Worst offender yet....

[Gstanfor]

Thilan, just how thick are you???

GF4 4200 has sweet f**ck all to do with GF-FX5200/5500.

They are different DX versions, different GPU families, one is budget, one is mainstream. If you want to compare FX5200/5500 to anything GF4 era, you'll have to compare it to GF4MX.

If you want a GF4 4200 comparison, the 5700 is equivelant in terms of product positioning and 5900XT is equivelant in terms of best bang for buck in the family.

 

[crazydingo]

lol at the guys fighting over this, its fake. You can all relax.

 

[Gstanfor]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
One wonders why they would father all these bastards in the first place given that they and their fans claim ATi set off the DX9 revolution... 18 months of DX9 leadership ATi had and hardly a DX9 game to show for it... Of course selling mountains of cheap DX8 hardware to the lowend couldn't have possibly had anything to do with it - it was all nVIDIA's fault, according to the fanATics...

what are you babbling about now?


ATi doesn't programme games.
:roll:

their graph is evidently accurate
[IF it is even ATi's]

and they dont use Viral Marketing to our forums.

i'll take ATi's marketing over nVidia's, ANY day.

What am I babbling about? in the 18 months ATi could clearly claim leadership in DX9 there were hardly any DX9 games released save (hL2 right at the tailend and BribeMark03 and they cost ATi well over 5 million to get out there). Everything else with DX9 content (not much - some halo effects and TR:AOD) came from developers in the TWIMTBP program. Developers (mostly) ignored ATi totally (just like with truform etc in the past). Developers don't ignore nVIDIA...

 

[Avalon]

Gee, more pointless bickering in a video thread, who would have thought?
Here's a hint for a couple of you out there:

Drop the attitudes?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
One wonders why they would father all these bastards in the first place given that they and their fans claim ATi set off the DX9 revolution... 18 months of DX9 leadership ATi had and hardly a DX9 game to show for it... Of course selling mountains of cheap DX8 hardware to the lowend couldn't have possibly had anything to do with it - it was all nVIDIA's fault, according to the fanATics...

what are you babbling about now?


ATi doesn't programme games.
:roll:

their graph is evidently accurate
[IF it is even ATi's]

and they dont use Viral Marketing to our forums.

i'll take ATi's marketing over nVidia's, ANY day.

What am I babbling about? in the 18 months ATi could clearly claim leadership in DX9 there were hardly any DX9 games released save (hL2 right at the tailend and BribeMark03 and they cost ATi well over 5 million to get out there). Everything else with DX9 content (not much - some halo effects and TR:AOD) came from developers in the TWIMTBP program. Developers (mostly) ignored ATi totally (just like with truform etc in the past). Developers don't ignore nVIDIA...

as i suspected . . . you clearly have no clue . . . and you have managed to drag this JOKE topic even more OT [if possible] into an anti-ATi FUD thread..

Full DX9 games took THREE years to programme AFTER the DX9 HW and codecs was released. Didn't matter who was 'leader'.
:roll:

although - as you point out - nVidia is know for their strong arm tactics all throughout the industry.

edited

 

[n7]

Haha

Good stuff.

I always get a laugh outta those ridiculously disproportionate graphs

 

[Cookie Monster]

Originally posted by: Avalon
Gee, more pointless bickering in a video thread, who would have thought?
Here's a hint for a couple of you out there:

Drop the attitudes?

QFT. Bah, creig why did you have to bring NV PR slides that was used .. er um.. 3years ago maybe?

This is ridiculous. Here everyone can have free cookies. :brokenheart:

edit - PR slides always make my day though :laugh:

 

[Gstanfor]

as i suspected . . . you clearly have no clue . . . and you have managed to drag this JOKE topic even more OT [if possible] into an anti-ATi FUD thread..

Full DX9 games took THREE years to programme AFTER the DX9 HW and codecs was released. Didn't matter who was 'leader'.


although - as you point out - nVidia is know for their strong arm tactics all throughout the industry.

That's not what the FanATics were screaming around the forums at the time. According to them nVIDIA "forced" developers to program for DX8 only and the market would otherwise have been awash with DX9 titles...

nVIDIA is known in the industry for their developer support - the same can't be said of ATi (until quite recently, and even then most developers say nVIDIA still provides FAR more support than ATi).

and on the "DX8 forcing" issue, even a 5200 can run HL2 in DX9 mode - just open "dxsupport.cfg" and for all 5500/5200 entries change like so:

original entry

"304"
{
"name" "NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x017B"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x017B"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "800"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "80"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"

Modified entry

"304"
{
"name" "NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x017B"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x017B"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "800"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "90"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"

So much for ATi's $5 million game not being able to run in DX9 mode on lowend GF-FX...

 

[Avalon]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor

as i suspected . . . you clearly have no clue . . . and you have managed to drag this JOKE topic even more OT [if possible] into an anti-ATi FUD thread..

Full DX9 games took THREE years to programme AFTER the DX9 HW and codecs was released. Didn't matter who was 'leader'.


although - as you point out - nVidia is know for their strong arm tactics all throughout the industry.

That's not what the FanATics were screaming around the forums at the time. According to them nVIDIA "forced" developers to program for DX8 only and the market would otherwise have been awash with DX9 titles...

nVIDIA is known in the industry for their developer support - the same can't be said of ATi (until quite recently, and even then most developers say nVIDIA still provides FAR more support than ATi).

and on the "DX8 forcing" issue, even a 5200 can run HL2 in DX9 mode - just open "dxsupport.cfg" and for all 5500/5200 entries change like so:

original entry

"304"
{
"name" "NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x017B"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x017B"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "800"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "80"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"

Modified entry

"304"
{
"name" "NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x017B"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x017B"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "800"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "90"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"

So much for ATi's $5 million game not being able to run in DX9 mode on lowend GF-FX...

Who said an FX couldn't run in DX9 mode? From what I'm seeing, everyone here is already well aware of that.

 

[thilanliyan]

You still don't get my point. And you still haven't answered why NVidia left out their OWN lack of performance. And I think this is the case cause it was the marketing department that left out the info. That's ALL I'm saying. I'll end it there on my part.

 

[Gstanfor]

That's because you don't have a point thilan29. The slide was discussing current (at the time) products, not former products.

About nVidia's own performance, that's not what the slide was all about. Try reading what the slide actually says instead of what you want it to mean!

 

[ronnn]

So did this slide showing Ati barely winning one benchmark actually encourage people to relive old wounds regarding the fx days? I admit that shader days did lead to one of the funniest nights on the web, but old history now. I assume if Nv had a small lead, we would have seen the whole graph perfectly scaled with no exaggeration. I am pretty sure that nv would never put 512mb ram on a lower end card that had no hope of using it.

 

[BFG10K]

This sort of graph is nothing new and I've seen it many times.

 

[Gstanfor]

Originally posted by: ronnn
So did this slide showing Ati barely winning one benchmark actually encourage people to relive old wounds regarding the fx days? I admit that shader days did lead to one of the funniest nights on the web, but old history now. I assume if Nv had a small lead, we would have seen the whole graph perfectly scaled with no exaggeration. I am pretty sure that nv would never put 512mb ram on a lower end card that had no hope of using it.

Sadly, board vendors for either IHV are not above such nonsense. You'd think Sapphire might know better, I expect this sort of nonsense from XFX.

ATi

nVIDIA

 

[ronnn]

Why would anyone expect better out of Sapphire? I once bought a 9600 pro Advantage. The advantage being markedly slower ram.

 

[Gstanfor]

They are supposedly one of ATi's most trusted board makers and even make the PCB's for ATi branded cards. I've always found this to be somewhat curious myself given the companys history and close association with PC Chips (an infamous company that shouldn't need an introduction to anyone knowing anything about PC hardware).

 

[ronnn]

Sapphire makes high quality stuff, but like all of these companies, profit is more important than value. I find it funny that you seem to think that nvidia and their partners are any different. This world is buyer beware.

 

[Gstanfor]

XFX (formerly known as Pine) is nVIDIA's worst board partner IMHO. Everyone else produces very good quality products and has a reputable background. Do you know why PC Chips and their sattelite companies/brands are infamous throughout the PC component world ronnn?

 

[hemmy]

If that was made by ATI why would it say X7900GTX, not Geforce...they said it was in an email no telling where it came from.

 

[FalllenAngell]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
XFX (formerly known as Pine) is nVIDIA's worst board partner IMHO. Everyone else produces very good quality products and has a reputable background. Do you know why PC Chips and their sattelite companies/brands are infamous throughout the PC component world ronnn?

For selling substandard components under many different names? (Alton, PCWave, etc)

 

[Gstanfor]

"substandard components" is an understatements understatement where PC Chips is concerned...

Click1
Click2 (see ECS K7S5A entry)
Click3
Click4

The above is just a small sampler of the company's sordid past. They and rogue tax avoiding asian computer dealers very nearly ruined the personal computer industry in Australia at one point. They are also quite fond of soldering cpu's to mainboards in order to cut costs among many other things. Google is your friend.

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Typical ATi PR bullsh!t - what more is there to say?

Of course nVidia would NEVER stoop to giving misleading data.

http://www.elitebastards.com/page.php?pageid=4929&head=1&comments=1

http://addict3d.org/index.php?page=view...le=Nvidia%20Presentations%20-%20Leaked

http://www.addict3d.org/img/48c798a1c9bebbfe.jpg

That's actually comical. Nvidia pointing out that the ATI 9250 is slower than a 9200, yet their own 5200 is slower than a 4200.


Give it a rest already Gstanfor. Yes, it is a sad attempt to show that X1900 Crossfire is ever-so-slightly faster than the upcoming X7900 GTX SLI in 3DMark 05, but this is what PR Departments in BOTH companies are paid to do.

i like how they only use Doom3 for comparison on teh 9250 case LLOLOLOLOL

 

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Typical ATi PR bullsh!t - what more is there to say?

Typical that you believe ATi did this, where there are zero facts to back it up. You are sad, really.

 

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Corporate Thug

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Typical ATi PR bullsh!t - what more is there to say?

yup, only comes from one company. Nvidia NEVER spread FUD like this...

Well, at least not today. So ATI deserves to get bashed for this today. Who knows what tomorrow will bring.

Where does it say ATi sent it? Oh wait, it doesnt. They said they have no idea where it came from. Pretty typical of you to believe its from ATi though. Where if you look at the facts that we have, there is no proof of it at all. In fact, it looks pretty fake. But hey, thats just using common sense.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor
That's because you don't have a point thilan29. The slide was discussing current (at the time) products, not former products.

About nVidia's own performance, that's not what the slide was all about. Try reading what the slide actually says instead of what you want it to mean!

So what exactly was the point you were trying to make by saying "typical ATI PR BS"?? Someone else linked to NVidia doing the same thing and you tried to be anal about it and say "well it IS true isn't it?". So the exact same way...(if the numbers from the graph are in fact true) then why is the slide from the OP BS?? You have no actual proof that the numbers are BS but you call it that.

Your argument is that the numbers look skewed because of the scaling and make ATI look better? SO WHAT??? Doesn't make them false right? IN THE SAME way, NVidia skewed their slide by failing to mention their own lack of performance. Sure what they wrote about the 9200/9250 may have been true but it wasn't the whole story right?? Just as the slide from the OP may not actually be lying but wasn't telling the whole story. You seem to love defending NVidia and don't admit that they do the EXACT same thing. Anyone that knows a bit about how those companies work will tell you that they both do the same thing.

And as to your last sentence...I NEVER said the slide was about their own performance (even though if they are comparing performance they SHOULD include their own)...I just said they weren't telling the whole story...which BOTH companies are guilty of. Actually both MARKETING departments from each company do that.

Do you honestly actually believe that NVidia doesn't bend the truth a bit in their marketing slides or at least don't give the whole story??