Will mini-PCs take over desktop computing?

[VirtualLarry]

Just musing. I've been accumulating SSDs lately, from all of the sales, just to have on hand for new PCs and whatnot.

Then, for the heck of it, I dug out my MeegoPad T02 Compute Stick. It throttles down like a mofo, when it's under any type of CPU load (like a ten minute Skype call), and even now, not doing anything else but typing in the newest version of Firefox, and listening to internet radio, the radio is skipping as I'm typing (but it's not throttling right now, 8C away from TJmax).

It makes for a... hmm, insert your own colorful word here... computing experience. Not quite the experience that one would hope for.

My point is, I've been accumulating "Desktop parts" (like 2.5" SSDs), and I'm wondering if there is going to be an accelerated push in 6-12 months, away from full desktops, towards nearly exclusively mini-PCs for desktop duties? Core M Skylake should propel that, along with the Skylake NUCs. And that my "stockpile" of 2.5" SSDs, SATA cables, and ATX PSUs, are very soon now going to be completely obsolete?

People have been predicting the "death of the desktop PC" for some time now, but I'm wondering if now is the cusp of the death of the desktop PC form-factor.

 

[NTMBK]

I don't see a reason to build anything bigger than an ITX box, unless you're making a workstation.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Remember a lot of desktop sales is mobile devices.

I dont think 6-12 months as such changes much. Maybe 10% towards smaller and another 10% towards mobile. Its not like in 12 months nobody uses ATX anymore. But the trend is clear.

You also need to look beyond cheap crap.

ITX and NUC types is the future desktop.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Just musing. I've been accumulating SSDs lately, from all of the sales, just to have on hand for new PCs and whatnot.

Serious question: are you just, like, independently wealthy or something? You buy a lot of computer gear...even though it's cheap, on the whole you seem to spend a bunch on PC gear

 

[VirtualLarry]

Serious question: are you just, like, independently wealthy or something? You buy a lot of computer gear...even though it's cheap, on the whole you seem to spend a bunch on PC gear

That's basically my hobby; I spend what money I have on ramen and computer parts. Ok, not exactly, but that's pretty close to the truth. (I do eat more than ramen, occasionally some pizza and BK, and subs from the local convenience store, but I did order three cases of ramen from walmart.com recently. Should last me a month or so.)

And some of the money came from a (late) friend that was wealthy.

Edit: But yeah, I'm a major bargain-hunter too, I make sure I get a deal on stuff; it makes the money go farther.

Edit: For example, the Intel Compute Stick was originally $150 with Win8.1. I bought the MeegoPad T02 Ubuntu version Computer Stick instead for $83 ea., and put my own copy of Win10 32-bit on. (Although I thought I got a deal, and people complained about the fan noise on the Intel Compute Stick, I think I would rather have had a small fan, rather than throttling down to almost nothing. So perhaps, not one of my best purchases.)

Another example, my ATX gaming / DC PCs, I paid roughly $435 for each of them, but if I had to pay list price for the components, they would have cost more than $600.

The SSDs, when I say "accumulate", I mean, not just recent sales, but over the last, oh, maybe 3-4 years.

I've got some 30GB OCZ Agility (used) drives (cost $40 ea), that I decommissioned from my Q9300 rigs, I've got some refurb 50GB OCZ Vertex 2 drives (a few barely used, one NIB, cost $36), a refurb 240GB OCZ Vertex Plus R2 (pretty heavily used, before I got it, cost $82), some Intel 80GB X25-M drives (purchased at TigerDirect for $40 AR in one Hot Deal from a few years ago), some 30GB Transcend drives that I got from TigerDirect more recently, for around $30 shipped, and some others, like my 100GB Intel 710 Enterprise SSDs with HET eMLC NAND, picked up a pair at NeweggFlash during a sale for $70 ea. (List price is $300!)

 

[Arachnotronic]

That's basically my hobby; I spend what money I have on ramen and computer parts. Ok, not exactly, but that's pretty close to the truth. (I do eat more than ramen, occasionally some pizza and BK, and subs from the local convenience store, but I did order three cases of ramen from walmart.com recently. Should last me a month or so.)

And some of the money came from a (late) friend that was wealthy.

Edit: But yeah, I'm a major bargain-hunter too, I make sure I get a deal on stuff; it makes the money go farther.

Edit: For example, the Intel Compute Stick was originally $150 with Win8.1. I bought the MeegoPad T02 Ubuntu version Computer Stick instead for $83 ea., and put my own copy of Win10 32-bit on. (Although I thought I got a deal, and people complained about the fan noise on the Intel Compute Stick, I think I would rather have had a small fan, rather than throttling down to almost nothing. So perhaps, not one of my best purchases.)

Another example, my ATX gaming / DC PCs, I paid roughly $435 for each of them, but if I had to pay list price for the components, they would have cost more than $600.

Interesting

 

[MisterLilBig]

I think the end game is a Smartphone. Because it can be used as a "compute stick" and way more things. All it needs is the app support.

And in all honesty, I think we are already there. It just hasn't been pushed.

 

[redzo]

I would hate to service branded desktop hardware, especially mini pc's. It is custom everything and I do not like it. I want more control.

Nowadays you can build very power efficient desktops. I do not think a possible "mini pc's are less power hungry than desktops" argument stands.

Why would I deploy mini pc's(which are basically notebook hardware inside a small box) instead of full notebooks - with an lcd screen? I admit it: they look fancy, stylish and they are small, but it ends here. Somehow I perceive mini pc's just as the old netbooks.

Desktops are very cheap and easy to service: you can find cheap brand new spare parts all over the place for a long time, even for branded desktops.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against progress. But what I love is something like this: http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/X99E-ITXac/ : drop a ridiculous high core count xeon cpu here. So much CPU power, such a small x86 box. It's amazing ...

 

[MongGrel]

Being independently wealthy would change most people outlook on life a lot I guess, but it really isn't applicable to the topic I guess.

:biggrin:

Mini PC's still seem pretty weak to me from everything I've read, the death of the desktop has been predicted over and over for well more than a decade.

 

[MisterLilBig]

Mini PC's still seem pretty weak to me

That's because "cloud computing" isn't mainstream.

 

[frozentundra123456]

I would hate to service branded desktop hardware, especially mini pc's. It is custom everything and I do not like it. I want more control.

Nowadays you can build very power efficient desktops. I do not think a possible "mini pc's are less power hungry than desktops" argument stands.

Why would I deploy mini pc's(which are basically notebook hardware inside a small box) instead of full notebooks - with an lcd screen? I admit it: they look fancy, stylish and they are small, but it ends here. Somehow I perceive mini pc's just as the old netbooks.

Desktops are very cheap and easy to service: you can find cheap brand new spare parts all over the place for a long time, even for branded desktops.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against progress. But what I love is something like this: http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/X99E-ITXac/ : drop a ridiculous high core count xeon cpu here. So much CPU power, such a small x86 box. It's amazing ...

Yea, I agree basically. Seems to me like NUCs and similar mini-PCs are the worst of both worlds between a desktop and a laptop. You have the lower performance, worse cooling and difficulty of service of a laptop without true portability.

 

[cbn]

My point is, I've been accumulating "Desktop parts" (like 2.5" SSDs), and I'm wondering if there is going to be an accelerated push in 6-12 months, away from full desktops, towards nearly exclusively mini-PCs for desktop duties?

Regarding those 2.5" SATA SSDs, a move towards PCIe SSD (ie, M.2 ) and better eMMC (5.0 and greater) is expected to happen in more machines.

However, I don't think 2.5" SATA SSD is going to go away any time soon.

 

[Sonikku]

I wish I had a late friend that was wealthy. My rig needs some serious love. Still kicking around a 7770 for gaming. :'(

 

[Justinbaileyman]

That's basically my hobby; I spend what money I have on ramen and computer parts. Ok, not exactly, but that's pretty close to the truth. (I do eat more than ramen, occasionally some pizza and BK, and subs from the local convenience store, but I did order three cases of ramen from walmart.com recently. Should last me a month or so.)

You must be my doppelganger LOL, I do the same thing eat lots and lots of ramen to cut back food costs.I am starting to consider myself a parts hoarder as well. I am always buying cheap cheap parts like Intel L5639's x5650's, AMD 5350's,Raspberry Pi 2's ect. the problem is that I always buy multiples of the same item for backups or sometimes backups for my backups.The other thing I hoard alot of lately is SSD's and larger sized USB 3.0 flash sticks, dont ask me why cause I have no clue to why.Yeah I know I have a problem but its my hobby I guess.But what the hell am I going to do with all this junk piling up? Yeah know I also seem to have this same problem with video games mainly retro stuff and by no means am I rich I am actually pretty poor when it comes to having money.Right now though I seem to be doing better as I have sold alot of my hoard but it makes me wonder if this isnt some middle aged thing?I am in my early 30's how about you Larry?Anyways maybe start selling off some of your stuff like me and buy into a smaller form factor pc with a socketed mobo like a Brix?

 

[dave_the_nerd]

I don't see a reason to build anything bigger than an ITX box, unless you're making a workstation.

This.

And most workstations builds fit happily in a uATX case.

Wasn't there somebody around here who maintained that "ATX is for gamers and poor people?" I'm not even sure that's accurate anymore.

My computer shrine is definitely downsized.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

That's basically my hobby; I spend what money I have on ramen and computer parts. Ok, not exactly, but that's pretty close to the truth. (I do eat more than ramen, occasionally some pizza and BK, and subs from the local convenience store, but I did order three cases of ramen from walmart.com recently. Should last me a month or so.)

And some of the money came from a (late) friend that was wealthy.

Edit: But yeah, I'm a major bargain-hunter too, I make sure I get a deal on stuff; it makes the money go farther.

Edit: For example, the Intel Compute Stick was originally $150 with Win8.1. I bought the MeegoPad T02 Ubuntu version Computer Stick instead for $83 ea., and put my own copy of Win10 32-bit on. (Although I thought I got a deal, and people complained about the fan noise on the Intel Compute Stick, I think I would rather have had a small fan, rather than throttling down to almost nothing. So perhaps, not one of my best purchases.)

Another example, my ATX gaming / DC PCs, I paid roughly $435 for each of them, but if I had to pay list price for the components, they would have cost more than $600.

The SSDs, when I say "accumulate", I mean, not just recent sales, but over the last, oh, maybe 3-4 years.

I've got some 30GB OCZ Agility (used) drives (cost $40 ea), that I decommissioned from my Q9300 rigs, I've got some refurb 50GB OCZ Vertex 2 drives (a few barely used, one NIB, cost $36), a refurb 240GB OCZ Vertex Plus R2 (pretty heavily used, before I got it, cost $82), some Intel 80GB X25-M drives (purchased at TigerDirect for $40 AR in one Hot Deal from a few years ago), some 30GB Transcend drives that I got from TigerDirect more recently, for around $30 shipped, and some others, like my 100GB Intel 710 Enterprise SSDs with HET eMLC NAND, picked up a pair at NeweggFlash during a sale for $70 ea. (List price is $300!)

Programming is a much cheaper hobby. You could get one computer, code with it, and eat nothing but locally grown organic produce and still save money.

 

[MongGrel]

That's because "cloud computing" isn't mainstream.

That has been kind of pipe dream awhile now, yeah.

I utilize it now and then.

 

[SwiftWind]

Cheap, small, powerful - pick 2.

 

[cbn]

Mini PC's still seem pretty weak to me

That's because "cloud computing" isn't mainstream.

That has been kind of pipe dream awhile now, yeah.

I utilize it now and then.

I realize you are referring to a server doing heavy lifting for certain programs, but even the lightweight stuff like TV content ...I don't think that is completely online yet.

So that leaves us with making our own personal servers and recording (which is legal to do) if we want 24/7 access.

 

[cbn]

This.

And most workstations builds fit happily in a uATX case.

Wasn't there somebody around here who maintained that "ATX is for gamers and poor people?" I'm not even sure that's accurate anymore.

My computer shrine is definitely downsized.

Windows Gaming Box: AsRock Z77E-ITX / i5-3570k @ 4GHz / 16GB RAM / GTX 970 / Samsung EVO 840 250GB / Seagate Momentus 750GB / Silverstone SG05.
FreeBSD Server: SuperMicro X10SLM-F / Pentium G3250 / 16GB ECC DDR3 / 4x Toshiba DT01ACA200, 3x DT01ACA300, 1x DT01ABA200 / Fractal Node 804

Dave,

How are the (eight) hard drive temps in that Node 804 case? Also are these drives in JBOD or RAID 5 or 6? EDIT2: Stock (as shipped) fan configuration? Or added fans?

If temps are good, do you think there would enough thermal headroom in that Node 804 chassis to consolidate a gaming rig and a storage rig into one Node 804 system (possibly with a GTX 970 (Blower or open air cooler?) in there as well)?

EDIT: Taking a look at the Video of the Node 804, I notice the Motherboard, CPU, RAM and Video card are in different chamber than the PSU and 3.5" HDD bays...so that has got to help.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Dave,

How are the (eight) hard drive temps in that Node 804 case? Stock (as shipped) fan configuration? Or added fans? Also are these drives in JBOD or RAID 5 or 6?

If temps are good, do you think there would enough thermal headroom in that Node 804 chassis to consolidate a gaming rig and a storage rig into one Node 804 system (possibly with a GTX 970 (Blower or open air cooler?) in there as well)?

EDIT: Taking a look at the Video of the Node 804, I notice the Motherboard, CPU, RAM and Video card are in different chamber than the PSU and 3.5" HDD bays...so that has got to help.

Drive temps are in the mid-30s. So... fine, I guess? (The HD temp on my desktop is 35C and CrystalDiskInfo says that's good.)

Dunno about thermal headroom. A 970 isn't the hottest card in the world, and it's designed to accommodate SLI/WC rigs. Filling out the rest of the fan slots would probably be good enough.

 

[redzo]

Programming is a much cheaper hobby. You could get one computer, code with it, and eat nothing but locally grown organic produce and still save money.

After much booze over the years and still smoking chimney style,
I envy ... a lot,

 

[VirtualLarry]

You must be my doppelganger LOL, I do the same thing eat lots and lots of ramen to cut back food costs.I am starting to consider myself a parts hoarder as well. I am always buying cheap cheap parts like Intel L5639's x5650's, AMD 5350's,Raspberry Pi 2's ect. the problem is that I always buy multiples of the same item for backups or sometimes backups for my backups.The other thing I hoard alot of lately is SSD's and larger sized USB 3.0 flash sticks, dont ask me why cause I have no clue to why.Yeah I know I have a problem but its my hobby I guess.But what the hell am I going to do with all this junk piling up? Yeah know I also seem to have this same problem with video games mainly retro stuff and by no means am I rich I am actually pretty poor when it comes to having money.Right now though I seem to be doing better as I have sold alot of my hoard but it makes me wonder if this isnt some middle aged thing?I am in my early 30's how about you Larry?Anyways maybe start selling off some of your stuff like me and buy into a smaller form factor pc with a socketed mobo like a Brix?

LOL. Yeah, it does sound like me. I'm in my early 40s. I buy multiples of items too. I thought that the Athlon 5350 was too expensive at ~$50, so I bought three Sempron 3850 (still a quad-core, but a bit slow in ST) for $20 ea. Sadly, the mobos I bought were like $42 after shipping costs. Though, they are overclockable, and have four SATA ports.

 

[cytg111]

My point is, I've been accumulating "Desktop parts" (like 2.5" SSDs), and I'm wondering if there is going to be an accelerated push in 6-12 months, away from full desktops, towards nearly exclusively mini-PCs for desktop duties? Core M Skylake should propel that, along with the Skylake NUCs. And that my "stockpile" of 2.5" SSDs, SATA cables, and ATX PSUs, are very soon now going to be completely obsolete?

People have been predicting the "death of the desktop PC" for some time now, but I'm wondering if now is the cusp of the death of the desktop PC form-factor.

Seeing how our desktop is a deriative of the workstation that is a deriative of the server space and since I dont see the server space going out of business and neither the workstation ... thus neither the desktop.

 

[Ranulf]

I don't see a reason to build anything bigger than an ITX box, unless you're making a workstation.

Change that to micro atx and I'd mostly agree. Itx is often just a a pain in the ass to work with. Toss in the extra costs/less features due to miniaturization and temperatures and its not worth it. Itx beats out mini-pc's for many things though, for many of the same reasons.

But if you have a budget, serious gaming machine or workstation, itx is not the best answer.