Wisconsin Senate Passes Union Reform Legislation

[werepossum]

As GOP told us during tax cut debates, even over $250K household income is middle class.

Well - I think THAT might be pushing it!

EDIT: I should add that by classical definition, middle class could well have an income over $250K, being defined as the educated class above the working class but below the landed wealthy families of leisure. But in America, where fixed classes are consciously rejected and a plumber might earn more than an accountant or engineer, there's not really a working class separate from the middle class. If we accept the middle class as the middle three quintiles, flanked by the poor and the wealthy, then middle class would include household incomes of up to maybe $90k - $100K and down to maybe $20K - $25K depending on household size.

 

[Lemon law]

You all forgot the words lawsuits, injunctions, and courts.

Maybe Gov Walkers and his merry band of Republirats can self declare that the bill is not a fiscal measure, but not only must the Wisconsin courts have a go at that determination, so will the Federal Courts.

Long odds, Gov Walker will be long out of office before that court fight is even close to over. All it takes is one judge issuing an injunction, and the Gov Walker signature on the bill won't be worth the ink in his ink pen.

Hasn't Gov. Walker learned a single thing from Arizona?

 

[DCal430]

I wonder why no one complains that federal workers have no right to collective bargaining or any right to strike.

 

[spidey07]

You all forgot the words lawsuits, injunctions, and courts.

Maybe Gov Walkers and his merry band of Republirats can self declare that the bill is not a fiscal measure, but not only must the Wisconsin courts have a go at that determination, so will the Federal Courts.

Long odds, Gov Walker will be long out of office before that court fight is even close to over. All it takes is one judge issuing an injunction, and the Gov Walker signature on the bill won't be worth the ink in his ink pen.

Same with Obama and Obamacare, right? Maybe he can pull a Hussein and just not listen to the courts.

 

[werepossum]

I wonder why no one complains that federal workers have no right to collective bargaining or any right to strike.

Short answer, because there's a liberal Democrat President.

Long answer, because taking away rights or privileges is generally seen as more harsh than never having had them, and the battle to keep those rights or privileges is more profitably fought. And also, states' benefits and salaries, even in liberal Wisconsin, are not typically as generous as those at the federal level.

 

[Fern]

Well, someone overplayed their hand.

Suppose we'll have to wait to see who it turns out to be.

Fern

 

[SandEagle]

What a democracy.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41996994/ns/politics-more_politics/

Republican senators separated the provision from Gov .
Scott Walker 's controversial budget bill, removing the
requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote on the
anti- union measure.

 

[matt0611]

What a democracy.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41996994/ns/politics-more_politics/

Republican senators separated the provision from Gov .
Scott Walker 's controversial budget bill, removing the
requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote on the
anti- union measure.

Yes, republicans won last election and they voted to no longer bargain with unions collectively.

This is how the system works.

 

[matt0611]

Get ready for all the "hate and vitriol" coming from the ever so tolerant, rationale and understanding left. Take a look at twitter, its ridiculous.

 

[senseamp]

I think Dems played it well though, for 2012. This really mobilized their base.

 

[Patranus]

What a democracy.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41996994/ns/politics-more_politics/

Republican senators separated the provision from Gov .
Scott Walker 's controversial budget bill, removing the
requirement that 20 senators be present for a vote on the
anti- union measure.

Pretty sure the Democrats were the ones who threw Wisconsins representative republic out the window by fleeing the state.

I love MSNBC interviewing a state senator from Chicago. Laughable.

 

[Phokus]

Well, someone overplayed their hand.

Suppose we'll have to wait to see who it turns out to be.

Fern

Yes, it's the Republicans who overplayed their hand. They threw gasoline on the fire and there are 8 GOP senators at risk for recall right now (don't they need only 3 to return the senate to Dem control?) and i wouldn't be surprised if they have momentum to recall Walker in Jan. 2012. Recall donations were pouring in from all over the country before this, it's going to be an avalanche of support after this. The GOP's position in WI was unpopular before this vote, it's going to be hugely unpopular after it all sinks in.

Democracy has several ways of working, not just voting people into office. There are checks and balances. It's too bad for Walker didn't campaign on Union busting, at least if he still won, he could shielded himself from criticism that he pulled it out his ass after he got into office.

 

[pcgeek11]

I think Dems played it well though, for 2012. This really mobilized their base.

Time will tell. I think you are wrong. We will see.

 

[Phokus]

Time will tell. I think you are wrong. We will see.

Are you talking about WI or the Nation? In WI, the GOP just fucked themselves... their position on this bill was unpopular with the citizens before this vote. It's going to be even more unpopular afterwards.

 

[boomerang]

Yes, it's the Republicans who overplayed their hand. They threw gasoline on the fire and there are 8 GOP senators at risk for recall right now (don't they need only 3 to return the senate to Dem control?) and i wouldn't be surprised if they have momentum to recall Walker in Jan. 2012. Recall donations were pouring in from all over the country before this, it's going to be an avalanche of support after this. The GOP's position in WI was unpopular before this vote, it's going to be hugely unpopular after it all sinks in.

Democracy has several ways of working, not just voting people into office. There are checks and balances. It's too bad for Walker didn't campaign on Union busting, at least if he still won, he could shielded himself from criticism that he pulled it out his ass after he got into office.

 

[senseamp]

Time will tell. I think you are wrong. We will see.

Unless the state's problems magically disappear because unions can't collectively bargain, there is going to be more intensity on the left for repealing it then there will be on the right for keeping it in place. Intensity drives turnout.

 

[Darwin333]

Wait a minute, they could have done this all along? WTF took them so long? I understand not wanting to ram it through(ok, absurdly ram it through) and giving the opposition a fair shot but I think I would have used this method long before sending state troopers to arrest the fleeing Dems.

 

[werepossum]

Are you talking about WI or the Nation? In WI, the GOP just fucked themselves... their position on this bill was unpopular with the citizens before this vote. It's going to be even more unpopular afterwards.

Maybe. I have a hard time believing that Wisconsonites elected Republicans on the grounds that they would continue the same behavior that got the Democrats thrown out of office, but no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the electorate. If Wisconsonites don't understand that liberal policies got them into this mess, well, that's the beauty of democracy. You get exactly the government you deserve.

Hey, Michigan needs some competition in the race to the bottom.

 

[Phokus]

Sorry, but even Rasmussen, who tends to show more favorable numbers for Republicans than in reality, couldn't even spin Walker's favorability with the Wisconsin public (like 43%), it's going to go down more.

 

[Phokus]

Maybe. I have a hard time believing that Wisconsonites elected Republicans on the grounds that they would continue the same behavior that got the Democrats thrown out of office, but no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the electorate. If Wisconsonites don't understand that liberal policies got them into this mess, well, that's the beauty of democracy. You get exactly the government you deserve.

Hey, Michigan needs some competition in the race to the bottom.

Wisconsin wasn't really in trouble to begin with, relatively speaking. Like i said, walker should have run on union busting to shield himself. He and/or his party members are going to pay the piper.

 

[Phokus]

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub.../wisconsin_governor_walker_43_approval_rating

Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker won his job last November with 52% of the vote, but his popularity has slipped since then.
A new Rasmussen Reports telephone survey of Likely Wisconsin Voters finds that just 34% Strongly Approve of the job he is doing, while 48% Strongly Disapprove. Overall, including those who somewhat approve or disapprove, the new Republican governor earns positive reviews from 43% and negative reviews from 57% of voters statewide.
In addition to the usual partisan and demographic breakdowns, it’s interesting to note that Walker, now engaged in a budget battle with unionized state workers, receives a total approval rating of 46% from households with private sector union members. However, among households with a public sector union member, only 19% offer their approval. Among all other households in the state, opinion is nearly evenly divided—49% favorable and 51% unfavorable.
It’s also interesting to note that among households with children in the public school system, only 32% approve of the governor’s performance. Sixty-seven percent (67%) disapprove, including 54% who Strongly Disapprove.
This may be partly due to the fact that 77% of Wisconsin voters have a favorable opinion of the state’s public school teachers. However, only 50% have a favorable opinion of the teachers’ union.
(Want a free daily e-mail update? If it's in the news, it's in our polls). Rasmussen Reports updates are also available on Twitter or Facebook.
The survey of 800 Likely Voters in Wisconsin was conducted on March 2, 2011 by Rasmussen Reports. The margin of sampling error is +/- 4 percentage points with a 95% level of confidence. Field work for all Rasmussen Reports surveys is conducted by Pulse Opinion Research, LLC. See methodology.
Seventy-three percent (73%) of Wisconsin Republicans approve of the job Walker is doing. Eighty-nine percent (89%) of the state's Democrats and 56% of voters not affiliated with either of the major parties disapprove.
Among those who voted for Walker last November, 77% approve of his performance, with 67% who Strongly Approve. As for those who voted for his Democratic opponent, Tom Barrett, 93% disapprove of how Walker is governing, including 88% who Strongly Disapprove.
Polling released earlier shows that the governor is struggling in the court of public opinion in his dispute with the state’s public employee unions. Other polling shows that voters in the state prefer spending cuts over tax hikes when it comes to reducing the state’s budget deficit.
President Obama is viewed favorably by 55% of voters statewide. Typically, a president’s reelection vote total is similar to his job approval rating. Therefore, if the election were held today in Wisconsin, Obama would be heavily favored to win the state’s Electoral College votes.
Additional information from this survey and a full demographic breakdown are available to Platinum Members only.
Please sign up for the Rasmussen Reports daily e-mail update (it's free). Let us keep you up to date with the latest public opinion news.

And this is a GOP friendly pollster. It's going to be interesting to see how much worse it gets for Walker and the GOP after tonight.

 

[Patranus]

Wait a minute, they could have done this all along? WTF took them so long? I understand not wanting to ram it through(ok, absurdly ram it through) and giving the opposition a fair shot but I think I would have used this method long before sending state troopers to arrest the fleeing Dems.

They wanted to give the Democrats time to compromise and return to work.
Walker offered several compromises and concessions to the Democrats but they told him to pound sand.

 

[matt0611]

Doing what is right is not always popular. :thumbsup: for republics.

 

[Darwin333]

I think Dems played it well though, for 2012. This really mobilized their base.

I don't believe Gov. Walker is up for election in 2012. Perhaps some of the legislature is but is it even plausible they can pick up enough seats to override a veto?

 

[Lemon law]

Doing what is right is not always popular. :thumbsup: for republics.

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doing wrong is not popular either.