Windows XP impressions and experiences

[skace]

"My point is everyone needs an operating system, not everyone needs software like this. Sometimes you run across much worse than the OS protection you're having a problem with."
Just because you run across much worse doesn't make me think it is any better.

"MS may not stop it with "activation" but evidently in their eyes it's a start."
In their eyes its a good start - in our eyes its a bad one. Hence the reason people are discussing WinXP in the first place. Whether Microsoft thinks it is a good start or not is moot. Microsoft thinks you need a wizard to perform every task, everything should begin with "My", and that multitasking means your OS gets hung when one of the applications gets hung (happens even in NT - still can't compete with Unix). I could care less what Microsoft thinks, only what they deliver.

"Unless you have a crystal ball you don't know what's going to fail or succeed."
I don't need a crystal ball to see that they are going to fail at protecting against software piracy. I am glad you didn't disagree that even if they succeeded most people would take a second look at Linux after realizing they are going to have to pay for trash.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< and that multitasking means your OS gets hung when one of the applications gets hung (happens even in NT - still can't compete with Unix). >>


I haven't seen that. Must be an isolated problem on your end.



<< I am glad you didn't disagree that even if they succeeded most people would take a second look at Linux after realizing they are going to have to pay for trash. >>


I took a first look and eventually may take a second. If Linux hasn't improved drastically then I will also be taking a third, and a fourth, and a fifth...... as that's what I propose doing, looking at it instead of using it.

 

[natedog]

Sorry guys, I've been away for a bit. Was suprised to see so many posts. Thank you to those of you that have posted intelligent remarks regarded your actual experiences using XP, and no thank you to all of you that have locked yourself in a bunker in fear of Microsoft. I'll read all the posts when I have more time. See ya.

Nate

 

[elcapjtk]

personally it looks like XP is Win 2000/ME made to look like children's software. Of course everything Microsoft lets out first is going to be ah heck than crap, so I will probably delve in to the WIN XP stuff more (I had the beta installed, it isn't now ) after the first or second service packs, then see how impressed I am.

I still like WIN 98 SE I am just too stuck in my ways.

 

[skace]

Uh, you've never seen a hung application on NT suck 100% of the cpu allowing you to do absolutely nothing for a good 5 minutes? Unix doesn't do that. I've seen it happen on a good 50+ NT machines, must be on my end *cough*. Also, how come a hung NT application will leave a ghost on your screen that you cannot minimize, if the OS was truly multitasking it would be able to minimize a hung application or at least redraw the screen with what it last showed.

As for all Linux is good for - we are rolling out a standard Linux build now on dual 833's for engineering workstations. Cheaper than sun's but run faster. Also Linux is awesome in the embedded market. So while your trying to defend windows, try not to be such a hypocrit with Linux...

 

[IdahoB]

Hmm... actually, bear in mind that MS are targeting casual piracy, not warez. Warez are a pretty small part of the piracy problem at the moment, and most consumer piracy is because &quot;got a CD of my mate Dave.&quot;

 

[skace]

Idaho,
&quot;Hmm... actually, bear in mind that MS are targeting casual piracy, not warez. Warez are a pretty small part of the piracy problem at the moment, and most consumer piracy is because &quot;got a CD of my mate Dave.&quot; &quot;
Perhaps you missed one of my earlier replies or perhaps it was in one of the other million XP threads but whatever the reason here is my standpoint on that. I'd say casual piracy is not nearly as big a threat as warez. At least when it comes to an operating system. I don't know a single person who can format a hard drive and install an operating system but doesn't know how to find warez. Basically I am saying casual piracy on operating systems is almost an oxymoron. Even if you know someone who does casual piracy, there is a pretty good chance they could just as easily find a warez of it. Especially in the age of broadband, cheap cd-writers, multiple forms of chat clients / search engines, and CloneCD.

Also, giving your CD to your friend is almost excepted now... as long as you don't do it <enter hidden limit>.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< personally it looks like XP is Win 2000/ME made to look like children's software. Of course everything Microsoft lets out first is going to be ah heck than crap, so I will probably delve in to the WIN XP stuff more (I had the beta installed, it isn't now ) after the first or second service packs, then see how impressed I am. >>


I didn't see too many bugs when W2K was releasded. Don't feed me the bull story about 20,000 bugs or whatever, the vast majority of those were typos or the like.



<< Uh, you've never seen a hung application on NT suck 100% of the cpu allowing you to do absolutely nothing for a good 5 minutes? Unix doesn't do that. I've seen it happen on a good 50+ NT machines, must be on my end *cough*. Also, how come a hung NT application will leave a ghost on your screen that you cannot minimize, if the OS was truly multitasking it would be able to minimize a hung application or at least redraw the screen with what it last showed.

As for all Linux is good for - we are rolling out a standard Linux build now on dual 833's for engineering workstations. Cheaper than sun's but run faster. Also Linux is awesome in the embedded market. So while your trying to defend windows, try not to be such a hypocrit with Linux... >>


Skace, again I've never seen what you refer to. Must be all that &quot;bad software I run&quot;, right??? As for Linux call me when you have some real engineering apps. running under it. I'm not being a Linux hypocrite, if I found it useful I'd consider it. Right now it's nowhere close.

 

[skace]

Psych, when an app stops responding in NT it never slows your machine down or anything? hmmm thats a new one. I guess I will have to get screenshots later on...

As for Linux, On our standard build so far we have C++ compilers and Matlab... plus everything that usually comes with Linux. Mainly the engineers are porting their OWN applications to Linux in this period.

The Unix machines can talk with the Linux machines and use them for pure compiling power. On top of other things.

 

[Demonic]

Has anyone gotten a voodoo to work on winxp? When I install the drivers (9x/nt) they error. Ignoring the register failurs it seems to work. The 3 failurs seem to be the tweaking portions of the driver. The problem I have is playing any games using the 3dfx gliders.. I get a complete lockup in a black screen. Although it will run in software rendering mode.

My thoughts on xp.. although I have only used it for a day: MS needs to stop hiding sh*t from me! That's gatta be the most annoying thing MS is doing. Hiding files and blocking access to things even when I'm loged in as an administrator. Does nothing but cause me problems. Also, the gui sucks! (Fairly easy to fix.) I don't like them forcing their instant messanger on me, either. No easy way to uninstall it and even after uninstalling it through the control pannel it's still starting up after every boot.. wtf? And finally.. when I was browsing the forum on it scrolling down is really jerky. Nope. I don't like it at all so far. (2502) Yeah, the one released on monday. I recieved it last night. As far as it's compadabality.. I haven't tried anything. Until I can get my v5 to work it's completely useless.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< As for Linux, On our standard build so far we have C++ compilers and Matlab... plus everything that usually comes with Linux. Mainly the engineers are porting their OWN applications to Linux in this period. >>


When you say engineers I assume you're talking about &quot;software engineers&quot;, correct. I just don't see too many civil engineers compiling AutoCAD to Linux, and that's aside from the fact it would be illegal.

 

[skace]

Yes SW Engineers. Porting their OWN code and using the Linux boxes for their pure processing power in doing compiling.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< Yes SW Engineers. Porting their OWN code and using the Linux boxes for their pure processing power in doing compiling. >>


My bad, when I hear &quot;engineers&quot; I just think of civil engineers due to what I work more closely with. So like I said there are no real &quot;engineering&quot; applications for Linux. At least for anything that would concern my site.

 

[sentania]

<<

<< and that multitasking means your OS gets hung when one of the applications gets hung (happens even in NT - still can't compete with Unix). >>

>>


I can't count how many times I've locked linux up.(it's that many)

 

[natedog]

Hey Demonic, as far as I know every Microsoft OS since 98, and prolly even 95 as well, hid files from you. Just go into Explorer, View, Options and fix it. Not that hard. And I can't believe anybody complains about the GUI. Sure, bash the puffy look, but hell, you can make it look all kinds of ways. I imagine some cool looking skins/themes coming out for xp. Like winamp type stuff. It's valid to say you don't like the default look, but this is the most customizable windows yet.

And as far as this whole linux stuff goes, I just don't see the point in installing a whole new OS, that I've never used and don't have a clue how, and half of the software that is available won't run on it. I'm not serving anything (not like serving CS on linux or windows will make any difference with a cable modem, still sucks) so I fail to see the importance. That's all, not saying linux sucks, I know there is great stuff some of you guys use it for, but please don't expect the masses to come to it.

 

[Stark]

<< Hmm... actually, bear in mind that MS are targeting casual piracy, not warez. Warez are a pretty small part of the piracy problem at the moment, and most consumer piracy is because &quot;got a CD of my mate Dave.&quot; >>


MS is in the unique position of having monopoly control over the desktop. If you doubt this, ask yourself: if there was not windows, would I have a job right now? If you work in computers, that answer is probably no.

MS is using this power as leverage to ram this registration scheme down the throats of users. As far as I know, no other large software maker has tried such a scheme aimed at consumer users. You buy the software, you should be able to install it on your system as many times as you want without asking for &quot;permission&quot; from Redmond.

MS has basically made it possible to &quot;break&quot; your software whenever they want. If you get a &quot;call Redomond&quot; message and they feel you don't deserve an activation, what are you going to do? You are totally dependent upon MS to make your machines work.

Hardly anyone thinks software piracy is a good thing, but if you do any buying for an MS environment, it's easy to see how much MS makes off their products.

 

[natedog]

You know what I think will happen? Microsoft will realize how pissed off everyone is going to be and change things. Remember the Intel processor ID fiasco a while back? Same thing. First there is consumer outcry, corporation listens, changes plans out of fear. Is MS scared? No, maybe not much. But history shall repeat itself. They'll back down.

 

[Needles]

I live in England and we have the data protection act here. Does Microsoft's activation process break that act and therefore the law?

BTW, I use W2K. The only way I'd use XP is if they got rid of the activation.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< MS is in the unique position of having monopoly control over the desktop. If you doubt this, ask yourself: if there was not windows, would I have a job right now? If you work in computers, that answer is probably no. >>


No, the answer would be yes I would have a job and it would deal with IBM instead of Microsoft. There will always be a big player. If you think nothing would have taken the place of Microsoft you are very niave.

 

[JuryDuty]

<< You know what I think will happen? Microsoft will realize how pissed off everyone is going to be and change things. Remember the Intel processor ID fiasco a while back? Same thing. First there is consumer outcry, corporation listens, changes plans out of fear. Is MS scared? No, maybe not much. But history shall repeat itself. They'll back down. >>



I agree. They backed down from putting Smart Tags in IE today because of the consumer outcry and I think they'll do the same in regards to activation. Too many people hate the idea. I'm not saying they'll cut it out completely, but I do think they'll at least find a way to make it less intrusive and system-threatening.

 

[Psychoholic]

<< I agree. They backed down from putting Smart Tags in IE today because of the consumer outcry >>


Correction:
Microsoft pulled the feature from XP, not IE. It will remain an option in IE, unless they decide to change it.
Smart Tag Story

I find it real funny how people were in an uproar over this anyway. It was an optional feature. Not to mention there was already software that was capable of doing this anyway. Like I've said many times before, people only bitch when Microsoft does it.

 

[Louva]

I began reading this thread in hopes of finding out about WinXP, not what MS is going to do with the information it gathers upon activation.

That was probably natedog's point. Too bad it didn't go that way.

I was in the service - so Uncle Sam has all the info it needs - I could care less.

What I want in a system is stability. The next thing I want is stability. Then I want to be able to run my fave applications - Dreamweaver, Paint Shop Pro, Homesite, Lightwave, Powerpoint. Next I want to be able to run some of my least favorite apps like Word and Outlook Express. Then I want to be able to play a few games like CivII, Pharoah, MooII/III.

Can Win2k allow that? And so what? Isn't XP the successor to Win2k? And how do I get a copy of XP NOW?

So - to get back to the subject ....

 

[natedog]

Well right now Louva, all of us that have it have gotten illegally I believe. At least I have, and don't know any other way to get it. Builds have been leaked and posted on newsgroups for download. However, you can sign up for the Microsoft preview program and when Release Candidate 1 comes out soon you'll be able to download it or get a cd in the mail. $10 for download, and $20 for cd. RC2 will come out a month later only for download.

Speaking of the preview program, I haven't gotten a single email or newsletter since I signed up on monday, what's the deal? How are they going to notify us?

 

[Avatar26]

Supposedly through your Passport email, but RC1 was SUPPOSED to be out on Monday and I haven't heard a word...

 

[natedog]

What is the passport email? The one you gave it when you signed up? I don't see anywhere to check it. I use my real email address to login.