Windows Randomly freezes

[bfonnes]

:shocked:

Originally posted by: Slammy1

I'd avoid long-term testing while debugging, it's stressful (to the PC as well) and you risk thermal runaway w/ P95. Temps sound like the right place to start. You may be seeing failure, which is GREAT cause processors came down in price recently...

EDIT: I lean towards hardware issue, since it's failing Prime95. But since it's run in Windows, reinstall would be the best first step.

Didn't I just say that? Besides, it's never good when your components fail, unless your parents are buying your hardware, of course...

BFonnes

 

[Slammy1]

Actually, I was trying to agree with you on the install. I initially went on the assumption it was already tried, since it's a common first step to issues but I saw your post and wanted to reiterate the point cause it was correct.

 

[bfonnes]

Originally posted by: Slammy1
Actually, I was trying to agree with you on the install. I initially went on the assumption it was already tried, since it's a common first step to issues but I saw your post and wanted to reiterate the point cause it was correct.

Thanks,
yes, it never hurts to have a 2nd opinion I always like them myself.

BFonnes

 

[OmegaXero]

Sounds like either bad memory or blown caps on the motherboard. Unless you know what you're looking for blown caps will be hard to spot but I've seen plenty of Aopen boards with them. Do a google search for 'blown capacitors' and see what pops up.

Download a copy of memtest, burn it to a CD, and boot from it. If it gives you any errors at all then you've found your problem.

Memtest Link

 

[bfonnes]

Originally posted by: OmegaXero
Do a google search for 'blown capacitors' and see what pops up.

Memtest Link

If that was intended... That was a really bad pun, Seriously, though, he is right, a blown capacitor will usually be accompanied by a ping of it hitting the side or some part of the case. But, still, that's quite a jump in logic to assume a blown capacitor when you haven't seen the system. Helpful information, though.

let's not put the cart before the horse though, he hasn't determined, yet, through troubleshooting, whether the mainboard is actually the problem... That's a pretty big assumption in my opinion. I think you're just recommending memtest, because his system is freezing randomly, so you suspect memory, but he's already past that point... He's said he can't complete memtest without the computer freezing...

anyway, to thecrecarc: If you're going to use memtest it's important to burn it onto a CD (or put it on a floppy disk) as he suggested because that would be the most helpful test you can do (if you suspect the memory is the problem), because it is not done in Windows that way. And I think we've pretty much decided Windows is Kaput, so, don't do any more of your tests while in Windows. It certainly is something easy you can do that could give you more information about the problem, whether or not the memory is the issue. In my opinion the best test you can do for memory is to just stick it in another system and see if the same effects manifest themselves in the other system. We really haven't narrowed down the issue enough, yet, to say that there is a problem memory stick...

BFonnes

What's the status of your problem and what's the last thing you've done since your last post?

 

[Tweak155]

Did you buy a decent PSU? Could have a crappy line running out of it, those 20$ psu's will get you.

 

[thecrecarc]

a little update for you all:

i cleaned the insides, and reseated the heatsink, but falied to get the temps down

i checked the mobo, and didnt see and OBVIOUS anomalies, but i aint a expert of these things

i ran memtest outta a bootable CD, but it forze after 15 min

 

[Tachyon74]

I had some similar issues with a dying HD recently... the fact that after you reboot that it freezes at the BIOS screen (excuse me, i meant that, not POST) is especially suspect. Since it doesn't sound like you've ruled out HD yet, I suggest getting on Western Digital's website and looking for drive diagnostic software. HD manufacturers usually have those (and if you have to return the drive sometimes they make you give them the error code from it.) Find their diagnostic, download, and run it to make sure its not the drive. It does sound like you might have a bit of a heat issue also, but as people have said, spend some time with a can of compressed air and get dust out, especially from the CPU heatsink and the PSU.

*Edit* So I'm bored at work, here is a direct link:

http://support.wdc.com/download/downloadxml.asp#30

If it is the hard drive, I hope you have backups, although making them at this point is kinda tricky since extended use might kill it. I'd run the quickie diagnostics and see what they say. On further reflection though, bfonnes is right with what he says below, might as well rule out RAM since it will be hard to check for a faulty drive with bad RAM. If you do need to check the HD though, refer back to my link because that's the easiest way to do it.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

 

[bfonnes]

Originally posted by: thecrecarc
well, im clueless right now, could be my temps, or my mobo, or my hardrive. or even my video card. so... basically, i have no idea whats wrong.

how do u disable nic? what are NIC anywho?

You need to quit posting other ppl... Can't you tell he is confused? Thecrecarc needs to try one thing at a time, then you need to wait for him to respond and say what he's done and how effective it was...

If he wants he can reread the thread... There is no reason to keep posting the same thing over and over, (i.e. really annoying). This is not a phone conversation...

Anyhow, if memtest is freezing outside of Windows, then it must be a hardware issue as Slammy suggested... reread our prior posts if necessary, and yes, writing zeroes completely erases all data... The only reason to do it is when, 1. you already have a backup of all current data, 2. you want to be absolutely certain that there is a drive failure and you don't have the money or would rather not purchase a new one, 3. It will eliminate any virus (which does not apply in this case), 4. you have exhausted every other troubleshooting step (which we haven't). Try putting the RAM in another test system if you/friend have one available, and do the memtest again with the boot CD. Even if the memory is bad it won't effect the other system when you use the boot CD for memtest, because nothing will be written to the HDD.
In Fact, while you're doing the memtest on your machine, since you're using a boot CD, you might as well unplug the power/data cables from the hard drive, since it's not needed for the test. That way you can be sure that it's not the hard drive without having to erase stuff. You could also have a combination of issues, and that's why you need to try one thing at a time, and whenever you can pull something out of the system that is not vital to the test you are trying then do it.

edit: It may even help to print this entire thread out and have a paper copy, so you can refer to it, since your computer doesn't stay on very long. Cross off things you've already done and haven't had any effect or given any useful information, and circle what you're going to do next (and wait to cross it off until you're sure that's not the issue), and make notes on things that helped or questions.

BFonnes

...Read this last part only if you want more technical info...
To POST, you only need RAM, mobo, CPU, vidcard. A system can POST without a hard drive. Therefore unplug it until you are sure that at least your basic components are working 100%... It is likely since the system is successfully posting, that it is just a hard drive issue, but it is good to test the RAM just in case you have multiple component failure, because if you have bad RAM, it can corrupt your hard drive by writing bad data. So, what appears at times to be a hard drive issue can be a RAM issue (with a corrupted, but working HDD), so it is NECESSARY to test the RAM still and make sure that it is working 100%.

 

[Slammy1]

bf. The thing that concerns me is the worsening of the problem over time he's mentioned. Sounds like a cpu issue, but cpu failure shouldn't affect memtest stability (I suppose, depending on the nature and severity of the problem). By the same token, it's rare to see good memory go bad unless there's a specific cause. An important question is when memtest froze, was it spitting out errors? If so, that would indicate (to me) a bad motherboard (next time you have the case open, look for anything out of the ordinary around the main PSU connector on the MoBo) or memory settings/bad memory. Now if it just simply froze with no errors, that would seem to indicate PSU or MoBo. I've run memtest on a bad cpu, and i've had memtest freeze from too-aggressive frequency settings (always while chugging out errors). If errors lead to the freeze, then it would go back to memory timings/voltage to differentiate cause.

Sorry, you are correct in that too much information probably confuses the situation more and you definitely seem the best versed with the issue.

 

[thecrecarc]

when it freezes, no errors. it simply freezes. its working along... and BANG, it stops. nothing. no error, nothing.

 

[Slammy1]

Hmm, it definitely would seem to be a fundamental hardware issue. Did you try bf's recommendation about unplugging the HDDs? Well, random reboots are the hardest issues to diagnose in my experience, and based on what you've said it does sound fundamental so even swapping out components probably won't do anything for you. I'm leaning heavily towards MoBo at this point, since I don't think CPU would cause that sort of behavior (again, depending on the severity of the issue, but I've run memtest without errors on a bad CPU before). When it crashes in Wondows, I assume it doesn't write anything to eventlog but it still could provide some evidence as to cause.

You have a worsening issue with a component that's fundamental to your PC operating. Probably not CPU, probably not video. If I were you I'd try to watch for amy sign as to the types of tasks that are leading to the issue (or if it's random), watch your temps as even a working but maginal component can produce big errors when stressed with heat, and if you cannot assign any pattern look at a MoBo/CPU upgrade (a 939 board could handle the rest of your hardware, but is is dead end tech).

 

[bfonnes]

Originally posted by: thecrecarc
when it freezes, no errors. it simply freezes. its working along... and BANG, it stops. nothing. no error, nothing.

Did you try unplugging the hard drive before doing the memtest, and, did you test the memory in another system? If both the hard drive and the memory are fine, then replace the mainboard as Slammy1 said...

BFonnes

Just a reminder... before you determine the hard drive is bad, though, try reinstalling windows to a different folder and remember that Zero Fill erases all your data.

 

[crispy2010]

Try upping the mem voltage. That is if your mobo supports it!

 

[bfonnes]

Originally posted by: crispy2010
Try upping the mem voltage. That is if your mobo supports it!

I believe we're trying to fix a general computer issue... not trying to cause component failure, upping the voltage for overclocking will cause system instability rather than stability...

 

[thecrecarc]

wow, this is really weird.

ok, here what happened:

i was on my comp, trying to figure whats up. then it freezes again, like normal. when i restart this time, it DOESNT say "detecting ide drive" and freeze there like normal, forcing me to shutdown. this is very weird. however, it only dectects my hardrive, NOT my cd-rw!!!! (my cd-rw is my ONLY cd drive)

then, it boots into windows. that when i relize the hardrive case light is on. it seems frozen into the on postion, i never saw it turn off or flicker, like normal. i go to "my computer", and there in no cd-rw drive.

now, this is around 10 hours later, and IT NEVER FROZE!!! it works like normal, (expect for the constantly on hdd light, and no cd-rw drive)

could this probrem be caused by my cd-rw? seems weird. im scared to restart my computer, cause it might bring back the errors,

 

[crispy2010]

Originally posted by: bfonnes

Originally posted by: crispy2010
Try upping the mem voltage. That is if your mobo supports it!

I believe we're trying to fix a general computer issue... not trying to cause component failure, upping the voltage for overclocking will cause system instability rather than stability...

I dont remember saying overclock, have had a lot of mobo mem combo that the mobo did not suply enough power to mem. Upping the voltage will stabalize the sys. What is it .02 or +2 that fixes the prob!

After reading the last post sounds like could be bad ide cable or mobo going south!

 

[thecrecarc]

ok, now a update

now, when ever i restart, it has a 50% chance of detecting my cd-rw, and 50% of not. if it DOES dectect my cd-rw, it freezes. if it doesnt, it works, however, the HDD light is constantly of, and i cant use my cdrw.

im confused, help?