a new hobby, your just throwing money out of the window. You must be broke, I bet you drive a used KIA or something like that lol.

Just stay away from computers, you obviously have no idea what your buying. Go sign up for a sports team, you need to get outside. No wonder you need to upgrade every 10 minutes, you need to makeup for things you dont have in real life. I bet you dont have any real friends, have never had sex, and watch soft core porn every night at 2 on showcase. Then you come on anandtech, and brag about how you know nothing about computers. Spending the most doesnt mean your the best. Ever heard of a price/performance ratio?

And when I finally do get my RIG, it will look something like this:

X800 XT PE PCI-Express
A64 3400+ 939
1Gig OCZ Dual Channel 4200 Platinum

When you grow up and be a big boy like most of us here, always remember to wear 2 profalactic devices. We can't have you reproducing now can we.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: fsstrike
Its obvious that you know nothing about computers,

This is great. You are like a monkey in a cage. I make make a face at you, you start jumping up and down beating your head against the bars, frothing at the mouth!
No, I know nothing about teh computers! LOL. I've been a computer gamer since 1987. I've made my living in IS/IT since 1997. No matter what you do Big Chief, you can't say that I know nothing of computers.

if you did you wouldnt be using the 5800.

So the video card you have determines what you know about computers? LOL- I must be a GENIOUS compared to you then! Anybody here that would rather have fsstrikes P4 1.5/GF3 than my A64 3K/5800U? LOL if you and I were gaming online I would rain death on you like the marines on Bagdad.

You seriously have some issues. What kind of a retard upgrades a 9700 to a 9800? Then, downgrades to a 5800? I think you need help buddy, big time.

Actually, I went from the 9700Pro to a 5800 when they first came out, and OCd it to Ultra levels. I was bored with the 9700Pro after using it 8-9 months and wanted a change. Then I bought the 9800 Pro for $379, but traded it a few months ago to DaPunisher for his 5800U because we were both bored with our cards and wanted a switch. I even threw in a Silencer, because he seemed like a good guy.
Actually an interesting wrinkle in all this is the my four year old had a better computer than you till all this went down, and will again soon. I sold his Ti4200 in anticipation of giving him a OTES 5800, but I got trolled on it. He has a XP1700+ on a nForce 1 board, soon he'll have my 5800 U and be able to stomp you online as well!

Please, find a new hobby, your just throwing money out of the window. You must be broke, I bet you drive a used KIA or something like that lol.

You'd be wrong about that. I drive a 2002 Silverado Xcab, and a 2002 Lund Explorer SS. You could buy many Kias for the cost of my vehicles.

Just stay away from computers, you obviously have no idea what your buying.

It looks to me like I'm doing better than you, I've had over double your lowly performance for almost two years now.

Go sign up for a sports team, you need to get outside. No wonder you need to upgrade every 10 minutes, you need to makeup for things you dont have in real life. I bet you dont have any real friends, have never had sex, and watch soft core porn every night at 2 on showcase.

I play coed vball, fish bass tournaments weekly, hunt ducks weekly in season, have a degreed, professional wife and a way smart 4 year old I'm about to take out and buy some presents. Live in a nice suburb, work with good people at a good company. Hold 2 bachelors myself. How about you Big Chief?
I'm not trying to brag, but if you mouth off and call me a poor dick broke loner, I'm going to disagree.
BTW- I lived with 5 different women before my wife, and had a "few" others while dating in college. I've probably had sex you dream of. LOL

Then you come on anandtech, and brag about how you know nothing about computers. Spending the most doesnt mean your the best. Ever heard of a price/performance ratio?

Ever heard of upgrading so your rig doesn't play like a freaking slide show at 6X4?

And when I finally do get my RIG, it will look something like this:

X800 XT PE PCI-Express
A64 3400+ 939
1Gig OCZ Dual Channel 4200 Platinum

Sounds like that guy from "Of Mice and Men"- "We'll raise the rabbits an' pet'em an' live off the fat of the land!"
Sure you will Big Chief.

 

[fsstrike]

DaPunisher ripped you off so badely, but you probably had no idea. How can you get bored of a video card? You got bored of the good performance, so one day you said to yourself "I want a 5800, I want less FPS! YAY". I dont even have to say anything else, you really, dont know anything.

Have you ever heard of the book 1984 and the concept of "doublethink"? "Doublethink" is the means the Party uses to allow its people to accept contradictory ideas. Of course, the term "doublethink" implies some sophisticated form of thought, but in reality, it banishes the rules of logic and basic thinking altogether. Critical thinkers have a hard time dissmising "Double Think", and the idiots do not. You say the GeForce is better, yet evidence right here on Anandtech proves otherwise.

 

[Gurck]

You talking about critical thinking is the funniest thing I've read all day Thanks for the laugh kid.

 

[jhurst]

Originally posted by: Shamrock

If you want to flip that logic, Nvidia doesn't win any benchmarks by a discnerible difference at all.

wow this was a hard find, took all of 15 seconds on my 56k to find this one.



Scroll down to Wolf:ET

WHoa, look at that score! ATI being raped!!! Platinum Edition no less!

no AF, AA 1600x1200
ATI X800XT PE- 148.2
ATI X800 Pro - 123
6800GT - 165.2 Whoa look at that! a GT even beating ATI's very best the PE !!!
6800 Ultra - 171.1 Whoa there, did I read that right? and that's not even the 6800UE, which gets 174!
NV GFFX 5950U 124.6 WOW, amazing, a 5950 defeating an ATI X800 Pro? :shocked:


4xAA8xAF 1600x1200
ATI X800XT PE- 85.0
ATI X800 Pro - 65.0
6800GT - 107 107! Wow, again beating not only the Pro, but the XT PE as well!
6800 Ultra - 117 WHOA, ATI again, RAPED!
6800 UE - 125.6 I just had to throw this in for kicks
GFFX 5950U - 72.3 WOW!! again, a 5950 defeating an ATI X800 PRO!

Remember, you said ANY benchmark

have a nice day

Woohoo!! The 6800 kicks ASS!! :beer: I'm gonna go buy one right now!! OH...wait a minute, I can't. Guess I'll keep on waiting.

 

[ForceCalibur]

Originally posted by: fsstrike
Its obvious that you know nothing about computers, if you did you wouldnt be using the 5800. You seriously have some issues. What kind of a retard upgrades a 9700 to a 9800? Then, downgrades to a 5800? I think you need help buddy, big time. Please, find a new hobby, your just throwing money out of the window. You must be broke, I bet you drive a used KIA or something like that lol.

Just stay away from computers, you obviously have no idea what your buying. Go sign up for a sports team, you need to get outside. No wonder you need to upgrade every 10 minutes, you need to makeup for things you dont have in real life. I bet you dont have any real friends, have never had sex, and watch soft core porn every night at 2 on showcase. Then you come on anandtech, and brag about how you know nothing about computers. Spending the most doesnt mean your the best. Ever heard of a price/performance ratio?

And when I finally do get my RIG, it will look something like this:

X800 XT PE PCI-Express
A64 3400+ 939
1Gig OCZ Dual Channel 4200 Platinum

Woa, Its called MONEY. Don't hate cause hes got it and spends it like he wants. People don't hate you poor ppl but dont be hatin on the rich ppl!

 

[Entity]

Well, I just got a 9800 (np) with Samsung chips rated at 350mhz for $160, so there's one reason why.

 

[ZobarStyl]

Rollo...don't sink to the kid's level, even if he were literate it wouldn't sink through his thick skull anytime this decade. Just ignore him and maybe he'll die off.

In reply to Ackmed (and this has been talked to death) after reading the dev chat I cannot see the trilinear as anything but a cheat. Instead of saying "this is why we have this feature, we wanted to do this," all we got was "we promise, it's not a cheat" and "we would have told you, some guy dropped the memo on the way to the PR department."
Truth is, ATi had in the 9xxx series undisputedly better IQ than nV, and they milked that for all it was worth starting in the 9600 and then when that went unnoticed they slipped it in here. They realized their quality AA/AF could mostly mask the lower level filtering and give them a 10-20% boost in fps, so they went against their company policy and fed us bilinear and told us to check the trilinear by using colored mipmaps, which, lo and behold, turns back on trilinear (but that won't affect benchies, no one runs colored mipmaps for fps). A cheat is something that gives you an unfair advantage, and running lower settings than the competition while telling people they are running high settings cannot be anything but a cheat. Also, the fanboys (fss) are admitting it's a cheat in droves but praising ATi for it...

However in keeping with the actual point of this thread; I had planned on a getting a 9800pro as an upgrade from my current 4200, so I agreed with the OP until he said get the x800. The 9800pro will always be a card that was worth the money but the 6800 (GT probably) will be the card that is worth me waiting on; when a new line can double the performance of the old it's always good to hold out on the price drops as long as you can, and the 4200 still runs my dual 19's just fine, so I can be patient. But (as I've said before) the 9800pro being a good card does not mean the x800 is the better choice this time, and until the benchies get re-done on working trilinear, the argument that the x800's rape/pwn/are the incarnation of our lord should not be considered sound logic. And so I'll ask again, what else about the x800 besides speed makes you guys like it so much? I'll even be nice and give you a list of topics to choose from:

Price/Perf
3DC compression
IQ
Possible Driver Maturation
Temporal AA (a 9800p feature as well, but I'll be nice)

But please, stop arguing that the x800 is faster until the real benchies are put out. Also, don't bother praising ATi (I'm looking at you FSS) for their cheat because 'you get a boost in speed'...nvidia's products are capable of the same thing...just turn off trilinear yourself instead of having it done for you automatically.

 

[GeneralGrievous]

When the "lowly" GT beats the "critically acclaimed, choice of the masses", the wonderous X800XT in 3 benchmarks (F1 Challenge, Jedi Knight and RTCW)... sorry.. poor design with lackluster engineering an overall poorly concieved product.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-15.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-30.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-28.html

And what about when the sh1tty 12 pipe ripoff X800 Pro beats Nvidia's power hungry giant? Especially in your "best game ever"? I wonder what that says currently about Nvidia's architecture.

If these magical drivers or PS3.0 features of yours come out and make the 6800 GT a better buy than the X800XT, I'll buy one, assuming it runs on my power supply. But until then to say the 6800 GT is a better product is mostly speculation based on future predictions.

 

[Gurck]

Originally posted by: GeneralGrievous
And what about when the sh1tty 12 pipe ripoff X800 Pro beats Nvidia's power hungry giant? Especially in your "best game ever"? I wonder what that says currently about Nvidia's architecture.1 Challenge, Jedi Knight and RTCW)... sorry.. poor design with lackluster engineering an overall poorly concieve

If these magical drivers or PS3.0 features of yours come out and make the 6800 GT a better buy than the X800XT, I'll buy one, assuming it runs on my power supply. But until then to say the 6800 GT is a better product is mostly speculation based on future predictions.

Speaking of magical, what spell did you cast to make the announced lowered power requirements for the 6800s disappear? If you have to bring up a point which is no longer relevant every paragraph, you can't have much of an argument.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: fsstrike
DaPunisher ripped you off so badely, but you probably had no idea. How can you get bored of a video card? You got bored of the good performance, so one day you said to yourself "I want a 5800, I want less FPS! YAY". I dont even have to say anything else, you really, dont know anything.

Have you ever heard of the book 1984 and the concept of "doublethink"? "Doublethink" is the means the Party uses to allow its people to accept contradictory ideas. Of course, the term "doublethink" implies some sophisticated form of thought, but in reality, it banishes the rules of logic and basic thinking altogether. Critical thinkers have a hard time dissmising "Double Think", and the idiots do not. You say the GeForce is better, yet evidence right here on Anandtech proves otherwise.

For a guy that "knows his computers" you sure come up lacking. I traded a card worth $175 for a card worth $175, threw in a $25 fan to deal with a person of DaPunisher's caliber. (you can't exactly go to Best Buy and get a 5800U, can you?)

It's been a long time since I read 1984, so I don't remember "doublethink". Sorry.

How's this for "Not Think" though?
Fsstrike says:

My next PC will also be top of the line, and will last me another 3 years. Someone who buys computers wisely will have something that will last them a long time.

Uh huh.
How smart is it to buy two year old technology (X800) series, for a card that will supposedly last you three years? Ever think 24 bit PS2 may not be the standard in three years, wise one?
How smart is it to use a three year old PC anyway?
From Painkiller, minimum system requirements:
P3 1.5GHz 64MB DX 8.1 GF2 GTS or better
Know what that means? Don't go buying Painkiller Big Chief.
You think you have some superior computer knowledge that somehow saves you money on parts.
I say you're just a guy that suffers through horrible performance/settings so you don't have to get a second job to buy a new pc.
GF3 in 2004 for a supposed serious gamer? Uh huh.

I guess you gave up attacking my sex life, computer, wealth, hobbies, etc. when you found out I'm living proof of why this is a great country to live in. So you change course to some pseudo-intellectual Orwellian attack.
LOL- I've been reading at an adult level since I was 8. I've probably read more than you too.

Rollo...don't sink to the kid's level, even if he were literate it wouldn't sink through his thick skull anytime this decade. Just ignore him and maybe he'll die off.

I know Zobar, but I've had many belly laughs watching him dance, and have probably taught him a lesson about shooting his mouth off to people.
I don't think "I'm da man" or anything, but it's pretty surprising to see what he has speculated about my supposed "Tobacco Row" existence.

This whole thread was worth it to read Sickbeast's

LOL Rollo called him a "Big Chief" and gave it to him like he wanted it.

last night after plenty of beer. I thought I was going to bust a gut laughing.

 

[GeneralGrievous]

Speaking of magical, what spell did you cast to make the announced lowered power requirements for the 6800s disappear?

The requirements are still higher than ATIs. And considering my PSU is only 340 watts, I don't know how well a 6800 will overclock with it.

 

[VisableAssassin]

Originally posted by: GeneralGrievous

When the "lowly" GT beats the "critically acclaimed, choice of the masses", the wonderous X800XT in 3 benchmarks (F1 Challenge, Jedi Knight and RTCW)... sorry.. poor design with lackluster engineering an overall poorly concieved product.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-15.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-30.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-28.html

And what about when the sh1tty 12 pipe ripoff X800 Pro beats Nvidia's power hungry giant? Especially in your "best game ever"? I wonder what that says currently about Nvidia's architecture.

If these magical drivers or PS3.0 features of yours come out and make the 6800 GT a better buy than the X800XT, I'll buy one, assuming it runs on my power supply. But until then to say the 6800 GT is a better product is mostly speculation based on future predictions.

if you honestly believe anything toms says....your blind man.
toms is pretty much the worst site to ever try and reference things from.
and when will you people sto useing the power supply BS as a friggin excuse? it snot 350w for the ultra card ! and you dont need both friggin plugs ! not to mention the GT is a SINGLE plug card.
for god sakes man id honestly hope you have a decent 380w supply or above. damn get a antec true power 550 they are only like 90 bucks now

 

[Gurck]

Yeah, new technology tends to consume more power But I suppose that's ATI's genius, right? They knew that PSUs would be a limiting factor! And.. and... their product is superior because it takes less power!... eh? If you get an x800 make sure to get a p3 to pair it with.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Gurck
Yeah, new technology tends to consume more power But I suppose that's ATI's genius, right? They knew that PSUs would be a limiting factor! And.. and... their product is superior because it takes less power!... eh? If you get an x800 make sure to get a p3 to pair it with.

You guys are PREJUDICED! Didn't you know in Canada they have no good psu's, so their shock that anyone would have a good psu is a cultural difference?!?!?!

 

[Edge3D]

Originally posted by: VisableAssassin

Originally posted by: GeneralGrievous

When the "lowly" GT beats the "critically acclaimed, choice of the masses", the wonderous X800XT in 3 benchmarks (F1 Challenge, Jedi Knight and RTCW)... sorry.. poor design with lackluster engineering an overall poorly concieved product.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-15.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-30.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-28.html

And what about when the sh1tty 12 pipe ripoff X800 Pro beats Nvidia's power hungry giant? Especially in your "best game ever"? I wonder what that says currently about Nvidia's architecture.

If these magical drivers or PS3.0 features of yours come out and make the 6800 GT a better buy than the X800XT, I'll buy one, assuming it runs on my power supply. But until then to say the 6800 GT is a better product is mostly speculation based on future predictions.

if you honestly believe anything toms says....your blind man.
toms is pretty much the worst site to ever try and reference things from.
and when will you people sto useing the power supply BS as a friggin excuse? it snot 350w for the ultra card ! and you dont need both friggin plugs ! not to mention the GT is a SINGLE plug card.
for god sakes man id honestly hope you have a decent 380w supply or above. damn get a antec true power 550 they are only like 90 bucks now

I was going to say the same. THG has about as much credibility as OCP. Waaayyy too many funny things going on over there for me to even waste my time and make the click over.

And now its funny that he says he only has a 340watt, so hes worried. LOL. This is like politics, no matter WHAT NV does, he is going to make it just so hard to make it a viable purchase.
Too bad no one else is buying these theories..

People that dont have a 350watt PSU DONT need to be buying a X800 or 6800. Likely such a system would be so CPU limited you'd better spend the money on a processor thats been released within the last 2 years first.
I wouldnt promise stability on even a 9800 Pro without a 350watter that didnt have a strong 12v rail.
Just because ATI doesnt officially recommend it (AFAIK) doesnt mean a 250watt will power their new cards... or even their "old" ones.

 

[VisableAssassin]

Originally posted by: Edge3D

Originally posted by: VisableAssassin

Originally posted by: GeneralGrievous

When the "lowly" GT beats the "critically acclaimed, choice of the masses", the wonderous X800XT in 3 benchmarks (F1 Challenge, Jedi Knight and RTCW)... sorry.. poor design with lackluster engineering an overall poorly concieved product.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-15.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-30.html
http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040504/ati-x800-28.html

And what about when the sh1tty 12 pipe ripoff X800 Pro beats Nvidia's power hungry giant? Especially in your "best game ever"? I wonder what that says currently about Nvidia's architecture.

If these magical drivers or PS3.0 features of yours come out and make the 6800 GT a better buy than the X800XT, I'll buy one, assuming it runs on my power supply. But until then to say the 6800 GT is a better product is mostly speculation based on future predictions.

if you honestly believe anything toms says....your blind man.
toms is pretty much the worst site to ever try and reference things from.
and when will you people sto useing the power supply BS as a friggin excuse? it snot 350w for the ultra card ! and you dont need both friggin plugs ! not to mention the GT is a SINGLE plug card.
for god sakes man id honestly hope you have a decent 380w supply or above. damn get a antec true power 550 they are only like 90 bucks now

I was going to say the same. THG has about as much credibility as OCP. Waaayyy too many funny things going on over there for me to even waste my time and make the click over.

And now its funny that he says he only has a 340watt, so hes worried. LOL. This is like politics, no matter WHAT NV does, he is going to make it just so hard to make it a viable purchase.
Too bad no one else is buying these theories..

People that dont have a 350watt PSU DONT need to be buying a X800 or 6800. Likely such a system would be so CPU limited you'd better spend the money on a processor thats been released within the last 2 years first.
I wouldnt promise stability on even a 9800 Pro without a 350watter that didnt have a strong 12v rail.
Just because ATI doesnt officially recommend it (AFAIK) doesnt mean a 250watt will power their new cards... or even their "old" ones.

OCP has alot more credability than THG man.
they are still one of the few sites Ill ever bother to listen to when they review things.
besides ive been with them since '00 so I love my old home LOL

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: GeneralGrievous

Speaking of magical, what spell did you cast to make the announced lowered power requirements for the 6800s disappear?

The requirements are still higher than ATIs. And considering my PSU is only 340 watts, I don't know how well a 6800 will overclock with it.

I dont know General, an awful lot of X800's are available right now, but I also see an awful lot of people not buying them and waiting for the 6800's. Maybe they can see something that you don't care to.

 

[SickBeast]

I have a sinking feeling that most of you guys are going to be waiting a loooooong time for the 6800 series. According to the inquirer nVidia is having major problems producing the GPUs in any sort of mass quantity.

 

[VisableAssassin]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
I have a sinking feeling that most of you guys are going to be waiting a loooooong time for the 6800 series. According to the inquirer nVidia is having major problems producing the GPUs in any sort of mass quantity.

waiting sucks but its no big deal to me my bfg 5900 with custom bios is doing fine right now
besides i havent been gaming much as of late, working too much