Win8.1 after some months ...

[flexy]

Because I have a game (TSW) which is supposedly running poorly under Win8(.1) with a Nvidia card, I spent some time to do a fresh install of Win7 SP1 on another partition, for testing purposes etc.

Obviously, my main OS is Win8.1 for several months now, I use classic shell and "in theory" I really like Win8.1...I configured it that I hardly see anything of 8, so it looks virtually like 7.

Anyway..I got VERY nostalgic installing 7 on the partition and really, really miss it.

For me, the ONLY benefit of 8.1 is a couple or so supposed enhancements on kernel level with an alleged improvement in task switching etc. and the theoretic advantage that it has DX11.2. It really seems more like a placebo effect to me to somehow legitimize that I am running 8 since those advantages for me are not evident really.

All the rest of what makes 8.1....I have to honestly admit is mostly so that I don't see them as new, great features but rather as annoyances which I would rather disable or get rid off.

(Short: The benefit of actually running 8.1 is kind-of...questionable)

This is just one example, for instance booting into advanced startup options for repair, safe-mode etc. which now has gotten more than necessary complicated.

Incompatibilities with some older drivers, oddities like that eg. under 8.1 I cannot get my Audigy 2 console settings to stick after reboot, annoyances like that.

Just saying that while I installed 7 I asked myself why on Earth did I install 8/8.1 in the first place? 7 did and does everything nicely...8.1 does not provide any obvious benefits....respective it needs to be tweaked so it "looks like" 7 to even be tolerable. All that crap like "apps" etc. I never ever need or even plan to use. Unexplainable errors in event log which seem having to do with the Win8.1 app store etc..

A butt-ugly desktop with ugly Windows....

I really, really miss the times where we had a GOOD and SOLID OS, just saying.

After several months with 8.1 I don't see the benefit.

I am about to get a new laptop for the wife and I KNOW it will have 8/8.1 on it...I will likely just-end up wiping before everything else and install 7 on it.

 

[oynaz]

I tend to agree with you. Most of the Win 8.1 UI is just bad. I actually kind of like the start screen.
The rest though, is just annoying. Apps are useless. The charms bar is annoying and useless. Many of the bugs (UI scaling!) are plainly embarrasing.

Windows 8.1 is a failure imo.

 

[pmv]

In fairness, the improvements in win8 over 7 are mostly invisible and hence not sexy.

Improved security is a very good thing, even if its not noticed till something nasty happens.

Bit like the way the PSU is the least exciting bit of hardware, but if you get a bad one you'll find out the hard way.

But I'm glad I went with 7 if only for aesthetic reasons (only recently dumped XP, which itself I only got a few months before Vista came out!). The clashing of two design philosophies in 8 just looks ugly to me. Please let 9 find a way to have the best of both worlds without it ending up a FrankenGUI.

 

[oynaz]

I agree - the improvements under the bonnet in Win8 really are worth having. However, the new UI is so bad that even I, as a professional IT guy who knows what I will be missing, is tempted to scrap Win8 and keep Win7.

I cannot believe how nobody in Microsoft stopped and took a reality check. "Guys, invisible buttons, two seperate and very different UIs shoehorned into one, a chams bar which make no fucking sense, a UI scaling which does not work. We have to rethink this."

 

[13Gigatons]

I tested Windows 8 and missed a lot of what made Windows 7 cool. The Glass effect was nicer too look at then I thought. Windows 8 just looks bland.

The start menu was an annoyance and I hated that I had too use a utility to make look and work like Seven. The only great thing I really like about Windows 8 was the boot speed but I let the computer run so it was wasted on me.

I'm dreading Windows 9 because I know Microsoft is really arrogant and never listens. It would be great if Windows 9 desktop mode looked and acted like Windows 7. It won't.

Sigh....Microsoft is dead.

 

[Charlie98]

I agree - the improvements under the bonnet in Win8 really are worth having.

I akin the W7 vs W8/8.1 to the Sandy/Ivy Bridge CPU upgrade to Haswell... yea, sure, it's a slight upgrade with a lot of stuff 'under the bonnet' as oynaz says, but there's the problems with OC'ing and now you need a new mobo socket. Hardly worth it in either case.

I'll wait for W9 and hope MS has pulled their collective heads out of their arse... but I find it very unlikely.

 

[Geofram]

The odd thing is that I recently went through something similar, and had the opposite feeling. I needed to revert to Windows 7 for a few weeks on my main PC, and whatever is under the hood made a big difference.

Some noticeable differences revolved around my video conversion.

MCEBuddy (which I use to convert recorded TV shows using Intel Quicksync). In Windows 7, a service can't make calls to use Quicksync, only a user generated process can, which meant I had to manually start it up in a slightly annoying fashion, rather than letting the 'invisible' service handle it.

Also, if my IO got hit hard (aka writing out the new file after a conversion was done) the whole system would practically lock up in Windows 7 - sound would sit there and repeat itself even.

Those things don't happen in Windows 8. It never gets unresponsive, I can convert video as a service, etc. Not to mention how much less annoying it is doing the initial driver install on 8, since I don't get met with a large list of unidentified devices, although that's a small benefit.

So for me it has nothing to do with the UI. The innards of how the OS works makes 8 work better for me.

 

[B-Riz]

The odd thing is that I recently went through something similar, and had the opposite feeling. I needed to revert to Windows 7 for a few weeks on my main PC, and whatever is under the hood made a big difference.

Some noticeable differences revolved around my video conversion.

MCEBuddy (which I use to convert recorded TV shows using Intel Quicksync). In Windows 7, a service can't make calls to use Quicksync, only a user generated process can, which meant I had to manually start it up in a slightly annoying fashion, rather than letting the 'invisible' service handle it.

Also, if my IO got hit hard (aka writing out the new file after a conversion was done) the whole system would practically lock up in Windows 7 - sound would sit there and repeat itself even.

Those things don't happen in Windows 8. It never gets unresponsive, I can convert video as a service, etc. Not to mention how much less annoying it is doing the initial driver install on 8, since I don't get met with a large list of unidentified devices, although that's a small benefit.

So for me it has nothing to do with the UI. The innards of how the OS works makes 8 work better for me.

This. So much this.

The internet hate machine against Win 8 is focused on its looks and a few UI gaffes.

MS kicked some butt on its internals.

 

[Mem]

Because I have a game (TSW) which is supposedly running poorly under Win8(.1) with a Nvidia card, I spent some time to do a fresh install of Win7 SP1 on another partition, for testing purposes etc.

Obviously, my main OS is Win8.1 for several months now, I use classic shell and "in theory" I really like Win8.1...I configured it that I hardly see anything of 8, so it looks virtually like 7.

Anyway..I got VERY nostalgic installing 7 on the partition and really, really miss it.

For me, the ONLY benefit of 8.1 is a couple or so supposed enhancements on kernel level with an alleged improvement in task switching etc. and the theoretic advantage that it has DX11.2. It really seems more like a placebo effect to me to somehow legitimize that I am running 8 since those advantages for me are not evident really.

All the rest of what makes 8.1....I have to honestly admit is mostly so that I don't see them as new, great features but rather as annoyances which I would rather disable or get rid off.

(Short: The benefit of actually running 8.1 is kind-of...questionable)

This is just one example, for instance booting into advanced startup options for repair, safe-mode etc. which now has gotten more than necessary complicated.

Incompatibilities with some older drivers, oddities like that eg. under 8.1 I cannot get my Audigy 2 console settings to stick after reboot, annoyances like that.

Just saying that while I installed 7 I asked myself why on Earth did I install 8/8.1 in the first place? 7 did and does everything nicely...8.1 does not provide any obvious benefits....respective it needs to be tweaked so it "looks like" 7 to even be tolerable. All that crap like "apps" etc. I never ever need or even plan to use. Unexplainable errors in event log which seem having to do with the Win8.1 app store etc..

A butt-ugly desktop with ugly Windows....

I really, really miss the times where we had a GOOD and SOLID OS, just saying.

After several months with 8.1 I don't see the benefit.

I am about to get a new laptop for the wife and I KNOW it will have 8/8.1 on it...I will likely just-end up wiping before everything else and install 7 on it.

That's the problem there since Win8.1 is a solid OS,sure it has changes and some people hate the UI ie Metro but that does not take away the fact its improved security,rock stable(in my experience) and some nice added features/improvements over Win7 etc..

I have accepted Win8/8.1 just fine but then what's hard about Windows nowadays?..Nothing is the answer, as to Metro sure you can hate it, but it's not rocket science to click on a tile or even customise/avoid Metro for the most part or the old desktop UI.

Be interesting to see what users hate in Win9,only time will tell.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

It never gets unresponsive

Some of that is because the 8(.1) UI is fully Direct2D accelerated. MS ditched the fall-back to GDI(+) that was present in 7.

It actually works wonders on older, slower hardware. I tried an old MSI Windbook (Atom N270+1GB RAM) with Win 8, and it ran way better then the original XP ever did...

 

[Morbus]

I use Windows 8 at work. That's Windows 8 Service Pack 1, also known as Windows 8.1.

I hate it. The computer is a Z68 motherboard with a i7 750 and 4GB of DDR3 1333 RAM, and a GT210 discrete video card (which is surprisingly enough for most my photoshop work). It's all sitting on a SATA3 Hitachi HDD. It's a reasonable computer by today's standards, and it ran Windows 7 before that.

Windows 8 is the devil itself. It's ugly as crap, its boot up/shut down speeds are all over the place, all the time (even though I have Windows update set to manual, because then it would be even worse!), and though I've used it for almost a year and a half now, it's still not any better than it was back in 2012. The charms are the most annoying thing of them all, but every interface is just ugly and/or unintuitive and/or hard to use. And that's considering I only use the desktop side of things, EVER (because there is absolutely no reason to use a mobile interface on two 24 inch full HD screens), so the only real windows interface I see is the Windows Explorer, the Open File With... window (which is modal and totally dreadful), the PURPLE UGLY ASS network interface and the start screen (which, despite being totally unusable, I don't mind nearly as much as many people do).

At home I use Windows 7 exclusively, and I have it set up to look awesome on minimal system resources:



Those black parts are because I have a 768p screen to the left of my main screen, that is 1080p.

You'd guess that Windows 8 wouldn't be all that different from Windows 7, considering my use case. Well. It is, and it hurts. I see no advantages whatsoever to using it (absolutely none), so it's only downsides.

I long for the day Windows 9 comes out and we update...

 

[escrow4]

@ Mobius

Boot up/shut down due to a well worn HDD, rest of the UI I have zero problem with. I'd equip that work PC with at least 8GB RAM too.

 

[Charlie98]

[/b]
Be interesting to see what users hate in Win9, only time will tell.

Ooooooo... I'm ready to start the W9 hate thread!!! It's awful!

 

[oynaz]

This. So much this.

The internet hate machine against Win 8 is focused on its looks and a few UI gaffes.

MS kicked some butt on its internals.

"a few UI gaffes"? That is like calling the polar vortex "a bit of snow" or a threesome with your wife and her hot friend "quite OK".

The UI changes are generally disasters. Stupid, ugly, embarrassing and, worst of all, hurts productivity.
Go try uninstalling something from C:\windows\assembly and you will see what I mean. Not something the average user would do, I agree, but a very good example of stupid, untested design.

Or take Skype. If you just download the Win8 version, you now have an application which cannot be windowed (and can only be used with an M$ login). Why on Earth would I want that?
Sure, I can, and will, get the desktop version, but Windows 8.1 just wasted 5 minutes of my time. Again.

 

[Morbus]

@ Mobius

Boot up/shut down due to a well worn HDD, rest of the UI I have zero problem with. I'd equip that work PC with at least 8GB RAM too.

A better graphics card is more important, really. And the HDD is 2 years old. It sees heavy workloads though, but those boot up/shut down issues weren't seen in Windows 7.

also, a note on the Windows store.

I KNOW that any software I buy for 1.99€, I KNOW that it's not gonna be good, or that I shouldn't have to pay for it. Why do I know that? Because! Every single piece of software I've paid for is AT LEAST 10 bucks, or it's free. Winamp Pro? 20 bucks. TeraCopy Pro? 15 bucks, I think. Antivirus subscription? 25 bucks at least. Windows? 90 bucks. MS Office (which I don't use - Libre Office is better), 50 bucks. Games? 50/60 bucks when new.

I don't see myself EVER paying for cheap ass stuff. 1.99€? No way. Nothing good is worth 1.99€.

So, Windows store? Bad business model. If it's business we're talking about, of course. If it's play or fooling around, then I'd rather use something free, or don't use anything at all.

 

[Mem]

A better graphics card is more important, really. And the HDD is 2 years old. It sees heavy workloads though, but those boot up/shut down issues weren't seen in Windows 7.

also, a note on the Windows store.

I KNOW that any software I buy for 1.99€, I KNOW that it's not gonna be good, or that I shouldn't have to pay for it. Why do I know that? Because! Every single piece of software I've paid for is AT LEAST 10 bucks, or it's free. Winamp Pro? 20 bucks. TeraCopy Pro? 15 bucks, I think. Antivirus subscription? 25 bucks at least. Windows? 90 bucks. MS Office (which I don't use - Libre Office is better), 50 bucks. Games? 50/60 bucks when new.

I don't see myself EVER paying for cheap ass stuff. 1.99€? No way. Nothing good is worth 1.99€.

So, Windows store? Bad business model. If it's business we're talking about, of course. If it's play or fooling around, then I'd rather use something free, or don't use anything at all.

Microsoft Store pricing statement is not valid,reason being you have free software there as well, also you are free to download normal software from websites like you can do on Win7,Vista etc with Win8/8.1 so again it's just more options and YOUR CHOICE ,moaning about this is ridiculous IMHO.

 

[88keys]

I think Windows 9 (Blue) will be better. It's almost like M$ beta tests a new OS and the refines it with the next version.

Windows 2000 wasn't all that great when it came out, but they fixed those issues with XP and later Win2K.

Vista sucked so they refined it with Windows 7, and Windows Vista got better after awhile.

I suspect they'll follow the same trend this time around.

FWIW, I tried Windows 8.1 for a week and I really wanted to like it. But I found metro to be too clunky to use with a mouse. Start menu programs suppress it, but you still have to deal with it sometimes so I just went back to Windows 7.

 

[Morbus]

All the wanting in the world won't make you like Windows 8. Either you're on a tablet or a fanboy, or you won't like. Simple as that.

 

[Zaap]

Microsoft amazes me with how annoying they can be.

Last week I had a minute so I popped into Best Buy to mess with a Surface Pro 2- I'm considering getting one.

I'm playing with one, not even trying to think about the stupid OS, but what I actually want to DO with the tablet- which is productivity tasks, drawing and such, but it's as though MS wants to remind the user, "Hey! Here's the OS!! Here it is!! See it!?! See?? Here's something to 'help' you! Here you go! Right here! Didja see it? Didja know we made the OS, and we want to help you see how awesome we are?!?"

So as I'm testing the pen, using some drawing program, up pops that annoying-as-all-hell "switch between apps" pop-up that just sits there on the screen with the worst sort of intrusive shovel-ware attitude possible on a computer. MS reeaaaaaally wants you to see it, and somehow 'help' you with it, because heaven forbid you use a computer to be productive, not sit and admire the dumb details of the OS.

^ Thanks MS, I really wanted that plastered all over the screen, not focus on whatever it was I was actually doing.

So rather than just some clear and obvious way of getting rid of the stupid thing, you have to click around and do everything BUT what you were wanting to do in the first place, to finally figure out the convoluted way of getting rid of MS's stupid annoyance pop-up. (Pressing the upper left corner I think) Sure, I figured it out, but it needlessly wasted a few minutes of my time.

And my complaint isn't about how easy it may be to dismiss this type of annoyance- it's that it represents the whole underlying lame attitude that I hate about Windows 8. That MS wants to be in your face, forcing you to recognize their "oh-so-brilliant" OS. Their attitude wreaks of "Clearly, the most important factor in your use of a computer, is our OS. Whatever productivity you want to do, well, who cares? In fact, let us help you with that..."

I don't care about the stupid OS, I care about doing tasks with the computer, getting my work done, and using the applications I need. The OS is just a glorified launcher to get to that- so otherwise, keep the hell out of the way.

Oveall, sure Windows 8 can be made tolerable by making it more like Windows 7, and I'm sure there's under the hood improvements too, I'm all for that. I just wish they'd cut it with the lame 'trying to be in your face' details, and get back on track with more modern and relevant design improvements. (There's plenty of room for that in OS design, without resorting to needless gimmicks).

That's what I hope that the long overdue ousting of Ballmer and some fresh blood at the helm brings for Microsoft. I personally hope Windows 9 will be a re-think that rings changes that are truly improvements, not just change for the sake of change, or worse, changes that are retrograde.

 

[bbhaag]

I believe that picture you posted only happens when you turn on a new computer/tablet/laptop or upgrade to Win8.1 for the first time. Not sure why you kept getting it but you were messing with a floor model at Best Buy....so who knows what has been done to that poor Surface 2 but anyway.

The reason for a tutorial with 8.1 is because 8 came with NO instruction on how to use it. Nothing. Microsoft listened to peoples complaints about this and included a simple "how to" with 8.1. It's very simple though and obviously doesn't cover in depth operations. It's mainly for getting users accustomed to basic navigation of the OS.

EDIT:If you're interested in the Surface Pro 2 here is a good thread in the Mobile&gadgets forum on them. I haven't followed it in awhile though.

 

[pmv]

So rather than just some clear and obvious way of getting rid of the stupid thing, you have to click around and do everything BUT what you were wanting to do in the first place, to finally figure out the convoluted way of getting rid of MS's stupid annoyance pop-up. (Pressing the upper left corner I think) Sure, I figured it out, but it needlessly wasted a few minutes of my time.

There's a nice irony in that MS put that help pop-up in because the 8 GUI is not terribly intuitive, but then you pretty much needed a help pop-up to tell you how to dismiss the help pop-up, on account of it not being intuitive how to do so!

 

[xSauronx]

There's a nice irony in that MS put that help pop-up in because the 8 GUI is not terribly intuitive, but then you pretty much needed a help pop-up to tell you how to dismiss the help pop-up, on account of it not being intuitive how to do so!

if you just follow the arrow to do something once it goes away. its better to have that [a la the annoying "click here to get started" bubble in xp] than the nothing that windows 8 had.

i mostly like 8 from a user perspective. there are some lousy choices and half-assedness but its really not that difficult to get it the way i had set up windows 7 and just do my thing.
/except in one note, where the windows team took my screen shot shortcut away.

from an IT management perspective it can eat my balls. having the windows store be in the OS, but not allowing GPO control of it unless you buy enterprise/software assurance is a load of crap. that and misc issues with the start screen and apps is driving me nuts lately.

 

[13Gigatons]

Windows 8 is the new Vista according some of Microsoft's own employees.