With Illinois 15 billion in debt, Gov. Pat Quinn has an idea to fix it

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Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,830
3
0
The majority of people who happen to live in one community. Almost every other community voted against from the looks of things. How would you feel if China had more votes in the UN because of its population? Granted the cultural disparity isn't as large, but it's the same principle.

In America we have the principle of 1 person 1 vote. Are you saying Chicagoans' votes should count for less in the governor's race, because they all live in one county?
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
8
0
So what do you propose, lay off all the state employees and pay them unempoyment for doing nothing instead?


Doing what the Gov is trying to do is a good thing. As many have said, and you would think is common sence, getting all your debt at lowwer rates and under one bill is much easier to cut down.

After the full debt and what it cost known then start slashing as much as you can. Many will be affected but it has to be done.
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
In America we have the principle of 1 person 1 vote. Are you saying Chicagoans' votes should count for less in the governor's race, because they all live in one county?

No, I'm saying they should be their own state with appropriate representation. The whole point of the relatively strong state governments we have is that the states can run themselves as bound by the Constitution. Likewise states can allow localities to enact ordinances and local laws as bound by the state constitution/code. The whole system is set up to allow for reasonable customization and local governance. When one city determines the outcome that goes against the rest of the state, it's time to re-draw the lines.
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
8
0
No, I'm saying they should be their own state with appropriate representation. The whole point of the relatively strong state governments we have is that the states can run themselves as bound by the Constitution. Likewise states can allow localities to enact ordinances and local laws as bound by the state constitution/code. The whole system is set up to allow for reasonable customization and local governance. When one city determines the outcome that goes against the rest of the state, it's time to re-draw the lines.


1 city did not decide the outcome, ALL the voters did.
If you take the votes for JUST chicago and not count the rest he would have lost. Just because a county goes 51% for person B does not mean you throw away the other 49%.

The majority of the STATE did decide who they wanted to be Gov.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,830
3
0
1 city did not decide the outcome, ALL the voters did.
If you take the votes for JUST chicago and not count the rest he would have lost. Just because a county goes 51% for person B does not mean you throw away the other 49%.

The majority of the STATE did decide who they wanted to be Gov.

Yeah, it's really easy to deceive people with maps. The red county map is a textbook example (literally, it's in geography textbooks).
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,030
2
61
Lets see Republicans to this day still use Reagan as the picture the party should run as. Bush ran the US the same way, and the same thing happened again.

There's a huge difference between things Reagan said and the things Reagan did. When you begin to understand that Obama is running things in nearly the same manner as Reagan and Bush, you'll have a better view of the bigger picture.
 

airdata

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2010
4,987
0
0
Isn't Obama's re-election campaign slated to cost over a billion dollars? surely there are some chicago residents who can pool some money so that their state does not fail...

There is also maijuana legalization. Regulate and tax gods gift to us all and profit.
 

xj0hnx

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2007
9,262
3
76
Lets see Republicans to this day still use Reagan as the picture the party should run as. Bush ran the US the same way, and the same thing happened again. R's are still trying to get Reagans name on more stuff, even money now.
When Republicans had full control for a good 6years did the debt go up or down?

So unless you're a complete idiot the Republican party still loves Reagan and would run things the same.

And your point? As Bamacre pointed out, there's a huge difference between what they, Reagan and Bush, said to get elected and what they did once in office, kind of like Obama, I guess all you Democrats like Gitmo being open, and the continued wars in the middle east, and extending Bush's tax cuts right?
 

Zargon

Lifer
Nov 3, 2009
12,240
2
76
If you didn't have the liberals in Chicago the nut would be in charge of Illinois now.

still better than a worthless POS thats done nothing but spend to get votes since he took over.

actually, he didnt much of anything till he went for reelection

we all know there is no way IL would pass a bill banning abortion, or enforcing intelligent design.
 
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IBMer

Golden Member
Jul 7, 2000
1,137
0
76
Then Chicago needs their own state to fuck up and leave the rest of Illinois alone, don't you think?

Do you think all the tax money goes to Chicago or does it to go other parts of the state? Do you think other parts of the state wouldn't be in a worse condition if it wasn't for tax revenue from the big cities?
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,158
6
81
Do you think all the tax money goes to Chicago or does it to go other parts of the state? Do you think other parts of the state wouldn't be in a worse condition if it wasn't for tax revenue from the big cities?

Tough to say, Chicago has a whole lot of Shaniquas with 15 kids sucking down welfare checks as fast as they come in. Take a trip through the south side sometime, hard to see that pile of shit generating any income whatsoever.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Do you think all the tax money goes to Chicago or does it to go other parts of the state? Do you think other parts of the state wouldn't be in a worse condition if it wasn't for tax revenue from the big cities?

Ah, so as long as there's a funding imbalance, then it's OK to force your will upon the benefactor of that imbalance?

Be careful where that logic takes you, because the wealthy pay a lot more of the US tax bill than you do.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,769
916
126
Who wound lend $15 billion to IL, what's teh interest rate? Guess a state defaulting isn't that big a risk but still, $15 billion.
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
and hes avid pro life(no matter if its rape or incest) and intelligent design.

hes a bit of a nut

All that extra stuff is just fluff.

I'm curious since you brought it up, is a rape fetus less valuable, less important, than another fetus? Is an incest fetus less valuable? If one person's belief is that a fetus is a living person with the right to be born, that belief doesn't change by the specifics over how it was created.

It's his belief. Now, is he on a personal crusade to overturn Roe v. Wade? Everyone can believe in something, does that pose a threat to you? Does that make him unfit to govern?
 

IBMer

Golden Member
Jul 7, 2000
1,137
0
76
Ah, so as long as there's a funding imbalance, then it's OK to force your will upon the benefactor of that imbalance?

Be careful where that logic takes you, because the wealthy pay a lot more of the US tax bill than you do.

Force what will? The majority voted for him?

Are you now going to say that the new majority republican House should not have the power to implement what it wants since 47% of the people didn't vote for them?

You also misunderstood my point. They say Chicago should become its own state as if the rest of the state would somehow be better without them. I bought up where would they get the funding since they lost the big city tax revenue.
 
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Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
2011 will bring even worse economic news all around. I predict at least 100 municipal bankruptcies. Twice bank failures as last year. More unemployment. More home foreclosures. More collapse in RE. No economic recovery. etc. These #'s for IL are optimistic. (arnt they always lately)
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
There's a huge difference between things Reagan said and the things Reagan did. When you begin to understand that Obama is running things in nearly the same manner as Reagan and Bush, you'll have a better view of the bigger picture.

Not really.

Reagan GTFO of Muslim terror states, not dove into brier patch full speed ahead or decided to stay not matter what people say.

Reagan’s supply-side economic policy had nothing whatsoever to do with the post-1991 NAFTA/GATT his lessors pimped and today as almost a religion.

The Reagan administration never deregulated the financial sector of his lessors.

The Reagan administration never launched wars against Serbia or Iraq on false premises.

Reagan RAISED taxes to cover SS shortfalls. Obama gets into deeper debt to pay for his SS tax cuts.

Don't even compare Reagan to his subsequent lessors. Reagan's Military spending had a dividend which his lessors declined to take advantage of and INCREASED it instead.

Who prefers 21st century America to the Reagan 1980s? Nuff said
 
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Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
0
0
Quantatitive Easing 3? Federal Reserve to the rescue. I guess we can just inflate our way out of this too, right?:hmm:
 

ichy

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2006
6,940
8
81
Tough to say, Chicago has a whole lot of Shaniquas with 15 kids sucking down welfare checks as fast as they come in. Take a trip through the south side sometime, hard to see that pile of shit generating any income whatsoever.

What we simply ought to do is take away the right to vote from people who don't contribute anything. It would require a constitutional amendment, but say that anyone who hasn't paid anything in income taxes in the last three years doesn't get to vote. That would eliminate the most worthless 3 to 5 percent of the electorate.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Force what will? The majority voted for him?

Are you now going to say that the new majority republican House should not have the power to implement what it wants since 47% of the people didn't vote for them?

You also misunderstood my point. They say Chicago should become its own state as if the rest of the state would somehow be better without them. I bought up where would they get the funding since they lost the big city tax revenue.

Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for lunch. Damn straight I think it's disgusting that 50% + 1 of millions of people get to tell 50% - 1 of millions of people what to do.

Of course I'm a libertarian, and I know how much you statists hate the thought of people having freedom.
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,038
36
86
Do you think all the tax money goes to Chicago or does it to go other parts of the state? Do you think other parts of the state wouldn't be in a worse condition if it wasn't for tax revenue from the big cities?

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Cook County, the county that Chicago and its immediate suburbs are composed of, is widely and universally known as Crook County.

More like the people in DuPage, Kane, McHenry, and Lake counties wondering where all their tax monies go to...oh wait! It's Chicago!

The Chicago System is why Chicago, and by extension Crook County, needs to be its own voting block. Let them F themselves up. If they succeed, which they won't, then they can do a big liberal/union/Democrat 'I told you so!'.

That will never happen...which is why the Dem's in IL and those in power in Chicago and Crook County would never be in support of a split like that: They know their little system would never survive w/o all those red counties proping it up...

Chuck
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Money and opportunity is freedom. You don't get that unless you take it from someone who has it. They just aint gonna give it to ya... At the same time I believe in balance. You water weeds and eventually it will choke out the garden. That's what's happening in USA. We have created a whole class of weeds via promoting it via offshoring and paying people to sit at home.
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,158
6
81
You also misunderstood my point. They say Chicago should become its own state as if the rest of the state would somehow be better without them. I bought up where would they get the funding since they lost the big city tax revenue.

You obviously have not seen the elecorate of Chicago. If you think they are providing the funding for the state you are crazy.

Lets just put it this way, Dave McOwen lives in Chicago.
 
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