X1800 XL 512mb Edition @ X1800 XT $199.99 at Zipzoomfly.com

[KoncreteAngel]

Can anyone say 10.1k?

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=2064678

 

[stag3]

anybody know if there's an agp version of this for a good price anywhere?

 

[ItsAlive]

Originally posted by: KoncreteAngel
Can anyone say 10.1k?

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=2064678

Nukin Futs.....Good job man!!! He11 of a score. You got an 06 score? I get my card tomorrow.....I hope :roll:

To stag3: The x1800s dont come in AGP as far as i know. Sorry.

 

[whoa2]

Originally posted by: KoncreteAngel
Can anyone say 10.1k?

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=2064678

geez how are you able to get 10.1k?
my specs are comparable to yours and im only getting 8.5k on a fresh xp install with nothing but 3dmark05 installed

 

[CarlGibbs]

Originally posted by: BIGFOOTPI
um- YEAH captain obvious
isnt that pretty much applicable to ALL products- you pay for $50 cheaper model and should expect it to sell $50 cheaper later?
That was obvious wasnt it?
or am I sleepy?

BIGFOOTPI, It's easy to get a 1800XL for $170 or so on ebay. It may be used but that doesn't matter to me. So I'd be paying a premium of $30 to get this XL vs one on ebay.
So assuming that the resale value of this card will be less than that of a real XT by $50 (which is only approximately right - depreciation would narrow the $50 to $35 maybe), buying a real XT is cheaper than this XL by $30 after I'm done selling it in a year or so. I don't think avoiding spending $50 more now is worthwhile when the other option puts me $30 ahead in the long run and I get to avoid the risk of this card not working at XT speeds (of which we have at least one report on this thread). It might make sense to someone who has severe cash flow problems.

 

[LordGestle]

Originally posted by: CarlGibbs

Originally posted by: BIGFOOTPI
um- YEAH captain obvious
isnt that pretty much applicable to ALL products- you pay for $50 cheaper model and should expect it to sell $50 cheaper later?
That was obvious wasnt it?
or am I sleepy?

BIGFOOTPI, It's easy to get a 1800XL for $170 or so on ebay. It may be used but that doesn't matter to me. So I'd be paying a premium of $30 to get this XL vs one on ebay.
So assuming that the resale value of this card will be less than that of a real XT by $50 (which is only approximately right - depreciation would narrow the $50 to $35 maybe), buying a real XT is cheaper than this XL by $30 after I'm done selling it in a year or so. I don't think avoiding spending $50 more now is worthwhile when the other option puts me $30 ahead in the long run and I get to avoid the risk of this card not working at XT speeds (of which we have at least one report on this thread). It might make sense to someone who has severe cash flow problems.

Agree to a point. Someone looking for a guaranteed XT should buy an XT since overclocking is not guaranteed.

Example if someone is looking for new:
X1800XT 512mb cheapest on newegg is 299 OTD.
X1800XL 512mb is 199 OTD.

So it comes down to would you be happy with a 512MB XL at 199? Would you still be happy with the purchase if it did not reach XT speeds? If either answer is no then you are buying the wrong product.

I would also argue the resale value would depreciate faster on the 299$ card versus the 199$. Example in 6 months time I might be able to fetch 150$ (loss of 50) for the XL and maybe an official XT would fetch 200 (loss of 100$). Look at the 7800Gt vs 7800GTX as an example.

**The resale value does not include the possibility of once Vista is released that the whole DX9 video card market tanks**

 

[LordGestle]

Originally posted by: LordGestle
Success!!!
I recently unlocked 16pipes on a X800PRO to an X800XT and I remember seeing something about a modified flashrom used to clear the old bios of the entire configuration. I went to the article on techpowerup and noticed there was a hidden command "-newbios" if you are using atiflash.
I was using atiflash -f -p 0 newbios. This does not flash everything and the same for winflash.
To truly flash the card you need to use atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 newbios.bin.
Instructions found here.
http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/34

After that I'm now able to install drivers using the ATI CC and the card is now a true X1800XT.
Time for some benching and I will report back in this same thready.

***Edit***
I'll start posting my results in that thread you started here:
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=31&threadid=1868758&enterthread=y

*** Edit 2****
I posted in the other thread but I have one pending issue. I'm having trouble getting the memory to pass =>750. 725 is good. I'm still testing and will post results.

*** Edit 3****
It appears the default memory timings are tigher on the XL compared to XT. I will verify this and relax them and retest.
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=13011&page=5

*** Edit 4****
If you want to flash back to your saved original bios or to another XT bios perform the following:
1) Use oveclocker tool to set 2d GPU/Mem to 500MHZ.
2) Use winflash to flash back to the original XL bios of 500/500.
3) Reboot when prompted and use the ATIflash method above again with the default or new XT bios.
Not doing so will cause a screen corruption and flash failure. The flash failure locks up your machine but does not bork your card at least in my experience.

Just for those looking for instructions without digging through several pages.

 

[KoncreteAngel]

Originally posted by: whoa2

Originally posted by: KoncreteAngel
Can anyone say 10.1k?

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=2064678

geez how are you able to get 10.1k?
my specs are comparable to yours and im only getting 8.5k on a fresh xp install with nothing but 3dmark05 installed

Im at 258 fsb, have very fast ram (pc4100 @ 2.5-3-3-8), I am using catalyst 6.5, have everything on high performance, and I have catalyst ai on advanced.

Also im using xp64 which might make a difference.

Another thing, your card could be throttling. My card throttled at default fan speed because it got too hot.

 

[ItsAlive]

Hey KoncreteAngel, what is your memory voltage at default XT PE? What are your voltage regulator temps? Cause mine are like goin up to 75C and i think thats way to hot!!! Thanx

So far I've flashed to a sapphire XT bios and have gotten to 675/730 with 1.375v on core 2.15v on memory. However, while running ati tool it is registering over 30amps. My PSU only supports up to 32amps i think. Sometimes it pops up to 32.7 amps in ati tool and then i can see a couple quick yellow dots but it never registers as artifacting. So im wondering what is a safe voltage to take the ram too? Mostly i think the artifacts are due to my PSU but not 100% sure at this point. I am very close to getting the XT PE speeds so in any case im very happy with my purchase.

By the way my temps are around 55C idle, 73C while running artifact scanner. I have my fan speed set to around 80%.

 

[LordGestle]

Last piece of the puzzel!!!
You need the MSI X1800XT Bios! On my card no other bios would allow past 700mhz on the memory. I'm happy to report I received the MSI X1800XT Bios from BIGD and I flashed my card to a true MSI X1800XT. No Pending Issues now and my memory is clocked to 620/750 via the default OverDrive.

My CYA: As always flashing, overclocking, and/or modding your card is a risk. If you cannot afford the loss do not proceed above. Someone looking for a guaranteed XT should buy an XT since overclocking is not guaranteed.

Before Proceeding I would make sure your current MSI X1800XL card works at the advertised speed (500\500) with a few loops of aquamark, futuremark, glexcess, and/or combination with ATI Tool artifact tester. You can download ATI Tool here: ATI Tool 0.25 Beta 14 from www.techpowerup.com

This way before flashing you don't add complication if your card is faulty out of the box, can process an RMA if needed since you have not voided the waranty, and/or could troubleshoot driver/system related issues before the flash.

I will also leave it up to others if testing your card at 600/700 with GPU set to 1.3v via ATI Tool is necessary before the flash. I would lean towards this approach since it's very difficult to flash back if you cannot get into windows with those clocks and follow the procedure below for a reflash. The reason being is you cannot set it back to 500\500 via overclocker which makes the flashing process possible (or less difficult). I did not experience an issue getting back to windows but I don't feel comfortable saying everyone will have the same success


So here are the complete steps to flash from a MSI X1800XL 512MB card to a MSI X1800XT:
1) Download ATIFLASH. ATI Flash from www.TechPowerup.com
2) Make a bootable disk via DRDFlash: DRDFLash from www.bootdisk.com
3) Copy the extracted (unzipped) ATIFLASH and MSIX1800XT bios from my website to the disk you created in step 2. So you should have ATIFLASH.exe and MSIX18XT.bin (rename if necessary) in the root of your A drive:
MSI X1800XT Bios from Torchedpc.com
4) Reboot your computer
5) When your system boots to the floppy type in this command to save your current bios: atiflash -s 0 oldbios.bin
6) Type in this command to flash the new bios: atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 msix18xt.bin
7) Reboot your computer if successfull
8) Load into windows, install the ATI drivers if not done so previously, launch ATI Catalyst Control Center, Select Advanced View, Select Overdrive and select unlock if you want it to run at 620/750 in 3d mode.

Thanks again to BigD from techpowerup for the bios.

If you have already flashed your bios to an XT Bios and you want to revert back to your saved original bios, or to another XT bios, perform the following:
1) Use oveclocker tool to set 2d GPU/Mem to 500MHZ within Windows. Overclocker from www.techpowerup.com
2) Use winflash to flash back to the original XL bios of 500/500. If you didn't back it up here you go: MSIX1800XL Stock Bios from Torchedpc.com
3) Reboot when prompted and use the ATIflash method above again with the default ( atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 msix18xt.bin or oldbios.bin) or a new XT bios ( atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 newbios.bin.
Not following this order will cause a screen corruption and flash failure. The flash failure locks up your machine but does not bork your card at least in my experience.

 

[ItsAlive]

What are the default voltages of that bios? Ram and core please . Also get what are the voltage regulator temps in ati tool? Thanx LordGestle youre help has been greatly appreciated.

 

[ICantAffordIt]

Just so I get this right... my understanding is this:
1st - Check to make sure the card will run at default XT speed and voltage (which is what exactly?)
2nd - Flash card to XT bios
3rd - Have XT card

Please correct me if I'm wrong... my card gets here wednesday.

 

[ItsAlive]

To LordGestle: For some reason when i try flashing that MSI XT bios it says msix1800xt.bin not found. I have it named correctly and everything. I dunno if it was a bad download or what but its not finding the file.

EDIT: You have to rename the file to msix1800xt.bin because it is not a bin file

Blah that didnt work either....for some reason its still giving me a file not found error.

 

[BIGFOOTPI]

cards now out of stock

 

[LordGestle]

Originally posted by: ICantAffordIt
Just so I get this right... my understanding is this:
1st - Check to make sure the card will run at default XT speed and voltage (which is what exactly?)
2nd - Flash card to XT bios
3rd - Have XT card

Please correct me if I'm wrong... my card gets here wednesday.

I would recommend testing via ATI tool to make sure you can get to 600/700 at 1.3GPU volts. This may not be necessary but my only concern is that if you can't run stable at that speed for some reason it would be very difficult to flash back since you cannot set the GPU and MEM back to 500 via the process of overclock and winflash.

Originally posted by: ItsAlive
To LordGestle: For some reason when i try flashing that MSI XT bios it says msix1800xt.bin not found. I have it named correctly and everything. I dunno if it was a bad download or what but its not finding the file.

EDIT: You have to rename the file to msix1800xt.bin because it is not a bin file

Blah that didnt work either....for some reason its still giving me a file not found error.

Fixed the file. I uploaded the original before I added the bin extension. Nice catch.

 

[ItsAlive]

MSI bios still not working for me I retraced my steps and everything. I even reflashed the original bios via atiflash and it worked just fine. I think the file is bad or something.....dunno but it not working for me. Lord could you resave the bios from your flashed card and repost it cause it might have been fooked in transition or something. But atleast you know that the one you are currently using works, so maybe if you recopied the file and posted that one it would work. Thanx man.

 

[ICantAffordIt]

Is this a DOS 8 character limit thing. Have you tried renaming the bios to 8 characters or less?

 

[ItsAlive]

yes I tried renaming it msixt.bin and that didnt work either.

Scored 8691 in 3dmark05 with my Sempron 64 3100+@2.4Ghz and 1Gb of ram.
Card clocked at 675core/724.5mem 1.4vcore/2.176vmem. Flashed with XT PE bios and downclocked using AtiTool. Im thinking my CPU and Ram are holding me back now LOL.

Edit: Scored just over 8900 in 05 with MSI XT bios by lowering voltages to 1.375core/1.952mem and lowering clock speeds to 650core/702mem. Only reason i can tell that i got a better score at lower speeds is because of heat. I tightened down my Heatsink/fan screws on the back, they were a lil loose. Also set fan to run at 100%. Its very stable at these speeds and temps are in the low-mid 60s under full load. Fan is kinda loud so i might try to upgrade the cooler. I am still experiencing high temps on the voltage regulator....not sure where exactly on this card it is located. If i knew where it was i could add a heatsink or a fan pointing on it and prolly get a better clock out of my card.

 

[jhbball]

ordered this tonight. will report back with results.

 

[freddyK]

Originally posted by: LordGestle
Last piece of the puzzel!!!
You need the MSI X1800XT Bios! On my card no other bios would allow past 700mhz on the memory. I'm happy to report I received the MSI X1800XT Bios from BIGD and I flashed my card to a true MSI X1800XT. No Pending Issues now and my memory is clocked to 620/750 via the default OverDrive.

My CYA: As always flashing, overclocking, and/or modding your card is a risk. If you cannot afford the loss do not proceed above. Someone looking for a guaranteed XT should buy an XT since overclocking is not guaranteed.

Before Proceeding I would make sure your current MSI X1800XL card works at the advertised speed (500\500) with a few loops of aquamark, futuremark, glexcess, and/or combination with ATI Tool artifact tester. You can download ATI Tool here: ATI Tool 0.25 Beta 14 from www.techpowerup.com

This way before flashing you don't add complication if your card is faulty out of the box, can process an RMA if needed since you have not voided the waranty, and/or could troubleshoot driver/system related issues before the flash.

I will also leave it up to others if testing your card at 600/700 with GPU set to 1.3v via ATI Tool is necessary before the flash. I would lean towards this approach since it's very difficult to flash back if you cannot get into windows with those clocks and follow the procedure below for a reflash. The reason being is you cannot set it back to 500\500 via overclocker which makes the flashing process possible (or less difficult). I did not experience an issue getting back to windows but I don't feel comfortable saying everyone will have the same success


So here are the complete steps to flash from a MSI X1800XL 512MB card to a MSI X1800XT:
1) Download ATIFLASH. ATI Flash from www.TechPowerup.com
2) Make a bootable disk via DRDFlash: DRDFLash from www.bootdisk.com
3) Copy the extracted (unzipped) ATIFLASH and MSIX1800XT bios from my website to the disk you created in step 2. So you should have ATIFLASH.exe and MSIX1800XT.bin in the root of your A drive:
MSI X1800XT Bios from Torchedpc.com
4) Reboot your computer
5) When your system boots to the floppy type in this command to save your current bios: atiflash -s 0 oldbios.bin
6) Type in this command to flash the new bios: atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 msix1800xt.bin
7) Reboot your computer if successfull
8) Load into windows, install the ATI drivers if not done so previously, launch ATI Catalyst Control Center, Select Advanced View, Select Overdrive and select unlock if you want it to run at 620/750 in 3d mode.

Thanks again to BigD from techpowerup for the bios.

If you have already flashed your bios to an XT Bios and you want to revert back to your saved original bios, or to another XT bios, perform the following:
1) Use oveclocker tool to set 2d GPU/Mem to 500MHZ within Windows. Overclocker from www.techpowerup.com
2) Use winflash to flash back to the original XL bios of 500/500. If you didn't back it up here you go: MSIX1800XL Stock Bios from Torchedpc.com
3) Reboot when prompted and use the ATIflash method above again with the default or new XT bios.
Not following this order will cause a screen corruption and flash failure. The flash failure locks up your machine but does not bork your card at least in my experience.

LordGestle: Have you tried the Sapphire X1800XTPE bios from techpowerup.com? it clocks your card @ 700/800 in 3D mode. It's nice to have the original MSI X1800XT bios, but the Sapphire bios will give you much better performance on both core and mem.

 

[ItsAlive]

The problem is with the memory. It wont clock to over 725mhz for either me or LordGestle until he flashed to the MSI XT bios which loosens ram timings allowing the memory to hit 750. I have yet to get a working .bin file of the MSI XT bios tho. Gonna try the new one that Lord posted and report back.

 

[whoa2]

Originally posted by: KoncreteAngel

Originally posted by: whoa2

Originally posted by: KoncreteAngel
Can anyone say 10.1k?

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=2064678

geez how are you able to get 10.1k?
my specs are comparable to yours and im only getting 8.5k on a fresh xp install with nothing but 3dmark05 installed

Im at 258 fsb, have very fast ram (pc4100 @ 2.5-3-3-8), I am using catalyst 6.5, have everything on high performance, and I have catalyst ai on advanced.

Also im using xp64 which might make a difference.

Another thing, your card could be throttling. My card throttled at default fan speed because it got too hot.

im at 268 fsb and pc3200 (same timings but only running at 180mhz), cat 6.5, xp x86
i dont think the ram would make such a huge difference between your score and mine...however i could be wrong...

my x1800xl is currently on an XT bios so (625,750)mhz...the mem can go to 820mhz on 1.8V but i didnt see any difference so i kept it at default XT mem speed

omg, ItsAlive on Sempron and beating my score.

 

[BigRigDriver]

Originally posted by: LordGestle
Last piece of the puzzel!!!
You need the MSI X1800XT Bios! On my card no other bios would allow past 700mhz on the memory. I'm happy to report I received the MSI X1800XT Bios from BIGD and I flashed my card to a true MSI X1800XT. No Pending Issues now and my memory is clocked to 620/750 via the default OverDrive.

My CYA: As always flashing, overclocking, and/or modding your card is a risk. If you cannot afford the loss do not proceed above. Someone looking for a guaranteed XT should buy an XT since overclocking is not guaranteed.

Before Proceeding I would make sure your current MSI X1800XL card works at the advertised speed (500\500) with a few loops of aquamark, futuremark, glexcess, and/or combination with ATI Tool artifact tester. You can download ATI Tool here: ATI Tool 0.25 Beta 14 from www.techpowerup.com

This way before flashing you don't add complication if your card is faulty out of the box, can process an RMA if needed since you have not voided the waranty, and/or could troubleshoot driver/system related issues before the flash.

I will also leave it up to others if testing your card at 600/700 with GPU set to 1.3v via ATI Tool is necessary before the flash. I would lean towards this approach since it's very difficult to flash back if you cannot get into windows with those clocks and follow the procedure below for a reflash. The reason being is you cannot set it back to 500\500 via overclocker which makes the flashing process possible (or less difficult). I did not experience an issue getting back to windows but I don't feel comfortable saying everyone will have the same success


So here are the complete steps to flash from a MSI X1800XL 512MB card to a MSI X1800XT:
1) Download ATIFLASH. ATI Flash from www.TechPowerup.com
2) Make a bootable disk via DRDFlash: DRDFLash from www.bootdisk.com
3) Copy the extracted (unzipped) ATIFLASH and MSIX1800XT bios from my website to the disk you created in step 2. So you should have ATIFLASH.exe and MSIX1800XT.bin in the root of your A drive:
MSI X1800XT Bios from Torchedpc.com
4) Reboot your computer
5) When your system boots to the floppy type in this command to save your current bios: atiflash -s 0 oldbios.bin
6) Type in this command to flash the new bios: atiflash -newbios -f -p 0 msix1800xt.bin
7) Reboot your computer if successfull
8) Load into windows, install the ATI drivers if not done so previously, launch ATI Catalyst Control Center, Select Advanced View, Select Overdrive and select unlock if you want it to run at 620/750 in 3d mode.

Thanks again to BigD from techpowerup for the bios.

If you have already flashed your bios to an XT Bios and you want to revert back to your saved original bios, or to another XT bios, perform the following:
1) Use oveclocker tool to set 2d GPU/Mem to 500MHZ within Windows. Overclocker from www.techpowerup.com
2) Use winflash to flash back to the original XL bios of 500/500. If you didn't back it up here you go: MSIX1800XL Stock Bios from Torchedpc.com
3) Reboot when prompted and use the ATIflash method above again with the default or new XT bios.
Not following this order will cause a screen corruption and flash failure. The flash failure locks up your machine but does not bork your card at least in my experience.

Sounds like fun:thumbsup:

 

[nealh]

deal unfortunately appears dead....

 

[Aadan]

So whats the best bios to use ?

Mine shipped today and should be here tomorrow!!