Wife wants to go back to Med School...having troubles with the math on this.

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mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
54
91
Med school is one of those things you don't just decide to do when you go through your mid-life crisis. Imagine how devastated you would be to your family if you made it 1,2,3 or even more years into the program and then BAILED because you can't handle it, or god forbid flunked out.

Find a passion that is reasonable, and have a backup plan if it fails.

Quitting work completely to take loans out for school is very dangerous.

Let's look at this, say I'm in job where I make $45,000.00. I want to quit my job and go to school for 4 years to be a Blabologist, where I could start at $70,000.00. Sounds nice! Here's the math.

If you keep your job:
4 years @ $45,000.00 = $180,000 in positive income


If you quit your job and take out a loan:
4 years @ $40,000 total loan = $40,000 loss

What's the difference between $180,000 and $40,000? No, it's not $140,000....it's $220,000. (Because $40,000 is NEGATIVE, below zero and $180,000 is POSITIVE, above zero the total range between these numbers is $220,000)

So say you graduate at age 40 and start your new job immediately after graduation.
Congrats! You are getting paid $70,000 a year!! AWESOME! Dream accomplished!

So now at 40, you have $40,000 in debt and you also lost $180,000 in income....but you make $25,000 more then you used to. Sounds cool...right?

Except...it would take 9 years to make up all the difference in lost income from when you quit and started school. That's NOT even taking into account owed INTEREST, which could extend that repayment for several more years!

So now you are almost 50, and you are in the job you love, and you paid off your debt.


=========================

All I'm trying to say is that...if you are wanting to pursue a career purely for the $$$$, there might be better ways to go about this. If you are pursuing a career purely for the love of the job, more power to you, just don't expect blue skies and green grass immediately after graduation.
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
Hi -
I am a wife (currently expecting our 5th child) and *I* want to go to med school. I am 34. My husband is 40.
You all made such great suggestions that I'd like your advice too.

Not to mention, I am very passionate about the particular field and already do lay-work in it.

Very hard decision but I would appreciate your thoughts.

If you're passionate, the money doesn't matter. Medicine is incredibly difficult. When my (now) wife was in medical school, I would visit her on the weekends as she was studying for exams. She was renting a house with some classmates. I would cook for her, spend time by myself on my laptop, and go to sleep with an eye cover because she would be up all night studying Friday and Saturday. Maybe going to sleep at 3 or 4 AM and getting up at 10 to study more.

If you have the drive, you can get the grades needed in a postbac to get into medical school, and you can deal with 30-40 hours of lecture a week and the studying.

As for the OP, if your wife is in medical school now, be prepared for the possibility of moving when she's done with her schooling. Then moving again 3 years after that if she goes into Emergency Medicine. EDs that need new doctors tend to be ones in the inner city where nobody wants to work a long time. The injuries are just too gruesome for most doctors to deal with long term. After paying her dues in one of those EDs, she'll be able to find another job in a quieter town with a calmer ED.

Or, maybe she'll get lucky and strike the right chord with the ED residency program in town and stay there for 3 years and keep working there afterwards. That was my wife's plan, but she decided to apply & interview to programs on the East Coast for an excuse to travel. She ended up falling in love with the family medicine program at Brown University, so I quit my job and moved across the country with her.

so... update?
 
Sep 7, 2009
12,960
3
0
Drive and passion has to be balanced with family, particularly when you have 5 kids.

We would be giving completely different advice if she was 23-24, with no or 1 kid.

But 35 and 5 kids means you're going to have make some major sacrifices.
 

Triumph

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,031
13
81
Why can't she just self teach herself some med school then take a few exams? Why not, that's how Lincoln got his law degree. Do you think your wife is better than Abraham Lincoln? Because she probably isn't!
 

Wreckem

Diamond Member
Sep 23, 2006
9,459
987
126
Suggestion to the noob who registered and posted: RN, RN to BSN degree while working as an RN. With a 2 year degree, you can be making $50k or more, depending on the area of the country you're in. Only takes a couple evenings of each week to accomplish the RN to BSN programs; mostly online; and (unlike programs such as University of Phoenix online) there are quite a few solid programs that are affordable. There are tons of scholarships/grants for going into nursing; depends on your state, area, etc.

Then, go for your master's - nurse practitioner. 2 more years of school. During which, you'll likely have to take a leave from your job to do your clinical hours (600 hours?). But, making money for those years and still having time for your children seems to be, perhaps, a bit more desirable of a solution. Nurse practitioner also seems to be an up and coming field; you can have your own practice. Not doctor's pay, but similar duties, and you're making money almost right off the bat while on track, rather than going further and further into debt. The time aspect (I think) is a hell of a lot easier to manage than becoming a doctor.

IIRC there is a push to make a doctorate required to be a nurse practitioner. Just like there is a push for nurses being required to have a BSN.
 

Triumph

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,031
13
81
IIRC there is a push to make a doctorate required to be a nurse practitioner. Just like there is a push for nurses being required to have a BSN.

And it used to be that you could be an RN with a 2 year community college degree. This push for higher education is a crock. Guess who is making money off of these requirements for higher ed?
 

BikeJunkie

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2013
1,391
0
0
So let me get this straight: your wife comes to you and says "I know we have kids and stable jobs and all that, but I want to commit ALL of us to my pipe dream and oh by the way you're on your own with the kids for AT LEAST a year while I get to play college student again. They don't need mommy anyway."

I'm not exaggerating: if my wife came to me with a proposition like that, the only thing I'd be taking into consideration is whether to divorce her right then and there. "Selfish" doesn't even begin to describe this situation. Want to be a doctor? Do that before you get married, have kids, and take on a mortgage. Once you do those other things, you're accountable to purposes far greater than yourself. Don't like your job? Wahh. Life sucks wear a helmet. Most doctors hate their jobs, too. Midlife crisis = grass is always greener on the other side.

Given that this thread is about 2 years old, has she gotten tired of med school yet and joined the NASA space program?
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
Funny this thread came up this week.

As an update to the OP, she recently accepted a position with a hospital that is associated with one of the top 5 pharmacy programs in the country. Half of her job will be academic precepting and teaching residents and pharmacy students, something she always wanted to do. The other half is pure clinical in areas that she enjoys staffing. She'll get dedicated project days to do research and publish studies, something she also never got a chance to do with her old job.

No more 2nd shifts, 3rd shifts, and only every 4th weekend instead of every 3rd.

Downside is that it's in another state so we'll be moving later this spring. We wanted to get into a larger city with more things to do and associated with a major university so it's a good change.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Suggestion to the noob who registered and posted: RN, RN to BSN degree while working as an RN. With a 2 year degree, you can be making $50k or more, depending on the area of the country you're in. Only takes a couple evenings of each week to accomplish the RN to BSN programs; mostly online; and (unlike programs such as University of Phoenix online) there are quite a few solid programs that are affordable. There are tons of scholarships/grants for going into nursing; depends on your state, area, etc.

Then, go for your master's - nurse practitioner. 2 more years of school. During which, you'll likely have to take a leave from your job to do your clinical hours (600 hours?). But, making money for those years and still having time for your children seems to be, perhaps, a bit more desirable of a solution. Nurse practitioner also seems to be an up and coming field; you can have your own practice. Not doctor's pay, but similar duties, and you're making money almost right off the bat while on track, rather than going further and further into debt. The time aspect (I think) is a hell of a lot easier to manage than becoming a doctor.

This is probably really solid advice, but five years ago when I wanted to be a doctor, I had no interest in PA or Nurse Practitioner programs. I suspect it probably has to do with most 'I want to be a doctor' dreaming at 30+ being more idealistic than practical.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Funny this thread came up this week.

As an update to the OP, she recently accepted a position with a hospital that is associated with one of the top 5 pharmacy programs in the country. Half of her job will be academic precepting and teaching residents and pharmacy students, something she always wanted to do. The other half is pure clinical in areas that she enjoys staffing. She'll get dedicated project days to do research and publish studies, something she also never got a chance to do with her old job.

No more 2nd shifts, 3rd shifts, and only every 4th weekend instead of every 3rd.

Downside is that it's in another state so we'll be moving later this spring. We wanted to get into a larger city with more things to do and associated with a major university so it's a good change.

Glad to hear. Which city?
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
Funny this thread came up this week.

As an update to the OP, she recently accepted a position with a hospital that is associated with one of the top 5 pharmacy programs in the country. Half of her job will be academic precepting and teaching residents and pharmacy students, something she always wanted to do. The other half is pure clinical in areas that she enjoys staffing. She'll get dedicated project days to do research and publish studies, something she also never got a chance to do with her old job.

No more 2nd shifts, 3rd shifts, and only every 4th weekend instead of every 3rd.

Downside is that it's in another state so we'll be moving later this spring. We wanted to get into a larger city with more things to do and associated with a major university so it's a good change.

Good for her! Hope you like the new city and that her new job is paying for relocation.
 

deadlyapp

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2004
6,609
714
126
Funny this thread came up this week.

As an update to the OP, she recently accepted a position with a hospital that is associated with one of the top 5 pharmacy programs in the country. Half of her job will be academic precepting and teaching residents and pharmacy students, something she always wanted to do. The other half is pure clinical in areas that she enjoys staffing. She'll get dedicated project days to do research and publish studies, something she also never got a chance to do with her old job.

No more 2nd shifts, 3rd shifts, and only every 4th weekend instead of every 3rd.

Downside is that it's in another state so we'll be moving later this spring. We wanted to get into a larger city with more things to do and associated with a major university so it's a good change.

Oye! Didn't you just finish your house last year?
 

Ban Bot

Senior member
Jun 1, 2010
796
1
76
Funny this thread came up this week.

As an update to the OP, she recently accepted a position with a hospital that is associated with one of the top 5 pharmacy programs in the country. Half of her job will be academic precepting and teaching residents and pharmacy students, something she always wanted to do. The other half is pure clinical in areas that she enjoys staffing. She'll get dedicated project days to do research and publish studies, something she also never got a chance to do with her old job.

No more 2nd shifts, 3rd shifts, and only every 4th weekend instead of every 3rd.

Downside is that it's in another state so we'll be moving later this spring. We wanted to get into a larger city with more things to do and associated with a major university so it's a good change.

I am happy to hear this seems to have worked itself out. I hope she enjoys the new job and that the transition is smooth for you and the kids.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
Oye! Didn't you just finish your house last year?

Finish is relative. We'll have been in it for 4 years this fall. Still an endless amount of landscaping and tidy up stuff around the yard to do. Fortunately we've got close to 100k in equity in the place that we can unlock and roll into whatever we do end up buying. Another perk is that my tax bill in IL is over $10,000. Similar house where we are moving would have a bill less than half that. So that's a plus. Between equity and taxes we'll have close to $1000 a month shaved off our mortgage. Also will have a 5 mile drive to work instead of 20.
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
1,778
126
Finish is relative. We'll have been in it for 4 years this fall. Still an endless amount of landscaping and tidy up stuff around the yard to do. Fortunately we've got close to 100k in equity in the place that we can unlock and roll into whatever we do end up buying. Another perk is that my tax bill in IL is over $10,000. Similar house where we are moving would have a bill less than half that. So that's a plus. Between equity and taxes we'll have close to $1000 a month shaved off our mortgage. Also will have a 5 mile drive to work instead of 20.
Career moves are kind of the cost of doing business if you don't want to remain stagnant.

Going back to med school this late in the game after getting a pharmacy degree is too much work for too little payout. It's good that she's getting the change she was craving and doing something different in the same field with the payout. Pharmacy school isn't cheap either, but having to do 4 years of med school + 4 years of residency with little pay should be a showstopper. I've only known a few people that have done career changes after their 30s to switch to MD. Most of them were in low paying fields and were single. Anyone else would be sacrificing too much family time that late in their lives.

You're doing the right thing by supporting her decision and packing your bags to go with her. Holding her back when she's not happy in her career and nudging her in the wrong direction could get rough.
 

MrDudeMan

Lifer
Jan 15, 2001
15,069
92
91
What a horrible idea. Sorry, but there's no way to sugarcoat it. This would be a dealbreaker for me with absolutely no wiggle room. Decide this kind of shit before you have kids and a family. If you need a change in your life, find a new hobby that requires a ton of focus and energy. Don't make everyone else pay for it.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
What a horrible idea. Sorry, but there's no way to sugarcoat it. This would be a dealbreaker for me with absolutely no wiggle room. Decide this kind of shit before you have kids and a family. If you need a change in your life, find a new hobby that requires a ton of focus and energy. Don't make everyone else pay for it.

I got fooled too. This is someone else's bump so it's not an issue. VI explains the current situation several posts back.
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
I got fooled too. This is someone else's bump so it's not an issue. VI explains the current situation several posts back.

This thread is now a test of a poster's willingness to read a long thread before submitting advice.

And for the record (not that anyone cares about my opinion) I believe GagHalfgrunt had the thread ending response on the first page: Happy wife == Happy life. These type of career changes aren't about the $, but rather it's about making sure the wife has a career she's happy with.
 

johnjohn320

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2001
7,572
2
76
I confess I didn't read all 10 pages of the thread, so apologies if this has been covered already. But in reading some of these almost angry responses about how it's such a selfish proposition, no way she should sacrifice family for her career pipe dream, etc, I have a question: would you all be responding this way if it were the man leaving the children alone with mom more for a few years in order to pursue a more prosperous career for himself and his family, rather than the woman asking her husband to sacrifice in this way? Be honest...

I did read the update, however, and am happy for vi and his family that all seems to be working out.
 
Sep 7, 2009
12,960
3
0
This thread is now a test of a poster's willingness to read a long thread before submitting advice.

And for the record (not that anyone cares about my opinion) I believe GagHalfgrunt had the thread ending response on the first page: Happy wife == Happy life. These type of career changes aren't about the $, but rather it's about making sure the wife has a career she's happy with.


That seems like an awfully selfish way to live, and basically bending over in a selfish feminist way.

In my mind you need to do what's best for the family. If the family is just husband+wife then the decisions are different than hubby wifey and rugrats.

And Happy wife=Happy life is great until you're $100k++ in debt, wife is gone for years working on a degree, and the entire family has fallen apart.


Edit:

Actually that entire mentality is just screwed.

So it's expected for the entire family to suffer for the mother, and to be open and appreciative of the mother leaving for years to work on a dead-end hobby degree.

Meanwhile the father is expected to work a slave job, happy or not, to support the mom's hobby degree just to make her happy? Oh and he also will now have to cook, clean, help with homework, while mom is dumping money into a dead end degree. And this is going to = happy life..???

At what point does someone put their foot down and say that doing this doesn't make sense?



American families have gotten so screwed up over the past 30 years. It's insane to me that people truly think this is all logical and reasonable.
 
Last edited:

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,411
10
0
I would be really scared to do ANY career in healthcare. We all know the entire industry can crash any second.

If she is already well paid and happy,what's the problem?
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
1,778
126
I would be really scared to do ANY career in healthcare. We all know the entire industry can crash any second.

If she is already well paid and happy,what's the problem?

You're way misinformed. Healthcare pays out decent dividends if you're a provider. The problem is the initial investment in time and money to get a degree and license to practice in any of the 50 states.

You can estimate $200k of college debt and 12 years from BS to MD to residency where you may make $45-50k a year + free lunch from drug reps. By the time you finish up, you've got to work in the trenches to dig out of the debt because it's impossible to go to school and work a side job. After that, however, you can guarantee $165k minimum annual salary. If you specialize, that number can grow quite a bit depending on where you are and what you do. Your ROI is a long play, but if you land a job with good benefits, you'll retire wealthy.
 
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