World of Warcraft - Circuit City $44.99

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BentValve

Diamond Member
Dec 26, 2001
4,190
0
0
I bought WOW for $40 after PM and coupon at BB, same price as I got EQ2 for.

There is no way I am going to play both of these games and I am not sure why I bought WOW other that I just wanted another reference point since I am new to MMORPGs.

My initial impressions of WOW is that its not as deep as EQ2 but I could see how it could be more fun but maybe not over the long haul.
But then again EQ2 is getting tough for me because I just dont have the time to play more than an hour or 2 a day.

WOW plays just fine at 800x600 on my Geforce 5200 so that says alot...EQ2 is pretty much unplayable, but then again its lowest setting is 1024x768.


I'll play both of these games on and off until the free month is up then I will make up my mind which to play.

 

BentValve

Diamond Member
Dec 26, 2001
4,190
0
0
Money is not an issue for me to a certain point... though if online gaming was cheaper I could afford to keep EQ2 and WOW installed...so from that angle I am kind of pissed that I am forced to keep only one.

So I agree I think the company should give away the game if they are going to charge $15 a month....or charge $20 for the game with one free month.


Has anyone successfully gotten their money back from one of these companies?

Frankly I feel if I dont like the game that they owe me a refund..why? Well they asked $50 for it and I only got to use it for a month and it has virtually no resale value whatsoever.
After 30 days the game is basically a nice looking coaster set.
 

tuigi69

Junior Member
Nov 24, 2004
5
0
0
Actually Bentvalve, your game still has some value. You can sell it on ebay and probably get $20 for it. The buyer would get your account and pony up the other $15 for the month. This is still cheaper than, paying for brand new.
 

Adul

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
32,999
44
91
danny.tangtam.com
Originally posted by: PLaYaHaTeD
Originally posted by: SupaDupaPan
I DO find it funny that people complain about monthly fees. If you don't like it, don't play it, so then you don't have to complain. It's just that simple.

http://www.legendmud.org/raph/gaming/busmodels.html

Read that link, it provides more in depth reason to why it's ALRIGHT and not WRONG of companies to charge per month. Guild Wars is like Diablo 2 ... and well ... diablo 2 was free as well but we all know about all the botting, duping, hacks, and cheats people used in that game ... and how long it took for that patch to come out ... 1.10 was it? More than 1 year from when it was promised.

I read your article.... and compared to the average anandtech reader, this guy doesn't know sh!t. I am disappointed, and a little offended, that you tried to use this to "inform" us.

Lets do a little more math. WOW will sell a million copies. That is a million people paying at least 13 dollars a month, or 13 MILLION dollars each month for blizzard. Now, Lets say bliizard pays 50 guys @ $5000/mo to do extra content and fix bugs, 50 @ $5000/mo guys to keep up your network, and $500,000 a month just on servers for WOW.

Guess what, that equals 13 million/mo profits for 1 million/mo of bills. Give that a year and you've made almost 150 million dollars.

You know what the worst part is? My numbers are SAFE. That's right, they dont have 50 freegin monthly content guys, and they dont pay half a million dollars a month for serverst. The profits are outrageous. Now if you'll excuse me i have to go buy some blizzard stock.....are they even traded in the usa?

you forget costs like bennefits, bandwitdh, rack space in a data center, hardware costs, downtime costs, taxes
 

tuigi69

Junior Member
Nov 24, 2004
5
0
0
And for those, that are complaining about the monthly fees, it's very simple... DON'T BUY IT. For the rest of us, me included, we'll pony up the $50 (probably $40 if you buy it this weekend), and continue the $15 monthly fee. Some people don't understand that MMORPG are like bars and clubs. You don't go to bars and clubs for the booze or the music (afterall you can get all that stuff at home for a heck of a lot cheaper), you go for the people. I play MMORPG's for the human interaction. If I wanted to play just a regular RPG by myself, then I'd just play ToEE or Morrowind. But it's nice to play with or against other human beings. It adds a whole new dimension to the game.

For the $15 monthly, its probably the most bang for the buck. I figure that I get in 100/month (conservative estimate, I'm an addict). $15.00/100hrs = 15 cents / hour. Compare that with many other activities that we do. Movies - $10 each for 2 hrs = $5/hr. Most normal games - $50 for 20 - 40 hrs = $2.5 to $1.25/hr. Smoking - $5 a pack (1 cig = 10 min) for 3.33 hrs = $1.50/hr.

I'm not trying to convince people to go out and buy a MMORPG, I'm just showing those people how we think.

EVERYONE is out to make money. How much money, THEY make is dependent upon how much value they give to US. If they don't give much value, they won't make much money. Simple. Look at Saga of Ryzom. This game sucks, and only after a couple months after release, they are offering free trials. Usually MMORPG's offer free trials, after a year or two when the game starts getting old.

I've played Wow both Stress Tests and open Beta, and Blizzard is VERY Good at meeting the players needs. They support Cosmos ( a third party app, that enhances the interface). During the first stress test, 100k people signed up. They had too many servers in beta (LOL) and weren't getting the data they needed, so they moved everybody to only a couple servers. They also extended the stress by about a week. I still didn't see any lag. I was in it for the second stress test. Still no lag. I didn't see lag until open beta, when HALF A MILLION accounts were created. Boy did I see lag. But Blizzard implemented a number cap to each server as a stop gap measurement, while they rapidly added additional servers. I think they wound up adding an additional 20 servers to the ones they already had. This allowed players that were in a good level of playability. If you logged on and were on a waiting list for a particular server, then you could easily change servers to one that wasn't and play another character. Which I did on a number of occasions.

When they released WoW to retail, it was ready to be released. Not like Lineage 2, SoR, or EQ2 (from what I heard).

I was at the midnight release of WoW at Fry's in Fountain Valley (LOL did I mention, I was an addict), and got to meet the dev's. I guy next to me, asked one of the dev's how they felt now that the game was released and they had some time off. The dev smiled at him and told him "What time off?" Apparently, they are all going right back in after Thanksgiving, to work on any bugs that pop up and work on adding content.

From these actions, I have no problems in forking over $50 for the game (actually it was $80 for the collectors edition. Did I mention I was an ADDICT), and $15 a month. Actually I'm getting the 3 month sub so it's cheaper.

WoW is not as group oriented as EQ2. But you still have to group if you want to do the "Elite" quests, which is where you get all the really good gear. The graphics aren't as good right now, as EQ2, but the lag in the cities is virtually non-existant. And definitely not to the point that it's unplayable.

Well there's my two cents.
 

gizbug

Platinum Member
May 14, 2001
2,621
0
76
Originally posted by: Thoreau
Should be free since you have to pay monthly to play it anyway.

A Men to that
Thanks for the post, but PAY to PLAY = No WAY
 

deldd

Golden Member
May 14, 2004
1,383
0
0
Originally posted by: tuigi69
And for those, that are complaining about the monthly fees, it's very simple... DON'T BUY IT. For the rest of us, me included, we'll pony up the $50 (probably $40 if you buy it this weekend), and continue the $15 monthly fee. Some people don't understand that MMORPG are like bars and clubs. You don't go to bars and clubs for the booze or the music (afterall you can get all that stuff at home for a heck of a lot cheaper), you go for the people. I play MMORPG's for the human interaction. If I wanted to play just a regular RPG by myself, then I'd just play ToEE or Morrowind. But it's nice to play with or against other human beings. It adds a whole new dimension to the game.

For the $15 monthly, its probably the most bang for the buck. I figure that I get in 100/month (conservative estimate, I'm an addict). $15.00/100hrs = 15 cents / hour. Compare that with many other activities that we do. Movies - $10 each for 2 hrs = $5/hr. Most normal games - $50 for 20 - 40 hrs = $2.5 to $1.25/hr. Smoking - $5 a pack (1 cig = 10 min) for 3.33 hrs = $1.50/hr.

I'm not trying to convince people to go out and buy a MMORPG, I'm just showing those people how we think.

EVERYONE is out to make money. How much money, THEY make is dependent upon how much value they give to US. If they don't give much value, they won't make much money. Simple. Look at Saga of Ryzom. This game sucks, and only after a couple months after release, they are offering free trials. Usually MMORPG's offer free trials, after a year or two when the game starts getting old.

I've played Wow both Stress Tests and open Beta, and Blizzard is VERY Good at meeting the players needs. They support Cosmos ( a third party app, that enhances the interface). During the first stress test, 100k people signed up. They had too many servers in beta (LOL) and weren't getting the data they needed, so they moved everybody to only a couple servers. They also extended the stress by about a week. I still didn't see any lag. I was in it for the second stress test. Still no lag. I didn't see lag until open beta, when HALF A MILLION accounts were created. Boy did I see lag. But Blizzard implemented a number cap to each server as a stop gap measurement, while they rapidly added additional servers. I think they wound up adding an additional 20 servers to the ones they already had. This allowed players that were in a good level of playability. If you logged on and were on a waiting list for a particular server, then you could easily change servers to one that wasn't and play another character. Which I did on a number of occasions.

When they released WoW to retail, it was ready to be released. Not like Lineage 2, SoR, or EQ2 (from what I heard).

I was at the midnight release of WoW at Fry's in Fountain Valley (LOL did I mention, I was an addict), and got to meet the dev's. I guy next to me, asked one of the dev's how they felt now that the game was released and they had some time off. The dev smiled at him and told him "What time off?" Apparently, they are all going right back in after Thanksgiving, to work on any bugs that pop up and work on adding content.

From these actions, I have no problems in forking over $50 for the game (actually it was $80 for the collectors edition. Did I mention I was an ADDICT), and $15 a month. Actually I'm getting the 3 month sub so it's cheaper.

WoW is not as group oriented as EQ2. But you still have to group if you want to do the "Elite" quests, which is where you get all the really good gear. The graphics aren't as good right now, as EQ2, but the lag in the cities is virtually non-existant. And definitely not to the point that it's unplayable.

Well there's my two cents.


That's a lot of smokin'.
 

tc17

Member
Nov 25, 2002
135
0
0
I had thought of maybe trying World Of Warcraft because the reviews are pretty good. That was until I read what their insane monthly fee is ($15).

I can get unlimited dialup internet access for cheaper than what they charge for a monthly fee. Which defeats any opinion that they can't afford less per month.

Everquest 1 is cheaper per month (even after they raised their price), and so is Dark Age Of Camelot. Personally I am shocked by the number of people who actually believe that this monthly fee only goes for server costs. They are making big bucks off the monthly fee. Many people probably only play a couple days a week also.

Then they also rake in more bigs bucks for every expansion/patch they come out with.

I suppose if you have a nice paying job in life its fine for you. I think they just keep raising the price to see how long they can get away with it before people stop paying.
 

SupaDupaPan

Golden Member
Jun 1, 2004
1,071
0
76
Originally posted by: tc17
I had thought of maybe trying World Of Warcraft because the reviews are pretty good. That was until I read what their insane monthly fee is ($15).

I can get unlimited dialup internet access for cheaper than what they charge for a monthly fee. Which defeats any opinion that they can't afford less per month.

Everquest 1 is cheaper per month (even after they raised their price), and so is Dark Age Of Camelot. Personally I am shocked by the number of people who actually believe that this monthly fee only goes for server costs. They are making big bucks off the monthly fee. Many people probably only play a couple days a week also.

Then they also rake in more bigs bucks for every expansion/patch they come out with.

I suppose if you have a nice paying job in life its fine for you. I think they just keep raising the price to see how long they can get away with it before people stop paying.

Wow, someone apparently didn't read through the posts to see that people don't think it only goes towards server costs. It's $15 a month, you pay more for dinner & a movie ... $15, isn't even 1 tank of gas for me. Honestly, it's saved me MORE money by playing WoW than going out and entertaining myself other ways. I've been on the same tank of gas for 3 weeks now I'm damn happy I'm not paying that $25 each week to my car just to go out and have fun!

 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
Originally posted by: PLaYaHaTeD
Originally posted by: SupaDupaPan
I DO find it funny that people complain about monthly fees. If you don't like it, don't play it, so then you don't have to complain. It's just that simple.

http://www.legendmud.org/raph/gaming/busmodels.html

Read that link, it provides more in depth reason to why it's ALRIGHT and not WRONG of companies to charge per month. Guild Wars is like Diablo 2 ... and well ... diablo 2 was free as well but we all know about all the botting, duping, hacks, and cheats people used in that game ... and how long it took for that patch to come out ... 1.10 was it? More than 1 year from when it was promised.

I read your article.... and compared to the average anandtech reader, this guy doesn't know sh!t. I am disappointed, and a little offended, that you tried to use this to "inform" us.

Lets do a little more math. WOW will sell a million copies. That is a million people paying at least 13 dollars a month, or 13 MILLION dollars each month for blizzard. Now, Lets say bliizard pays 50 guys @ $5000/mo to do extra content and fix bugs, 50 @ $5000/mo guys to keep up your network, and $500,000 a month just on servers for WOW.

Guess what, that equals 13 million/mo profits for 1 million/mo of bills. Give that a year and you've made almost 150 million dollars.

You know what the worst part is? My numbers are SAFE. That's right, they dont have 50 freegin monthly content guys, and they dont pay half a million dollars a month for serverst. The profits are outrageous. Now if you'll excuse me i have to go buy some blizzard stock.....are they even traded in the usa?

Umm you forgot that each server is $200,000 paid upfront...
 

wangtony

Junior Member
Jun 27, 2004
7
0
0
CompUSA $39.99 (regular edition) !!

I thought it's a great price, not sure if it's available for delivery online

Edit: instore only
LINK
 

cnicol

Senior member
Feb 1, 2000
228
0
76
Originally posted by: wangtony
CompUSA $39.99 (regular edition) !!

I thought it's a great price, not sure if it's available for delivery online

Edit: instore only
LINK

Not bad.
I bought my copy at CircuitCity...I wonder if they would match the price now if I went back with my receipt.


 

Quixotic

Senior member
Oct 16, 2001
662
0
0
Originally posted by: HemanC
Originally posted by: KevinH
Originally posted by: ReiAyanami
top best selling game, the mere interest earned from the profit sitting in the bank would be enough to provide 3 years of support.

Yeah great idea. Take their profits and use it to finance the support because obviously they're not supposed to make any profit.

If this is true, they probably are still losing money on Diablo, StarCraft, WarCraft because BNet is FREE.

Starcraft and Warcraft offset computer resources onto the players' computers, so they're a bit different. I don't remember how Diablo worked, but in the end, you guys have to remember that each product a company sells isn't strictly limited to financing itself. They often pay for upkeep costs of older software. And yes, companies are entitled to make whatever money they can. Otherwise, there is no incentive for research & development. The key is the law of supply and demand. In the long run, the sellers sell for how much the buyers are willing to pay.
 

Quixotic

Senior member
Oct 16, 2001
662
0
0
Originally posted by: KAMAZON
Give me a break. They only have 40 servers for Gods sake, and bandwith?? You must be kidding me. On this very same forum you can find a link to Verizon offering 15Mb Download and 5Mb upload in the city of Keller Tx. for only $50 a month. We're talking about millions of dollars of pure cash income on a daily basis.

My point is still valid. I have debunked any theory of 'having to charge this much to pay for maintenance'. If you include ALL of the maintenance fees and so fourth, you're still not going to come anywhere near as much as this game makes a mnoth.

Still valid? Haha, that remains to be argued from the looks of your numbers.

I'm glad you're not in the business. You're comparing bandwidth costs to Verizon's prices for home lines? Mind you, these are 15mbps/2mbps lines (read MEGABIT). Good luck handling all the traffic with that.

I know this isn't exactly fair, but with the gift of hindsight, there are currently 384k players on all servers. That's not the number of accounts -- just the number of characters. If we use the 2.4:1 character-to-account ratio from FFXI, we have about 160k active accounts. Even back in November, 500k would have been an optimistic estimate considering FFXI took 2 years to get to that number. Assuming everyone paid $15 a month, WoW took in less than $2.4 mil in subscription payments. This is hardly "millions of dollars of pure cash income on a daily basis" -- each of the 88 servers accounts for less than $27k in the first month. Of course, the number of accounts will increase over time. So yes, eventually, given a successful product, they will break even and then start making a profit. But even then, they are not in the clear. They still have to account for a time when profitability once again goes into the gutter, when the next big MMORPG arrives and WoW's subscriptions dwindles. A MMORPGs natural life continues on even when you and I, and perhaps most of its subscribers, grow tired of the game.

Do you know how much money Microsoft spent on advertising the launch of the XBox? Microsoft and other investors topped $1 bil by the end of 2002. Certainly, WoW has not been advertised on nearly the same scale, but it might help you realize the actual scale of business costs.

The infrastructure on which MMORPGs are built are enormously expensive. There is always an expectation that the product may not sell, and what then? How long is a morally okay amount of time for a company to wait before finally breaking even? And remember, companies don't sell products and services in order to break even.

Lastly, some of the figures I've seen quoted for salaries seem a bit low? Granted, an entry-level programmer would probably make about 45k, but systems/network analysts seem to have an entry-level salary of about 55k (these numbers from a school that is only about 40th of all Engineering schools). I'm thinking that a fair amount of the developers are probably not entry-level, and even if the network admins and what not were, the 50k number still seems a bit low.

But hey, if you really want to know where your money goes, consider this: my friend will probably make about 45k + bonuses as a first-year consultant in SF. During her internship with the same company last year, they put her up in a NYC apt with a monthly rent in the $6500-7000 range (all paid, of course). I personally think that was a bit of a waste, but hey, what do I know? If I tried to stick my potential employees in $1000/mo NYC apts, I probably wouldn't be attracting the creme of the crop. =P
 

thenotebook

Banned
Dec 8, 2004
212
0
0
Originally posted by: STiSev
WHAT THE FUCK?

You have to BUY the game AND pay a subscription fee?

??

Have you been sleeping under a rock all these years and never once heard of MMORPGs?
 

Sheena

Member
Sep 28, 2004
27
0
0
If you don't think the game is worth what they're charging for it, vote with your wallet and don't buy or play it. Simple as that.

There are tons of things i don't buy because I don't think they're worth the money. This is just another decision. If tons of people play those games and are ready to pay what Blizzard or Sony charge them for it, why should they change their business model?
 

wetcat007

Diamond Member
Nov 5, 2002
3,502
0
0
Originally posted by: powdahound
Originally posted by: PLaYaHaTeD
As the pricing stands now, its basically a license for Blizzard to print money. Or grow it on trees.
Shoot, they might as well have found the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. The BIG pot, not that tiny one on the cover of Lucky Charms.
Shame on them for coming up with a fun game that people want to play! They deserve to make money. Besides, most games are $50 new these days, and other MMO games are around this same price range.

This is better than most MMO's and great fun..
 

abaez

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
7,158
1
81
Originally posted by: Tomato
At Comp USA, WOW is $39.99

Do any compusa's even have it in stock? I checked like 15+ stores this weekend and NONE had it.
 

zerodeefex

Senior member
Jan 31, 2004
476
0
76
I went to SEVERAL at opening on the first day of the sale, all sold out. They checked every store for 50 miles and not a single store had a copy in. All week it's been the same...
 

GreggyD

Member
Aug 2, 2000
97
0
0
Originally posted by: STiSev
WHAT THE FUCK?

You have to BUY the game AND pay a subscription fee?

??

Been living under that rock for the past 8 years, eh? Glad you came out.

 

Dragonbate

Senior member
Mar 1, 2004
324
0
0
Voted with my wallet...didnt buy it, won't buy it...This is the first Blizz title that i won't buy. Before this I've gotten every on on principal. For anyone else who feels that games should't become a monthly bill try http://www.planeshift.it/main_01.html. Its still very much beta but its Free!
 
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