Will Democracy end if Republicans sweep the House & Senate?

[Zor Prime]

We've been hearing a lot about Democracy ending should Republicans sweep the House and Senate.

People here have been saying it, it's being brought up on the news, and it's all over the place now.

What do you think, yes or no?

 

[sandorski]

No. Not immediately at least.

 

[Fenixgoon]

immediately? no. biden has veto power. but it's going to be a shitshow that i think has a good chance of leading to a complete republican sweep in 24, which will be game over. the running theme for 24 would be be biden not doing anything his last 2 years in office (on account of a congress that won't do anything of course, but no one ever pays attention to that)

 

[brycejones]

We've been hearing a lot about Democracy ending should Republicans sweep the House and Senate.

People here have been saying it, it's being brought up on the news, and it's all over the place now.

What do you think, yes or no?

Nuance and context matters. Also what do you think and why?

 

[Greenman]

According to the Q guys I chat with, the republican's are going to gain a super majority in the house and senate, then reinstate Trump as the rightful president. Trump is then going to activate the military and remove every democrat from from the Federal government.
I did ask if he was going to lead the army into Washington on his tyrannosaurs rex, the question didn't go over well.

 

[gothuevos]

The governors and SoS races are what will decide our fate.

If they are allowed to circumvent the will of the people and freely send alternative electors on a whim, then yes, it is over.

To be honest, Moore vs Harper might make it a moot point. Imagine any GOP controlled state legislature deciding that it can do whatever it wants with their electoral college votes, regardless of who actually won. And it would all be legal, according to our SCOTUS.

GG

 

[MrSquished]

this video is not exaggerative. The proof is in the pudding - the GQP terrorist party - over 50% of their primary nominees are election deniers aka fascists. These people are unreachable. There is no marketplace of ideas. Recognize Nazis and realize you can't talk them out of being Nazis, you'll just end up oppressed.

 

[Drach]

According to the Q guys I chat with, the republican's are going to gain a super majority in the house and senate, then reinstate Trump as the rightful president. Trump is then going to activate the military and remove every democrat from from the Federal government.
I did ask if he was going to lead the army into Washington on his tyrannosaurs rex, the question didn't go over well.

JFC, find better friends. Thanks for the laugh.

 

[Moonbeam]

An ethical question that I think bedeviled liberals is whether you have a right of self defense against the insanity of others, and particularly as regards the concept of a just war. I think this means that democracy is always at risk because the most democratic among us are the least likely to be able to defend it. A liberal will self question if he or she is justified in using violence to protect oneself or ones family or country from the insanity of others because of the logical paradoxes introduced by the decision to believe in ones own sanity in comparison to the insanity of others. Truth is just so subjective and relative that to assume oneself to be judge jury and executioner is morally repugnant to people who reason. Fascists on the authoritarian end of the spectrum, however, do not have such problems.

This means, as far as I can see, that liberals on the non-authoritarian end of the spectrum will be too late in defending themselves from an authoritarian take over. I see that as the reason we have fascists takeovers historically. Liberals fear irrationality and also lack authoritative certainty in their moral structure. Up to 80 million died as a result of the last great fascist rise to power. I do not see anything that will prevent it happening again.

 

[Greenman]

JFC, find better friends. Thanks for the laugh.

They're actually reasonably pleasant fellows. They get worked up when I mention that anyone with a room temperature IQ wouldn't believe this lunacy for a second, but they never stay mad. They're also all established and successful businessmen.

 

[alien42]

No. Not immediately at least.

Yup, it would be a step in that direction, but require another election cycle or two.

 

[MrSquished]

They're actually reasonably pleasant fellows. They get worked up when I mention that anyone with a room temperature IQ wouldn't believe this lunacy for a second, but they never stay mad. They're also all established and successful businessmen.

There have been plenty of successful and charming Nazis/Fascists/Authoritarians/Slave-owners throughout history. That means nothing. They are still pieces of shit.

 

[nickqt]

If Republicans take both the House and Senate in 2022, it doesn't mean the end of democratic republican elections in the future, but it sure won't be a step in the right direction.

More important is Moore v. Harper. If that is decided to allow a state legislature to gerrymander as much as it wants, there's no reason for any state legislature to ever give the minority party more seats than it wants, which essentially is the end of democratic republican elections.

 

[akugami]

this video is not exaggerative. The proof is in the pudding - the GQP terrorist party - over 50% of their primary nominees are election deniers aka fascists. These people are unreachable. There is no marketplace of ideas. Recognize Nazis and realize you can't talk them out of being Nazis, you'll just end up oppressed.

And this is why I've said that we're beyond trying to come together to some sort of agreement. The GQP candidates are beyond reasoning. They have brainwashed the republican party into voting for them at all costs, even at the cost of democracy. They don't practice democracy, they practice democrazy. They will vote a woefully inadequate walking concussion specimen like Hershel Walker instead of picking a more worthy candidate, simply because they want to "own da libz". Women in the republican party are brainwashed into removing or restricting their own rights. What the hell kind of crazy is that?

And the crazy part? Many of my neighbors are Trump humpers. They're actually very nice people and will lend a hand to help their neighbors. But when it comes to politics, they're brainwashed. They can't see that it's wrong to ban books. They can't see that it's wrong to restrict the rights of minorities. They're brainwashed into voting only for their own party, to the point they vote in racists and other jackasses. They are brainwashed into actively working to dismantle social services like medicare that those less fortunate (many of them republicans) depend on to survive. I'd be laughing if it wasn't so horrifying.

 

[MrSquished]

And this is why I've said that we're beyond trying to come together to some sort of agreement. The GQP candidates are beyond reasoning. They have brainwashed the republican party into voting for them at all costs, even at the cost of democracy. They don't practice democracy, they practice democrazy. They will vote a woefully inadequate walking concussion specimen like Hershel Walker instead of picking a more worthy candidate, simply because they want to "own da libz". Women in the republican party are brainwashed into removing or restricting their own rights. What the hell kind of crazy is that?

And the crazy part? Many of my neighbors are Trump humpers. They're actually very nice people and will lend a hand to help their neighbors. But when it comes to politics, they're brainwashed. They can't see that it's wrong to ban books. They can't see that it's wrong to restrict the rights of minorities. They're brainwashed into voting only for their own party, to the point they vote in racists and other jackasses. They are brainwashed into actively working to dismantle social services like medicare that those less fortunate (many of them republicans) depend on to survive. I'd be laughing if it wasn't so horrifying.

People can be nice face to face and still be Nazis or fascists or authoritarians. I mean do we think that there were none of these fake 'nice' people in the Confederate South? Nazi Germany? Stalinist Russia? Fascist Italy?

I mean these people don't go around kicking puppies. They have pets, are in the PTA, have bake sales, coach soccer teams - they do all kinds of jobs and have businesses. Hell some are preachers (actually a lot of them). They are still ultimately soulless ghouls that would turn America into an authoritarian, racist, bigoted and horrific fascist state, just like has happened for all of human history. piece of shit, all of them. hard for some to realize but ultimately the only way to understand the threat these garbage people ultimately are.

 

[Tsinni Dave]

I remember years ago listening to an CBC interview of a journalist who was in Rwanda during the war there and one day his car broke down in the countryside. A family helped him with his car, fed him and had him stay overnight after a great evening of singing and laughing. He slept in and was awoken by a disturbance in the yard, went to see what the wonderful family were doing, and found that they'd just murdered the postman with machetes. They said they did it because he was a Tutsi, and it was too bad because he was a nice man with a family who had helped them with farm work and had delivered their mail for years. But he was a Tutsi, so they had to kill him. Their biggest concern was wondering when the mail would be delivered next. I'm not going to vote in this poll, but the fact that it exists is a bad sign.

 

[Muse]

We've been hearing a lot about Democracy ending should Republicans sweep the House and Senate.

I watched a long video on the subject today. I did a search and came up with it at the New York Times. I suppose that's behind their paywall, but I'm subscribed. The format was a guy presenting who interviews a woman who's expert in what the Republicans are doing at every level down to the precinct. It's at least 10 minutes, I think.

The Republicans have been recruiting people to especially where Democratic votes challenge them, look intensely for any little thing they can come up with to challenge votes. They also do everything they can to intimidate voters or make it hard for them to vote. Sometimes their tactics backfire, but their goal is to undercut Democrats. The rationale is to counter what they portray as their having been cheated by Democrats, but all their attempts have failed to produce credible evidence of that.

Story on network news tonight about the Russian oligarch who denied it for years but now admits that he was part of meddling in US elections and he said they will continue to do it and are doing it in these midterms.

Russian oligarch Yevgeny Prigozhin appears to admit to US election interference | CNN

Yevgeny Prigozhin, a Kremlin-linked oligarch known as "Vladimir Putin's chef," appeared to admit to Russian interference in US elections in a Telegram post on Monday.

www.cnn.com

Prigozhin said that Russia has interfered, is interfering and will continue to interfere in the US democratic process, in response to a journalist’s question about Russia potentially meddling in US congressional elections on Tuesday.

“I will answer you very subtly, and delicately and I apologize, I will allow a certain ambiguity. Gentlemen, we interfered, we interfere and we will interfere,” Prigozhin said.

 

[Jaskalas]

No, the pretense will not end unless someone revolts against the election result. If the peace holds, things will remain Democratic for quite a while...
But that isn't to say our Democracy will survive. It simply makes no difference, our trajectory is set. Whose driving becomes immaterial next to the larger cultural trends and movements of people and ideas. Dangerous ideas that pit us against one another, and an alt-reality that believes Democracy is dead, that elections are fake, and they must "act" to "save" it.

Whoever moves to "save" Democracy first, is going to end the pretense and commence with violence.
Otherwise, things will remain relatively boring and chug along for a while at least.
Time enough to enact actual positive changes, but those would never actually occur in our system.

Barrack Obama's Hope and Change seems so very distant these days.

 

[Leeea]

No.

Democracy was never a 100% on or off thing.

We will have less democracy, less people allowed to vote, able to vote. Fascism will become more prevalent, tolerance will decrease.

But remember, this country started as only white land owners being allowed to vote, and that was considered democracy.


Our country will endure whatever happens here. People will die. Minorities will be lynched. Fascism will be on the rise. But democracy will continue in one diminished form or another. The Weimar republic did not fall in a day, and the core elements of our society are contrary to the goals of the fascists. The blue areas will not go easily, and while the red areas can ethnically cleanse their towns, it will not change the demographic trends. The blue areas continue to pile on population while the red areas continue their decline. White power slowly loses its voting base, while minorities surge.


Disenfranchising the minorities will not change that, just delay the inevitable.

 

[BoomerD]

immediately? no. biden has veto power. but it's going to be a shitshow that i think has a good chance of leading to a complete republican sweep in 24, which will be game over. the running theme for 24 would be be biden not doing anything his last 2 years in office (on account of a congress that won't do anything of course, but no one ever pays attention to that)

The Republicans are ALWAYS "The Party of NO!" when a Democrat is the president...that switches to "The Party of HELL YES!" as soon as a Republican gets elected to the presidency.

 

[compuwiz1]

Did Democracy end every time the Republicans have held those houses before? Of course not, as this is just a BS fearmongering narrative that only idiots buy. Anything that does not allow Democrats absolute power is a "threat to democracy". But because we are doing so well under Democrat leadership right now, (NOT), they will be routed today. People care about their pocket books, cost of living, cost of gas, cost of groceries, crime, the border, and a multitude of other things that the Democrats have utterly failed at. Abortion and January 6th are not the kitchen table interests. On the key items, the Democrats have been out of touch with their constituents and their messaging has not aligned with what the people are feeling. Keeping them in power would be to continue what we have been suffering under their leadership. It is time for the seas to change.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Did Democracy end every time the Republicans have held those houses before? Of course not, as this is just a BS fearmongering narrative that only idiots buy. Anything that does not allow Democrats absolute power is a "threat to democracy". But because we are doing so well under Democrat leadership right now, (NOT), they will be routed today. People care about their pocket books, cost of living, cost of gas, cost of groceries, crime, the border, and a multitude of other things that the Democrats have utterly failed at. Abortion and January 6th are not the kitchen table interests. On the key items, the Democrats have been out of touch with their constituents and their messaging has not aligned with what the people are feeling. Keeping them in power would be to continue what we have been suffering under their leadership. It is time for the seas to change.

How many coup attempts have we had in the last 50 years? 100 years?

Sounds to me like you're adovcating for:

Increasing wages and especially the minimum wage
Affordable housing
Guest worker programs and ending the war on drugs
Transitioning to green energy

Which are all decidedly democrat initiatives. So what exactly are conservatives offering? More tax cuts for the rich?

 

[zinfamous]

According to the Q guys I chat with, the republican's are going to gain a super majority in the house and senate, then reinstate Trump as the rightful president. Trump is then going to activate the military and remove every democrat from from the Federal government.
I did ask if he was going to lead the army into Washington on his tyrannosaurs rex, the question didn't go over well.

It's important to remind yourself of 2 things:

1: These people actually believe these things to be true, in a very religious way
2: These are people that you consider your friends.

 

[zinfamous]

They're actually reasonably pleasant fellows. They get worked up when I mention that anyone with a room temperature IQ wouldn't believe this lunacy for a second, but they never stay mad. They're also all established and successful businessmen.

3: What does this suggest to you about "businessmen" and their purported success, as a useful metric for their qualifications for public leadership?

 

[akenbennu]

According to the Q guys I chat with, the republican's are going to gain a super majority in the house and senate, then reinstate Trump as the rightful president. Trump is then going to activate the military and remove every democrat from from the Federal government.
I did ask if he was going to lead the army into Washington on his tyrannosaurs rex, the question didn't go over well.

If it was good enough for Harry Dresden, it's good enough for Trump.