will penguin take on the MAC

pcthuglife

Member
May 3, 2005
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As far as I know linux has always been available for Macs. At least it has for the past few years. Could you maybe re-word your question?
 

avocade

Junior Member
Mar 9, 2006
4
0
0
Sure they will take on the Mac OS X, but Apple will be several steps ahead for some time now. I can only hope that they catch up soon so Apple (finally) get some competition in the OS market. That will make them work and innovate even harder, for the benefit of us all.
 

avocade

Junior Member
Mar 9, 2006
4
0
0
Originally posted by: P0ldy
It's a long way off. Linux won't install on anything but x86. :\

With Apple's Boot Camp on the MacTel's you can now dual-boot into Linux or Windows or use Parallels virtualization software right in OSX.
 

kamper

Diamond Member
Mar 18, 2003
5,513
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Linux and pretty much every operating system in existance has been using MAC for years. And boo to your silly poll.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
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71
YellowDog Linux, among others... Actually I think virtually every Linux has a ppc arch these days.
 

kami333

Diamond Member
Dec 12, 2001
5,110
2
76
To anyone using Linux instead of OSX, what's the advantage? Other than the price and the novelty.
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
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Here is a webpage for getting Mactel to work.
http://www.mactel-linux.org/wiki/HOWTO

There was a lot of interest in Mac PowerPC machines in Linux circles.. This was because it was the only non-x86 architecture that was affordable and usefull for general computing to normal consumers. So if you wanted to play around with something that was non-x86 then apple was 'it'. That was one of the reasons I bought it.

Now, however, Apple uses the same hardware everybody else does. Same generic Intel chipsets, and cpus. (The Mac motherboard and proccessor was the only thing used in Apple machine that was not easily aviable for x86 users).

Now the only thing different for Apple hardware is OS X, propriatory form-factors, and this EFI business. So who cares? If you want to run x86 hardware with Linux there are better priced and faster things out there. Linux will end up supporting it better then it does now (with 3d full 3d acceleration and whatnot), but I expect it would take a bit longer then it would otherwise due to the more boring nature of Apple hardware nowadays.
 

spikespiegal

Golden Member
Oct 10, 2005
1,219
9
76
To anyone using Linux instead of OSX, what's the advantage

FTP that actually works for one

Also, let's see a list of hands of that would prefer to use OSX over any free Linux distro as a server.

Yeah....nothing but chirping crickets. Thought so.
 

kami333

Diamond Member
Dec 12, 2001
5,110
2
76
Originally posted by: spikespiegal
To anyone using Linux instead of OSX, what's the advantage

FTP that actually works for one

Also, let's see a list of hands of that would prefer to use OSX over any free Linux distro as a server.

Yeah....nothing but chirping crickets. Thought so.

Can't say I ever had any problems with FTP. With finder or any other program.

And as far as my experience goes (medium sized company), running OSX as a web server was nice enough without any real problems that couldn't be worked out (something I've lived to deal with from Linux, lol), and the same with the file server (Open Directory to AD). What are the problems?
 

halfadder

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2004
1,190
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Meh, ftp is insecure. You're on a Mac, may as well use SSH/SCP/SFTP, it's already installed.
 

spikespiegal

Golden Member
Oct 10, 2005
1,219
9
76
What are the problems?

I guess you don't read AnandTech much.

http://anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2436&p=8

may as well use SSH/SCP/SFTP, it's already installed.

Care to write a FAQ up for that? Windows and Linux users who call me up asking for FTP directions to download product data off our non-Windows hosted web-site never have problems. Mac users? - forget it. We send them a CD given how well OSX handles passive FTP native.

A bigger question for me is why the same Penguin heads that have been brutal towards Windows Server, and rightly so the past decade, are strangley not applying the same criteria towards OSX. If my obnoxious neighboor buys the same brand car I do, he's not suddenly my best buddy.
 

erikistired

Diamond Member
Sep 27, 2000
9,739
0
0
Originally posted by: spikespiegal
What are the problems?

I guess you don't read AnandTech much.

http://anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2436&p=8

may as well use SSH/SCP/SFTP, it's already installed.

Care to write a FAQ up for that? Windows and Linux users who call me up asking for FTP directions to download product data off our non-Windows hosted web-site never have problems. Mac users? - forget it. We send them a CD given how well OSX handles passive FTP native.

A bigger question for me is why the same Penguin heads that have been brutal towards Windows Server, and rightly so the past decade, are strangley not applying the same criteria towards OSX. If my obnoxious neighboor buys the same brand car I do, he's not suddenly my best buddy.

 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
0
0
A bigger question for me is why the same Penguin heads that have been brutal towards Windows Server, and rightly so the past decade, are strangley not applying the same criteria towards OSX. If my obnoxious neighboor buys the same brand car I do, he's not suddenly my best buddy.

Don't look at me when you say that.

I don't think Apple has a paticularly strong security setup and I don't think OS X would make a paticularly good server either. Linux is faster, has better security, has much better filing systems and is compatable with a much wider range of software.

As far as corporate culture goes I also think that Apple is as bad, if not worse, then Microsoft. Sure Microsoft has a big bad monopoly on the common PC desktop and have been caught in the past by using this to try to crush competators. Sure they push/support DRM in a attempt to further people's dependance on their operating system (If people can't play their media files on Linux or OS X then they won't considure switching, the whole thing is pretty obvious). But Apple never got to the point were they could strong arm people, until they figured out the Ipod and they use DRM to make it so that people when they buy their songs online they have to use Apple's hardware and apple's software in order to play it. Obviously Itunes is DRM-lite because you can burn your stuff to cdrom, but we can all see the direction these things are going.

At least Microsoft doesn't sue their own fanboys for posting stuff to the internet, like Apple currently does.
 

kamper

Diamond Member
Mar 18, 2003
5,513
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0
Originally posted by: halfadder
Meh, ftp is insecure. You're on a Mac, may as well use SSH/SCP/SFTP, it's already installed.
There's nothing wrong with ftp if you're just doing anonymous downloading. Except maybe that http is often more convenient...
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
0
0
Originally posted by: kamper
Originally posted by: halfadder
Meh, ftp is insecure. You're on a Mac, may as well use SSH/SCP/SFTP, it's already installed.
There's nothing wrong with ftp if you're just doing anonymous downloading. Except maybe that http is often more convenient...

Even then you can run into problems. Anonymous downloading can be potentionally dangerious unless it's setup correctly, although most ftp servers will probably ship with sane defaults nowadays.

With FTP in Linux it is very nice because you can use it to execute commands and such... Like you can pipe the output into tarball and save that on you local computer and visa versa. These things aren't well know by most ftp users, but are cool when you need to grab or upload directories and such. But it can also cause serious problems.

scp and sftp are much much nicer, especially if your only dealing with a handfull of users that you trust enough to give shell access to. Since ssh is secure shell, for users you have to give shell access to retreive stuff. It's not that different from FTP in certain aspects, although it's much much much more secure.

Otherwise if you don't want to setup shell access then you can use a chroot environment for sftp and eclude everything else. Also you can use rssh or scponly, which do pretty much the same thing but more transparently to the administrator. The downsides for that is that they run with setuid permissions to root in order to take advantage of the chroot stuff. So still you have to trust the users somewhat and be on top of things.

With apache you have a 2gig limit on file sizes. It's probably not smart to put huge files on http anyways.

So in conclusion this is what I feel...

For small amount of users that are trusted with any file sizes.:
ssh/sftp/scp

For small amount of semi-non-trusted users (as in normal users) with any file sizes:
rssh/scponly

That's pretty nice because everything is encrypted. Ssh has strong authentication methods besides just passwords. (public/private keypair and kerberos support) So it's good for sensitive items.

For a large amount of users with small file sizes:
Apache/Http

You could use ssl for more security and PKI infrastructure.

For a large amount of users with large files:
bittorrent

You can use encrypted files and have a secure method of distributing passwords if your worred about that sort of thing with bittorrent, or most anything.

 
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