Originally posted by: TGS
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: Malladine
Rogues aren't worthless. Rogue DPS and utility are valuable, period.
The class is worthless; its dps is no greater than mages', locks' or fury/arms warriors, yet they take a lot more damage due to having to be in melee range of a plethora of AoE attacks. Rogues have no utility. I don't dislike the players, I played one myself, and both guilds' rogues were some of the best members. Further, MMORPGs (to me) are more about social interaction and having fun than min/maxing everything. But I personally couldn't deal with not contributing my share anymore. As I said, it was a big part of why I shelved that toon.
Honestly, other than the world PvP gank factor Rogues have no role that cannot be replaced by another DPS class. I'm in a smaller horde guild now, and as a mage I'm looking at 314 spell power in blues and regularly out-DPSing all the Lobotimizer level weapon rogues. Although the weapon itself isn't Perditions Blade or anything, it should be a good indicator on how well a mage can do against fairly decently equipped rogues. I only have two epics on my mage, the ZG bracers and Sorcerers Gloves. Granted none may care, but I'm always top DPS in UBRS, ZG, and MC(when we run). From my days on my ally priest, it was *always* rogues followed by mages.
My guild is still rather small and we aren't opening up for DPS warriors yet, but if they wanted to it is not exactly a huge problem as you typically want all the warriors high on the hate list. Whereas the only thing I cannot account for are the rogues spec's. My spec is mostly for snares and roots. I leech off the winter's chill mages, but I'm not getting any shatter bonus as a result of my spec. Frankly I don't think that I want to get shatter for PvE, as I can easily chain 1700 crits and pull agro. Iceblock or not the mobs are still changing position and if I pull hate as a ranged class, I'm usually standing by support characters. Those around me most likely will not be able to enjoy the benefits of iceblock.
Frankly it's more or less the reverse situation as shaman are to pvp. In short fights shaman are amazing burst dps. Once you require them to drop totems through a fairly long fight they just don't have the mana pools to pull off what a paladin can accomplish.
I also dislike the pally/shaman crossover. What Blizzard is basically stating is that they refuse to address the PvE/PvP disparities and are throwing in the towel. For raiding, once paladins are given to the horde side, I expect that shaman numbers in raids will be reduced to *one*. Specifically one full resto, just to drop a mana tide for a healing group. For PvE there really isn't a comparision on blessings/seals compared to totems. It's just so lop-sided in that respect.