Would you accept full pardon for Trump in exchange for his resignation?

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dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
25,214
3,626
126
What has he done to be a dictator?
The typical steps toward new dictatorships in the history of the world have involved many of these:
 

Blue_Max

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2011
4,227
153
106
This is what minority rule looks like, folks.

No. That would be those in the vocal minority calling the shots and changing laws to suit that minority while punishing the larger population.
...like the leftist controlled media.
...like sharia-compliance (or leniency) in western nations.
...like forcing a population to comply with odd, unusual, or non-existent gender pronouns on demand or face punishment.

Not looking good for your side there.... but that's why it's finally starting to lose traction, lose supporters, and lose ground.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
23,651
10,515
136
Sure, impeachment is not about convicting people of crimes it's about protecting the country from dangerous or incompetent leaders. I don't care much what happens to him when he's no longer president as then he's just another rich, bloviating asshole.
What ever it takes to get the shit stain as far away from the football as possible.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
No. That would be those in the vocal minority calling the shots and changing laws to suit that minority while punishing the larger population.
...like the leftist controlled media.
...like sharia-compliance (or leniency) in western nations.
...like forcing a population to comply with odd, unusual, or non-existent gender pronouns on demand or face punishment.

Not looking good for your side there.... but that's why it's finally starting to lose traction, lose supporters, and lose ground.
You coward. Ill-informed and lacking for all integrity.
 

Blue_Max

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2011
4,227
153
106
You coward. Ill-informed and lacking for all integrity.
Screaming a baseless insult is not a rebuttal, or even an argument.
You wanna' say I'm wrong, tell everyone specifically HOW I'm wrong and what "correct" is.

[edit] Same goes to V.G. below.
 
Last edited:
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
11,718
136
It's hard to believe that one can be as willfully ignorant as this and still be able to find the floor upon waking each morning.

No. That would be those in the vocal minority calling the shots and changing laws to suit that minority while punishing the larger population.
...like the leftist controlled media.
...like sharia-compliance (or leniency) in western nations.
...like forcing a population to comply with odd, unusual, or non-existent gender pronouns on demand or face punishment.

Not looking good for your side there.... but that's why it's finally starting to lose traction, lose supporters, and lose ground.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
No. I remember Nixon and his pardon and the debate then. I was young and brash and I rejected any pardon. Years later I came around to Ford's thinking regarding not making the national scar even deeper but this is wholly different.

Nixon did wrong for petty reasons. He did break the law, but in his official capacity there's no reason to believe that he would burn the world down to defend his ego. Trump on the other had has committed many evil acts just because he could, being the emperor he imagines himself to be. Trump hasn't demonstrated that he knows what wrong is, at least as it applies to himself. He's a much worse person than Nixon and I'd wager that Trump thinks he can do anything he pleases and get away with it, either by force of wil or by pardon. A person who takes glee in ruination does not deserve a pardon, and in his case it would be a terrible thing. Escaping consequences gives future contenders a basis to believe any egregious act can and will be forgiven with no possible consequence.

I cannot abide that.
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
1,594
126
No. I remember Nixon and his pardon and the debate then. I was young and brash and I rejected any pardon. Years later I came around to Ford's thinking regarding not making the national scar even deeper but this is wholly different.

Nixon did wrong for petty reasons. He did break the law, but in his official capacity there's no reason to believe that he would burn the world down to defend his ego. Trump on the other had has committed many evil acts just because he could, being the emperor he imagines himself to be. Trump hasn't demonstrated that he knows what wrong is, at least as it applies to himself. He's a much worse person than Nixon and I'd wager that Trump thinks he can do anything he pleases and get away with it, either by force of wil or by pardon. A person who takes glee in ruination does not deserve a pardon, and in his case it would be a terrible thing. Escaping consequences gives future contenders a basis to believe any egregious act can and will be forgiven with no possible consequence.

I cannot abide that.
I sympathize but, you know what they call those who seek justice?


Martyrs.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,511
27,814
136
The problem with the Nixon pardon wasn't Nixon. The problem is that it gave a green light to Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush, Obama, and Trump to defy the Constitution with impunity. And they used it. It was a terrible precedent. Obviously, craven Congresses bear more blame for run-amok Presidents than Ford's pardon but the pardon sent a clear signal that Presidents would dodge criminal charges.
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
1,594
126
The problem with the Nixon pardon wasn't Nixon. The problem is that it gave a green light to Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush, Obama, and Trump to defy the Constitution with impunity. And they used it. It was a terrible precedent. Obviously, craven Congresses bear more blame for run-amok Presidents than Ford's pardon but the pardon sent a clear signal that Presidents would dodge criminal charges.
Next, you'll be telling us the wealthy have privileges we don't.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,022
38,501
136
The only way I can see myself being cool with that would be if he took down the likes of Sessions, Pence, Ryan, McConnell, etc, with him.

The immediate relief to the country might just be worth letting that traitorous orange dipshit go, but part of me still wants to see his pathetic ass rot in Leavenworth. He not only deserves it, but we desperately need an example to be made to these banana republicans, who seem bent on corrupting the constitution and American democracy as a whole.
 
Reactions: Azuma Hazuki

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
Screaming a baseless insult is not a rebuttal, or even an argument.
You wanna' say I'm wrong, tell everyone specifically HOW I'm wrong and what "correct" is.

[edit] Same goes to V.G. below.
No one is screaming, coward. I am just describing your utter lack of character and value.

I owe you nothing. You owe this whole damn board an apology.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
No. I remember Nixon and his pardon and the debate then. I was young and brash and I rejected any pardon. Years later I came around to Ford's thinking regarding not making the national scar even deeper but this is wholly different.

Nixon did wrong for petty reasons. He did break the law, but in his official capacity there's no reason to believe that he would burn the world down to defend his ego. Trump on the other had has committed many evil acts just because he could, being the emperor he imagines himself to be. Trump hasn't demonstrated that he knows what wrong is, at least as it applies to himself. He's a much worse person than Nixon and I'd wager that Trump thinks he can do anything he pleases and get away with it, either by force of wil or by pardon. A person who takes glee in ruination does not deserve a pardon, and in his case it would be a terrible thing. Escaping consequences gives future contenders a basis to believe any egregious act can and will be forgiven with no possible consequence.

I cannot abide that.

Yes, but all of those reasons you gave why Trump is so awful are also an argument that his presidency needs to end ASAP for the good of country. If the question is posed as, would you rather have Trump leave office tomorrow and not be prosecuted, or finish a 4 year term, be voted out, then prosecuted, the terribleness of Trump kind of cuts both ways. The good of the country cuts one way but perhaps the moral principle cuts the other. It's debatable.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Yes, but all of those reasons you gave why Trump is so awful are also an argument that his presidency needs to end ASAP for the good of country. If the question is posed as, would you rather have Trump leave office tomorrow and not be prosecuted, or finish a 4 year term, be voted out, then prosecuted, the terribleness of Trump kind of cuts both ways. The good of the country cuts one way but perhaps the moral principle cuts the other. It's debatable.

If it came to it I'd say get him out but I think the likely scenario is that Trump will resign or be forced out by the weight of evidence against him, showing specifically his disregard for the nation he is to serve. I also believe that he will be pardoned. In the case of getting out with hands clean or his face rightfully rubbed in the truth, which would you take?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,806
29,558
146
No. I remember Nixon and his pardon and the debate then. I was young and brash and I rejected any pardon. Years later I came around to Ford's thinking regarding not making the national scar even deeper but this is wholly different.

Nixon did wrong for petty reasons. He did break the law, but in his official capacity there's no reason to believe that he would burn the world down to defend his ego. Trump on the other had has committed many evil acts just because he could, being the emperor he imagines himself to be. Trump hasn't demonstrated that he knows what wrong is, at least as it applies to himself. He's a much worse person than Nixon and I'd wager that Trump thinks he can do anything he pleases and get away with it, either by force of wil or by pardon. A person who takes glee in ruination does not deserve a pardon, and in his case it would be a terrible thing. Escaping consequences gives future contenders a basis to believe any egregious act can and will be forgiven with no possible consequence.

I cannot abide that.

Do you ever get the feeling that he gets so mad every night around the same time--after about 5 straight hours of News absorption that speaks only his name, and every single nugget that mentions his name (seriously, this has been reported, several times over many years as his nightly ritual (and pretty much what he would do in the office all day)). LoL, that's actually been his job, when you think about the amount of daily hours he has spent, his entire professional life, absorbing public information about himself.

Anyhoo, back on target: Do you ever get the feeling that he gets so angry, he honestly demands a target to strike with nukes, just randomly, at whoever is in the room waiting for orders? I mean, I would believe it. Probably half jokingly, of course, but with terrified advisors that are never quite sure. And they probably just eat it every night. Apparently, Nixon used to toss back about 7 snifters every night, and on at least 3 documented evenings, he actually ordered very clear, and very serious nuclear strikes on USSR targets and I think, maybe, one on Cambodia. Don't remember the time period, but it could have been during those final 3 years when he was being dogged. One of his men mentioned this in an interview (he received those orders on one of those nights, directly from Nixon, and he was supposed to send it to Joint Chiefs, I think, but he and some other staffers just agreed to let it die in their hands, because Nixon usually nodded off at that point every evening, and would have a few "gaps" from the previous night, upon waking. )

I honestly don't doubt that the dude has, at the very least, joked with staffers about launching nukes. I wonder if he's tried to pick up some interns with a line like that? :hmm:
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,806
29,558
146
The problem with the Nixon pardon wasn't Nixon. The problem is that it gave a green light to Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush, Obama, and Trump to defy the Constitution with impunity. And they used it. It was a terrible precedent. Obviously, craven Congresses bear more blame for run-amok Presidents than Ford's pardon but the pardon sent a clear signal that Presidents would dodge criminal charges.

that's a very good point.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,806
29,558
146
Anyone get the feeling that the Feds are going to be dragging a furious Trump out of the O office, as he desperately grasps at the floor and the legs of the Resolute desk, bunching up the carpet as his hand reaches, reaches behind the desk, uttering these lines

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYPsoxpt0BU

And he stretches for a small button on the inside panel, thinking it's the "nucular launch button" and gleefully, joyfully, maniacally mashes it. (it's really the buzzer for his secretary, by the way).

That would be pretty awesome, actually.
 

Azuma Hazuki

Golden Member
Jun 18, 2012
1,532
866
131
@Hayabusa Rider: IMO, not raking Nixon over the coals is what allowed this modern redux to happen. I see where you're coming from about not wanting to cut the "national scar" deeper, but what we're dealing with here (and were dealing with then...) was more akin to a purulent abcess than any external wound. It ought to have been lanced and drained, not left to fester for 40+ years.
 

Blue_Max

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2011
4,227
153
106
No one is screaming, coward. I am just describing your utter lack of character and value.

I owe you nothing. You owe this whole damn board an apology.

Well, you heard 'im, folks. Whether it's Trump, me, you, or anyone - you must accept the Progressive values and beliefs without question... or:

 

Blue_Max

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2011
4,227
153
106
I don't think you're a nazi. I think you're a misogynist little boy.

Based on the fact that because I don't line up with the Progressive demand of unquestioningly accepting Feminism, I must therefore be a misogynist.

You're wrong, of course, because I don't follow your silly rules. But, hey, we've had this discussion dozens of times to no effect - all your decisions must go through the Progressive thought process. Therefore your assessment means nothing to me.
 
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