Windows Longhorn

[DaTT]

Has anyone used this yet (the 4051 build). I must say....its quite the change from XP......a nice one

 

[bjc112]

Well it probably is nice, but this is going to get locked.

No piracy talks on the forums.


Just for future reference.

 

[OZEE]

Why you asking about pirated software?!?!?

 

[spyordie007]

pirates!

yo ho yo ho a pirate's life for me! arghh matey!

now you can wait for your thread to get locked

 

[Relayer]

aren't there legitimate beta testers?

 

[Budman]

You cant pirate an os that hasn't been released yet.

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: Budman
You cant pirate an os that hasn't been released yet.

You call the people that actually put the time and the effort to create the longhorn OS and ask them that.(MS) I am sure that they have a different opinion.

Anyways it's not like I realy care a whole lot.


Can you actually do anything with longhorn yet?

How is it different from XP? I looked at the screenshots and it looks pretty much identicle. Except the icons are even larger and more cartoony, and the wizards/dialogs fill up the entire screen and have huge graphics.

Oh and that big extra tool-bar thingy with the clock that takes up a 4th of the usable desk space.

 

[stephbu]

Hardware powerful enough to drive it with all bells and whistles is only just starting to come onto the market - it looks amazing when you can afford it

Couple of gigs of RAM, 256Mb Video, Dual 3.2Ghz with 250dpi LCD - around 8-10K's worth and you'd be in the right ballpark...

 

[n0cmonkey]

Speaking of pirates, Kira Knightlinger is hot.

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Speaking of pirates, Kira Knightlinger is hot.

You think so?



PS. The only thing special so far is IE pop up blocker and that's been standard in other browsers for about 3 years now.

 

[stephbu]

LH PDC build was a technology preview - more interesting to application developers than end-users.

I'm sure as LH development moves closer to public beta things will start getting more interesting.

 

[drag]

What sort of things then would be interesting for application developers?

Does it have a different sort of filing system or kernel? Is their some sort of new way to pipe images and graphics around the system?

I heard of a 3-d desktop being planned. Is their some new way to manipulate windows or orginize information on the desktop?

What about the database filing system stuff we've been hearing about, any early demos of that aviable on the OS?

Bill Gates wants to recreate the way people interact with each other or something vague like that. Is there a new networking portion that applications can tap into or any special services or new ways to transfer files to computers and stuff?

 

[rmrf]

as far as the pirating of the software, I know of places that get this software under the msdn licensing. I don't know if the poster is part of msdn, but I also don't know if he isn't. This software has had so many builds leaked, and now they have released a legitimate beta of the software, I don't think it is fair to jump to a conclusion that the software is pirated right away.

:beer:

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: rmrf
as far as the pirating of the software, I know of places that get this software under the msdn licensing. I don't know if the poster is part of msdn, but I also don't know if he isn't. This software has had so many builds leaked, and now they have released a legitimate beta of the software, I don't think it is fair to jump to a conclusion that the software is pirated right away.

:beer:

Ya I noticed that too. Hehe.

Hell I could probably get a copy for myself if I felt like it... maybe. I have to go and see.

 

[stephbu]

LH isn't at a beta build stage yet. I'll say it again - it's intended audience isn't end-users running it as their primary OS, it ain't ready for that - and I doubt most peoples hardware is ready for it too. Its there to help service, application and driver developers get their heads around the shift that will happen in the next few years. Some highlights:

new rendering engine (Avalon)
Win32 API rewrite to managed code (WinFx)
Communications API (Indigo)
Filesystem (WinFS)

More of the Longhorn changes will be unmasked for public inspection as development stabilizes. For more information read the MS blogs, read MSDN. Ignore the FUD.

 

[drag]

Here's a Microsoft fan-based website that has a discription of the 4051 build

Also has some simple performance tweaks if you care.


Looks like most of the OS has yet to materialize. No Avalon, athlough you can resize icons. (buy so can I using Gnome, and OS X can too, plus both looks nicer then Longhorn's, but that will change when they get proper icons set up.)

Looks like a modernized version of XP with some lib (*.dll) files added into it with some other stuff to give a idea on how the new API's will function.

Has a new developement version of IE. Finally starting to get some features that other browsers had 3-5 years ago.

The guy said that he will have a more complete technical review of the new technology by next week. That aught to be more interesting.

That "Slate" XP-like windows shell and that big sidebar thingie is not that exciting. It should be much more interesting looking when they get the avalon and other rendering stuff going.

The microsoft developer meeting had some art and screenshots that represent what the desktop will look like and he thought that was cool as all get out. He has a 4 or so short window media files that show various parts of the presentation. Seems to be more like a "we actually have something and it's mostly stable" thing rather then something that will be usefull to anybody (including application developers?) considuring how much is missing and how much is going to be radicly changed in the next 2-3 (4?) years before it gets it's final release. Athough I suppose it would give you some decent ideas and would be fun to mess around with.

Nice for a big company like MS to give it away for free.

(edited for reasonablity.)

 

[stephbu]

Looks like most of the OS has yet to materialize. No Avalon, athlough you can resize icons. (buy so can I using Gnome, and OS X can too, plus both looks nicer then Longhorn's, but that will change when they get proper icons set up.)

The 1st release of Avalon went out with the PDC drop of LH. The MSDN articles on XAML are targetted at PDC build Avalon developers.

Looks like a modernized version of XP with some lib (*.dll) files added into it with some other stuff to give a idea on how the new API's will function.

It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Ford Model T, all you could say is they have a wheel at each corner and you can drive it. The Win32 API is effectively deprecated.

The guy said that he will have a more complete technical review of the new technology by next week. That aught to be more interesting.

This article was 1st written in late October for the MS PDC.

Seems to be more like a "we actually have something and it's mostly stable" thing rather then something that will be usefull to anybody (including application developers?)

Yes your right - the core is crystallizing while the peripheries are still molten. MS wants kickstart developers on the right path. Usefulness of the build? The article omits that both the development environment (Whidbey) and OS (LH) were handed out. They're tinkering with Longhorn Apps right now. Read the public newsgroups linked here if you want to know how developers are experimenting.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/longhorn/

how much is going to be radicly changed in the next 2-3 (4?) years

End-user developers will see a lot less churn than the last 2-3 years - don't forget that many (highly-critical!) MS devs have been dogfooding this for what feels like an eternity. Most of the APIs are pretty much set in stone. Some will change but it won't be that radical - thats why its been opened up as a tech preview at PDC.

Nice for a big company like MS to give it away for free.

They didn't give it away free - developers paid big money to get to PDC to get the LH and Whidbey bits. Those that didn't are MSDN subscribers.

There is a lot BS flying around about Longhorn - rely on MSDN information to at least help cut through that.

edit: man my spelling sucks this a.m. need coffee!

 

[DaTT]

Interesting how the first several posts were flaming me. I never even said I was running it....I simply asked a question followed by a statement. I'm sure you all know what happens when your ASS-U-ME.

 

[spyordie007]

I dont think it was anyones intention to flame you, it's just that threads like this are generally locked quickly.

 

[drag]

This article was 1st written in late October for the MS PDC.

My bad. I don't know why then I thought it said january instead of december in the dates at the bottom. Guess that's why I shouldn't post when I am half asleep.

 

[chorner]

You guys are a bunch of crack pots you know that?

How do you know its not a legal copy? Get off your horses; shesh!

As for Drag, man .. get a life, Linux isn't life dude. Just because you're running gentoo and are upset you can't afford to pay for the best technology available, doesn't mean everything else sucks.

Windows is by far more advanced than Linux, Unix or any other OS. Windows doesn't reach 90% of the user-base because it sucks, and nobody supports it. So knock it off with your 'oh wow, they slapped on a couple dll's to the XP code base'. What about your beloved 2.6 kernel? They upgraded it to features Windows XP and 2000 have had for a long time now. Responsiveness, device support, proper filesystem, they added a .ko to kernel modules (haha), and generally made it run as smoooothly as windows. They still havn't figured out how to package programs that don't have a million dependencies though; instead of including what you need in the installer .. and if it is already there, useing th elatest version of the file .. ALA Windows.

Trust me, I've come to love my SUSE 9 install; but XP and just wait for it .. Longhorn will/does far outshadow the silly infantile OS Linux.

Drag man .. your nickname is entirely fitting. You really are a drag.

Sorry to turn it into a 'Drag war' but the dude bugs me, and I rarely ever post on here or read the forum

 

[cleverhandle]

Originally posted by: chorner
Sorry to turn it into a 'Drag war' but the dude bugs me, and I rarely ever post on here or read the forum

Well, gosh... that would explain why you can't distinguish those who contribute valid information based on research and experience from those who live in their own little delusional world where facts equate to whatever they feel like saying.

Ooh! Ooh! Does this get to become another thread like the one from a couple months back where you keep running your mouth and we all laugh at you for 100's of posts. `Cause that was fun. I'm ready... time to crack open a beer, sit back, and let the good times roll!

 

[Ichinisan]

I just can't wait for a date / time display on the Welcome screen and a vector-based user interface.

I curious to see how such an interface would deal with non-vector images in vector-based window forms...

 

[chorner]

Keep blabbing cleverhandle; it seems people tend to stick in groups. Morons with morons .... well you may get the point.

Yet again, there is nothing I have said that is untrue in the above post. Its just most people can't or don't want to face the truth of the matter, and instead spend their time sticking up for the underdogs. I don't understand why, but perhaps without you little brown nosers there would be no difference between the good and bad products, they would all be the same. I guess to you, complete choice is freedom. Like all the other Windows bashers; why? Because you can? Losers. Thats the problem with Linux, they've forgotten that with complete choice, they also lose their freedom of choice at the same time. Catch 22, but I guess you dorks are still stuck on the Linux buzz-word 'choice', not understanding that when you chose you also close out all other possibilities because infact you did chose. Idiots. What do you chose, ALSA or OSS? ALSA, because it is better than the age-old OSS. By having your freedom of choice, you're closing the choice of using OSS -even though, Its a good choice to leave behind OSS-. Again, you're all probably weening off the Linux = choice bandwagon.

So go ahead and crack open your beer ... just shows who you are.

Drag yet again goes on to post how Linux rulez and Windows drulez or however he would get around to spelling that.

Anyways, whatever you have to say
Go nuts

 

[Nothinman]

The Win32 API is effectively deprecated.

Just like Win16 is? Noone is going to move away from Win32 unless they have to, hell Installshield was still using Win16 last I checked.

MS wants kickstart developers on the right path.

I think they just want to show people it's not vaporware, like all the UI changes they had planned for Win2K that got backed out before release.

Windows doesn't reach 90% of the user-base because it sucks, and nobody supports it.

No, it reached that becaues it was around when there was no better alternative and now it's grandfathered in.

What about your beloved 2.6 kernel? They upgraded it to features Windows XP and 2000 have had for a long time now. Responsiveness, device support, proper filesystem, they added a .ko to kernel modules (haha), and generally made it run as smoooothly as windows.

Responsiveness was always there. The preempt patches and O(1) scheduler only helped in extreme conditions with thousands of threads/processes or when extremely low latency was needed for things like audio processing. As for Windows responsiveness, if a single process starts killing the machine using a ton of CPU or just doing a lot of disk I/O it can take minutes to get taskmgr up just to see which process it is even on XP.

What device support? I've never had a device that wasn't supported, some things like 10G Ethernet cards were added and PCI-X support is currently being merged, but the only thing I can think of that got a noticable boost in support for me was ACPI on my notebook and that was available for 2.4.x as an external patch.

What is a 'proper' filesystem? ext3 is journaling and IME is less suseptible to needing fsck/chkdsk than NTFS and that's what I would consider the worst filesystem for Linux. XFS, JFS, hell even reiserfs are all available for 2.4.x and are years ahead of NTFS.

I believe the .ko for the kernel modules was just to make them stand out more from normal intermediary object files produced by the compiler, but I don't understand why you consider it funny.

They still havn't figured out how to package programs that don't have a million dependencies though;

You mean like windows apps that just include ever dll they might possibly need? It makes no sense to redistribute the same thing with every package, it's a waste of bandwidth and disk space and if you use a proper package manager you don't have to worry about it because it's all handled for you.

and I rarely ever post on here or read the forum

Good, we don't need you running around spreading any more mis-information.

but I guess you dorks are still stuck on the Linux buzz-word 'choice', not understanding that when you chose you also close out all other possibilities because infact you did chose.

I'm confused, what did I lose when I chose not to use Windows? I've been using this computer with Linux-only for atleast years now, maybe you can fill me on with what I'm missing out on.

What do you chose, ALSA or OSS? ALSA, because it is better than the age-old OSS.

Actually I chose OSS because it's emu10k1 support is more complete.

For the rest of the post I'm not sure what you were trying to say, for now I'll have to assume you're either drunk or possibly even retarded. Hopefully you'll come back sober and post something that makes sense.