Wow.... My daughter may becoming Islamic

[Perknose]

First off, not a troll thread. Second, she was NOT hiding the books, they were sitting on the kitchen table, I wasn't clear on that. Third the books were on Elijah Mohammed. Apparently he was involved in the Nation of Islam, a black rights movement. She got interested in this person because her best friend's mom gave a presentation about him which my daughter attended.

So this girl is very intelligent and a very highly motivated student (she wants to be a doctor). She does far better in school than my daughter. When my wife was hospitalized for a month in January, she and her mother sent cards and food. Basically they are good decent folks.

When my daughter was thirteen, one of her friend's parents tried to convert her to LDS (mormon). We cut if off at the knees. Don't let your daughter be suckered into any religion at that age, before she has the ability to think critically.

Actually, a core part of the process of empowering her to be able to think critically involves letting her make her own intellectual choices and then finding out for herself when any one of those choices no longer serve her. It comes down to trust. If you've given her a firm foundation, then trust she will survive and grow out of any "wrong" choices . . . not that her being intellectually curious about Islam is at all a necessarily wrong choice.

 

[Perknose]

Yes. Just remember the magic number 451.

Fahrenheit is so regressively Imperial weights and measures. The correctly French rational answer is 232.778.

 

[snarfbot]

lol please this is an 8 year old. no intellectual choices are gonna be made here. just nip it in the bud now opie, if youre being serious.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Fahrenheit is so regressively Imperial weights and measures. The correctly French rational answer is 232.778.

Tosh. Rankine is all the rage

 

[Homerboy]

Along the lines of "have you really thought this through?" Spring and summer should be here soon, and if she really is serious about converting, buy her one of these:

And then play strict Muslim with her. Going to the grocery store? Has to wear it. Going to the mall? Wear it. She wears it while hiking or biking outside. Be tolerant and respectful of her at all times of course, but just let her squirm from the discomfort of her own choices.

Again, your ignorance knows no bounds at all.

I know many very devout Muslims -- some are prominent Muslim leaders in our city -- and none of the women wear burkas. Half of them wear no head coverings at all. Stop painting 1.6 billion people with the same fucking brush. you wouldn't do it for Christians or atheists, so don't do it for Muslims

 

[Homerboy]

lol please this is an 8 year old. no intellectual choices are gonna be made here. just nip it in the bud now opie, if youre being serious.

Nip what in the bud? I child's curiosity for knowledge about the world they live in?

Also, learn to read the OP -- she's in EIGHTH GRADE. Not 8 years old.

 

[momeNt]

All you know is that she possesses these books, you actually don't even know if she has read them.

Yet somehow, she MAY be becoming Islamic? What?

 

[Perknose]

Tosh. Rankine is all the rage

Rankine? Made me look it up. Oh, Google, you are my friend!

 

[desura]

All you know is that she possesses these books, you actually don't even know if she has read them.

Yet somehow, she MAY be becoming Islamic? What?

Nation of Islam is actually distinct from "regular" Islam. Most authentic Muslims consider NOI to be a cult.

OP overreacted. This is probably just a book for history class or something. I think I read Malcolm's X biography at that age, and obviously didn't convert to the religion.

It probably would be a good time to give her Stephen Prothero's God is Not One.

 

[justoh]

Again, your ignorance knows no bounds at all.

I know many very devout Muslims -- some are prominent Muslim leaders in our city -- and none of the women wear burkas. Half of them wear no head coverings at all. Stop painting 1.6 billion people with the same fucking brush. you wouldn't do it for Christians or atheists, so don't do it for Muslims

Do they believe in hell? In a perfect primate, the prophet? Do they believe in a flawless book? Do they believe that we're created instead of evolved, despite all the mounting evidence? Do they believe in Islamic law, even if they don't necessarily wish to implement it (yet)? Flying horses?

Is any of that good to be teaching to young people (or anyone)?

 

[desura]

Again, your ignorance knows no bounds at all.

I know many very devout Muslims -- some are prominent Muslim leaders in our city -- and none of the women wear burkas. Half of them wear no head coverings at all. Stop painting 1.6 billion people with the same fucking brush. you wouldn't do it for Christians or atheists, so don't do it for Muslims

And I know Muslims who for a brief while wore the head covering but now don't. I get that for nominal Muslims for whom this is their family and cultural history.

But converts are something else. As I said, converts tend to be the worst, the most extreme, the most likely to take things to their logical conclusion.

 

[Blue_Max]

Will she take Islam as seriously as sane people take Christianity? If so, there's fuck all to be concerned about.

...except you're not allowed to quit if you change your mind. The punishment for apostacy is death.

Yeah, this is a decision to take seriously.

 

[momeNt]

...except you're not allowed to quit if you change your mind. The punishment for apostacy is death.

Yeah, this is a decision to take seriously.

How many rulings have been carried out in America?

 

[greatnoob]

Third the books were on Elijah Mohammed. Apparently he was involved in the Nation of Islam

If I recall correctly, didn't Muhammad Ali say this was a hate cult not actually affiliated with Islam?

While I'm not a fan of religion I do respect religious folk who 1) don't shove their beliefs down peoples' throats and 2) are morally decent humans who aren't at the extreme spectrum of religious fanaticism. I suggest you have a discussion with them, hear and understand their viewpoint and then reciprocate the discussion with your views on religion.

 

[senseamp]

Richard Dawkins videos, STAT!

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Richard Dawkins videos, STAT!

He could convert an atheist to being a fundamental. He reminds me of a certain "smart/educated" person.

 

[ivwshane]

Gotta love all the little snowflakes who are scared a child might learn about something these pussies have never bothered to learn about for themselves and instead formed their opinion from the "news".

Lol


Hey OP, if you want your child to grow up ignorant and intolerant like a lot of the posters here, definitely take their advice. On the other hand, if you find their views of the world abhorrent and not right for a better world, I'd ignore any advice they give you.

 

[Indus]

She's umm experimenting like all kids do when they become teenagers. Chillax! Until you see evidence of radicalization.

And this may not be what you want to hear.

A really good way to diffuse the stuff is encourage her to play games which are addicting.. world of warcraft perhaps.

 

[woolfe9998]

Actually, a core part of the process of empowering her to be able to think critically involves letting her make her own intellectual choices and then finding out for herself when any one of those choices no longer serve her. It comes down to trust. If you've given her a firm foundation, then trust she will survive and grow out of any "wrong" choices . . . not that her being intellectually curious about Islam is at all a necessarily wrong choice.

Religion itself encourages magical thinking, not critical thinking. Not just Islam. All of it. I don't believe a typical 13 year old can critically evaluate religious claims. And a decision to take on a religion at that age very often ends up being a life long thing. It isn't just about waiting until they can think critically. It's about protecting their ability to do so in the first place. As a non-religious parent, I would discourage my child from considering religion until they're at least near the age of majority. You can't coerce them of course. But as a parent it is your responsibility to let them know how you feel about it. We did this with our daughter when she was 13 and considering the Mormon religion, and I'm glad we did. We now have a 20 something daughter who is actually sane and reasonably in touch with reality, not just because she lacks religious beliefs, but because religious beliefs didn't infect her ability to think critically about everything else.

Take a look at how the children of non-religious parents turn out (TY Paratus for posting this elsewhere today):

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-oe-0115-zuckerman-secular-parenting-20150115-story.html

Would these parents have been better off sitting idle while outsiders indoctrinate their kids into religion while they're still in middle school, in the name of encouraging them to make their own "intellectual choices"?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Religion itself encourages magical thinking, not critical thinking. Not just Islam. All of it. I don't believe a typical 13 year old can critically evaluate religious claims. And a decision to take on a religion at that age very often ends up being a life long thing. It isn't just about waiting until they can think critically. It's about protecting their ability to do so in the first place. As a non-religious parent, I would discourage my child from considering religion until they're at least near the age of majority. You can't coerce them of course. But as a parent it is your responsibility to let them know how you feel about it. We did this with our daughter when she was 13 and considering the Mormon religion, and I'm glad we did. We now have a 20 something daughter who is actually sane and reasonably in touch with reality, not just because she lacks religious beliefs, but because religious beliefs didn't infect her ability to think critically about everything else.

So if there were a 20 year old who practiced a religion she be insane and out of touch with reality? She would be unable to reconcile her faith so she couldn't be a scientist or engineer because she thinks irrationally?

 

[ivwshane]

Religion itself encourages magical thinking, not critical thinking. Not just Islam. All of it. I don't believe a typical 13 year old can critically evaluate religious claims. And a decision to take on a religion at that age very often ends up being a life long thing. It isn't just about waiting until they can think critically. It's about protecting their ability to do so in the first place. As a non-religious parent, I would discourage my child from considering religion until they're at least near the age of majority. You can't coerce them of course. But as a parent it is your responsibility to let them know how you feel about it. We did this with our daughter when she was 13 and considering the Mormon religion, and I'm glad we did. We now have a 20 something daughter who is actually sane and reasonably in touch with reality, not just because she lacks religious beliefs, but because religious beliefs didn't infect her ability to think critically about everything else.

Take a look at how the children of non-religious parents turn out (TY Paratus for posting this elsewhere today):

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-oe-0115-zuckerman-secular-parenting-20150115-story.html

Would these parents have been better off sitting idle while outsiders indoctrinate their kids into religion while they're still in middle school, in the name of encouraging them to make her own "intellectual choices"?

Reading and learning about religion doesn't automatically indoctrinate a person into that religion, even for an 8th grader.

No wonder a person like trump was able to become president. Wtf

 

[desura]

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/world/americas/isis-online-recruiting-american.html?_r=0

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Reading and learning about religion doesn't automatically indoctrinate a person into that religion, even for an 8th grader.

No wonder a person like trump was able to become president. Wtf

But don't forget the inferiority of the religious. Islam never had a culture which had art or science or mathematics, right? Christians can't grasp evolution or natural history or anything.

There's a stench of bigotry around it seems, not referring to you personally.

 

[woolfe9998]

Reading and learning about religion doesn't automatically indoctrinate a person into that religion, even for an 8th grader.

No wonder a person like trump was able to become president. Wtf

No, it doesn't always. But it can be seductive, especially when the materials they are reading are designed to indoctrinate impressionable young readers, and there are also people - peers - who are talking to them, trying actively to convert them. This is what happened to my daughter. If you think it would have been best if we backed off and let her become a Mormon when she told us that there were things she liked in what they were telling her, then it's your right to raise your own kids that way.

Oh, the irony of your comment about Trump. Trump was elected by people who are overwhelmingly religious. Which goes directly to my point about how religion discourages critical thinking.

 

[woolfe9998]

But don't forget the inferiority of the religious. Islam never had a culture which had art or science or mathematics, right? Christians can't grasp evolution or natural history or anything.

There's a stench of bigotry around it seems, not referring to you personally.

I don't think religious people are unable to "grasp evolution or natural history or anything." I think people who are religious are less likely to accept such things as a scientifically proven theory which contradicts their magical beliefs. You can call it bigotry if you like. I call it a simple empirical observation.