Sounds like mental illness to me.
Here's some food for thought:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3705681/
https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...-between-religious-fervor-and-mental-illness/
The lines are very blurry. How do we know when an individual is just religious or a crazy person? That determination can be very elusive.
I disagree, as many people interpret religious texts as calling for death penalties for all kinds of minor offenses, including adultery.I know you only suspect, however according to the Catholic religion the mother did far worse than what she believed her daughter did. If religion were the issue then the mother would not have killed her daughter for any reason. Regardless, the quote I selected makes a positive absolute statement. Many people OD on religion if you will. How many kill their children? No, it was a bigoted statement. If one does X then Y results leaves no room for doubt.
The problem is that the basic principle of almost every religion is faith. Faith is by definition crazy to a rational mind. You are taught that one of the most desirable human traits is to believe things without any evidence, and even despite contrary evidence.It can be blurry. One may reasonably question motivations and causation. That is not what happened. A declarative definitive statement was made without any rational basis. It is ignorance, a bigotry that is embraced without challenge and so I face it.
I disagree, as many people interpret religious texts as calling for death penalties for all kinds of minor offenses, including adultery.
Just because someone is a Catholic doesn't mean they understand everything about Catholicism and what punishments are just for every situation. Many religions, including Catholicism I believe, teach you to always obey God's voice inside you and when you mix that directive with mental illness you end up with situations like this. She probably believes she was taken over by the Holy Spirit ffs.Where in her religion does it call for this act? In some religions, it was part of a ritual to rip out human parts or eat their enemies but we aren't talking about other religions, at least as far as it goes. Why do people kill? Is religion a requirement to have a systemic approach? What part do social dominance and hierarchical structures play? Do religions arise as a mechanism to express societal sentiments? What about politics and "ism's"? What about atheistic societies and their persecution and why are they "better" or "worse" and why? "Why are humans"?
Overbroad perhaps, but it's all interrelated and isolating systems of interactions in the discussion isn't happening.
We can discuss the virtues of social constructs including religion and their faults, but that requires personal interactions other than text and likely a few beers. But for now, the immediate case is defined by the only statement I take serious issue with.
I'd actually love to have a discussion about such things, but alas there's no good way to go about it in the depth required.
Anyway, major digression, sorry. My original point was about something specific.
Based on the child abuse scandal, the Catholic hierarchy doesn't understand it either.Just because someone is a Catholic doesn't mean they understand everything about Catholicism and what punishments are just for every situation. Many religions, including Catholicism I believe, teach you to always obey God's voice inside you and when you mix that directive with mental illness you end up with situations like this. She probably believes she was taken over by the Holy Ghost ffs.
The problem is that the basic principle of almost every religion is faith. Faith is by definition crazy to a rational mind. You are taught that one of the most desirable human traits is to believe things without any evidence, and even despite contrary evidence.
She probably believes she was taken over by the Holy Spirit ffs.
Yes, and in the case of Christianity the essential article of faith should be you are loved. People who feel loved express that love to others and don’t kill their children. The mystery of faith is that as the Beatles said, the love you take is equal to the love you make. There is only love. But self hate occludes it. Because self hate is a lie in which we have great faith, an even greater faith can undo it. What you observe is that most of us are of little real faith, and self hate is pervasive delusional state.The problem is that the basic principle of almost every religion is faith. Faith is by definition crazy to a rational mind. You are taught that one of the most desirable human traits is to believe things without any evidence, and even despite contrary evidence.
Yup, on first hearing sounds like severe mental illness. I suppose the relation between mental illness and religion can be complicated, but surely at a certain point the religion is almost beside the point? Sufficiently mentally ill people have been known to invent their own 'religion' if an existing one isn't available.
I can't show anything, which is why I said probably. Just my opinion based on my past experiences which means literally nothing to anyone other than myself. Take it or leave it.Really? Show us. Not your faith on the matter, but based on your objective knowledge of this woman.
If I witness something that current science cannot explain then in my mind it happened. However, I cannot expect anyone else to ever believe it happened. I also will assume that there is a reasonable explanation that I just currently do not understand.That's a fair point. Any religion ought to be able to reconcile itself with overwhelming physical evidence. I know Christians who accept an old earth, evolution and are indeed scientists. Their faith is based on principles reflected in teachings that do not demand a literal creation story. Whether you agree isn't the point but no one is telling them to put their kid on a slab and kill them, or God speaks through their dog and they need to shoot a President. But they might and so they can't be trusted, right? Well, no more or less than anyone else from any data one can produce.
So how do we know this woman killed because she OD'd on religion? Dogmatic faith is how, and there's irony here.
Question for you. What if you witness a random event of not religious but paranormal and another could verify it? It would be unverifiable because two people could be lying. It is not falsifiable and as a one-off is not repeatable. In other words it is completely outside of the capability of science even in principle. Did it happen or not?
They aren't that rare it is just that real Christians are quiet while fake Christians are loud.Yes, and in the case of Christianity the essential article of faith should be you are loved. People who feel loved express that love to others and don’t kill their children. The mystery of faith is that as the Beatles said, the love you take is equal to the love you make. There is only love. But self hate occludes it. Because self hate is a lie in which we have great faith, an even greater faith can undo it. What you observe is that most of us are of little real faith, and self hate is pervasive delusional state.
We live in a dark world where real Christians are rare.
When you see an illusionist cut off someone's arm and then reattach it, do you assume he has magical powers or do you assume he is just tricking you?
I would never take it on faith that it happened and I hope you expect that nobody else would either.I'll tell you something that happened to me and I've mentioned this before I believe.
I had a dream right before meeting my wife's parents for the first time. Never seen them, not even pictures, and in this dream I was looking out a kitchen window where there was a small pond perhaps 10 meters across surrounded by cattails. In the middle of the pond was a Great Blue Heron, and a frog (couldn't see it but I "knew" it was a frog) playing The Red River Valley on the harmonica. Weird, I know, but I often do my best creative thinking while asleep. It wasn't the strangeness of the dream by the extreme sensory vividness of it.
So I told my soon to be wife every detail of it, end of story.
Well, no.
We arrived at a home I had never seen and went in, introductions all around, you know the usual social interactions. I went into the kitchen and looked out the back window to see the exact same yard with the exact same pond with a Great Blue Heron standing there facing left just like the dream. I called to my wife to come and look and she was pretty much "WTF". Oh, I didn't see a frog but her father was watching an old western were people were sitting around and one was playing the Red River Valley on harmonica.
I could have made it up, an illusion some random firing of neurons, but what I saw was verified outside of myself. Maybe saw pictures and didn't remember? Not impossible, but not with that bird in the same position while a very uncommon song was on the television. Coincidence? Possible but I think if were calculable the specifics would likely require many lifetimes of the universe for it to happen.
This is what happened. It's objective reality and verified. It is wholly incompatible with empirical science. At this point you have two choices, take me on faith or reject my claim. Neither changes a past event. So when it comes to anything someone says along these lines I am skeptical however I also allow for possibilities unseen.
Make of it what you will.
I would never take it on faith that it happened and I hope you expect that nobody else would either.
I am curious. What did your wife say after you told her every detail of your dream? I suspect there is a lot more to the "End of story" part.
Maybe this explains Trump especially the evangelical support. The alternative is sheer stupidityThe problem is that the basic principle of almost every religion is faith. Faith is by definition crazy to a rational mind. You are taught that one of the most desirable human traits is to believe things without any evidence, and even despite contrary evidence.
I always allow for the possibility. I know nothing about anything. When I first read your story, I for some reason thought you were in her parents' house but now I see that was an assumption I made not supported by evidence. Whose house were you in?I don't expect you take me at my word. What I am wondering is if you allow for the possibility. My wife? She said "That's weird", which expressed both our sentiments. This wasn't a premonition in any sense, no "feelings", just a vivid dream with "vivid" being the notable thing. I would have forgotten it entirely.
I always allow for the possibility. I know nothing about anything. When I first read your story, I for some reason thought you were in her parents' house but now I see that was an assumption I made not supported by evidence. Whose house were you in?
No I meant: whose house were you in where you actually saw the heron?I was in her apartment. I lived hundreds of miles away and visited her on weekends. When we got back to her place I went looking for pictures and found only people, not places.
Family members of an 11-year-old girl who investigators say was killed by her mother believe mental illness is not to blame.
Rosa Alcides Rivera is charged with first-degree murder in the death of Aleyda Rivera. Investigators said the girl was stabbed 15 times.
Rosa Rivera’s mother and brother spoke with WESH 2 News outside the Orange County Jail Tuesday. They said they believe Rivera’s actions were calculated and they don’t think she suffers from any mental health issues.
A judge denied Rivera bond on Tuesday and appointed a public defender to represent her.
The 28-year-old Rivera allegedly pulled a knife on workers at Winnie Palmer Hospital before being arrested on Sunday. She later told investigators she killed her daughter to "prevent her from having sex" with men.
Orange County Sheriff John Mina said Monday that there is no evidence Aleyda was being sexually abused and family members have not been able to explain what a motive could be.
“She was always fine. She’s a person of math. She’s a person of science. She calculates everything,"family members said of Rosa Rivera.
Rivera's brother Antonio spoke after the hearing Tuesday. He said he still felt "messed up about the whole situation," and said his sister was "gone, clearly."
Rivera said his sister had been a constant point of trouble and conflict since December. He said she kicked down his door last week, apologizing for saying "foul" things he didn't want to repeat, and begging to come live with him.
"I would never have expected my sister to murder her daughter," Rivera said. "And this brutally!"