X1800XT wins Quake4

[MBentz]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Hmm. Makes me think that the R520 series has lots of room to grow/future potential. I wonder if I should get the Sapphire X1800XL instead of the eVGA 7800GT-Cu for $20 more...

You should be able to get a 7800GT for $50-$100 less than a X1800XL?

I don't want just ANY 7800GT. I want the eVGA 7800GT-Cu for $369 at newegg (vs. $389 for the XL).

You can get a 3DFuzion, slap an NVSilencer or Zalman on there and still be cheaper than the eVGA. Why be picky?

 

[Madellga]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: 5150Joker
Tried quake 4, it isn't leaps and bounds better than Doom 3 like some people here would like you to believe. In fact, the SP for FEAR was much better IMO. As for the MP, yawn, quake 3 all over again - it's not 1999 anymore, the vast majority of gamers have moved on to bigger and better things (CSS/BF2). Although id isn't completely clueless, at least they're working with the ET team to bring Quake Wars which will hopefully be a good game.

Going to disagree with you there 5150. I do NOT like BF2, COD, any of that "true war" stuff.

For me, I play games to escape reality, not enter a reality I wouldn't want to be in. To each his own.

I just have no interest in shooting a guy with my rifle, or a helicopter with a rocket.

Hehe, you can't just keep being consistent with yourself. Now it is OK to like and prefer different things (games), but when someone says that in his opinion IQ from ATI is better than Nvidia's you say it is wrong and for that you said not to respect the opinion.......

Just another day you said also you wouldn't play World of Warcraft even if paid a 1000$ per week to do that.

This game fits in the category to escape reality......

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Originally posted by: deadseasquirrel
Quake 4 High Quality 0xAA/8xAF
1024x768
X1800XL.........114
6800gt............99

1280x1024
X1800XL.........96
6800gt............75

1600x1200
X1800XL.........77
6800gt............57

2048x1536
X1800XL.........51
6800gt............32

Q4 HQ 4xAA/8xAF
1024x768
X1800XL.........102
6800gt............71

etc, etc, etc. The 6800gt never even comes close. Are you sure you're looking at the right thing?

I think he's talking about the X800XL being faster than the 6800GT in those benchmarks.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: HamburgerBoy

Originally posted by: deadseasquirrel
Quake 4 High Quality 0xAA/8xAF
1024x768
X1800XL.........114
6800gt............99

1280x1024
X1800XL.........96
6800gt............75

1600x1200
X1800XL.........77
6800gt............57

2048x1536
X1800XL.........51
6800gt............32

Q4 HQ 4xAA/8xAF
1024x768
X1800XL.........102
6800gt............71

etc, etc, etc. The 6800gt never even comes close. Are you sure you're looking at the right thing?

I think he's talking about the X800XL being faster than the 6800GT in those benchmarks.

I think that's what he meant too, but it isn't. They're neck and neck at low res and then the 6800GT pulls ahead (ever so slightly) as resolution increases. Apparently it is possible. To complete this miracle, I will now walk on water.

Seriously, I think this game doesn't use as much Hypershadow as Doom3. That's probably what's making the benchmarks jump back and forth weirdly - Nvidia's faster stencil shadowing vs. ATI's higher clockspeeds.

 

[DeathReborn]

Nice, use Beta drivers with "special" optimisations not made by the game maker....

I don't like how ATI does business, no cards, no money from me this time round.



Is there an official ATI Hater club or similar here?

 

[Sc4freak]

Originally posted by: DeathReborn
Nice, use Beta drivers with "special" optimisations not made by the game maker....

I don't like how ATI does business, no cards, no money from me this time round.



Is there an official ATI Hater club or similar here?

Wow, you must REALLY hate Nvidia then. Nvidia has way more leaked beta drivers and has generally been known for more driver optimisation.

The thing is, these optimisations don't affect image quality. So you'd prefer nothing over completely free higher performance (which, by the way, is quite substantial in this case)?

 

[tuteja1986]

funny to see you guys now go quake 4 is crap well doom 3 was even ultra crap. Anyways that the kind of performance you would hope to see from a card that was been delayed 6months and still a few weeks away from story availability.

Nvidai G70 card only got one advantage now is that is the price. In few week if the ATI X1800XT are priced at $450 below then i think its a good buy.


Don't bash me because i have both card at the moment : Geforce 7800GTX and ATI X1800XL *worker discount*

 

[nemesismk2]

I am waiting to see if an official ati driver release will give this kind of performance increase, if not then it's a waste of everyones time. I am enjoying playing quake4 as much as I did playing doom3 and half life 2 etc. Why some people are saying that quake4 is crap is a mystery to me?

 

[Ackmed]

Miss the Rollo?

Originally posted by: Rollo

Going to disagree with you there 5150. I do NOT like BF2, COD, any of that "true war" stuff.

For me, I play games to escape reality, not enter a reality I wouldn't want to be in. To each his own.

I just have no interest in shooting a guy with my rifle, or a helicopter with a rocket.

Did you buy BF2, or just play the demo? If you bought it, whats your name in-game?

I do agree that a "good" game is subjective, as anyone with common sense would. Out of the big three last year, Doom3 was the least well liked, from polls on various forums. But in the end, its user preference.

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Ackmed

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster
Way to go for ATi, but i want to see the % increase in other OpenGL games apart from doom3 and games based on the doom3 engine.

Hope this will make Nvidia respond since openGl is Nvidia's playground.

Whens the last time Nvidia polished openGL for their cards?

Some posters have reported gains in Riddick as well. I know you dont want to hear that.

:roll:

I'm sure most of us are happy with any advances any company comes up with Ackmed.

LOL - envisioning you rubbing your hands together, thinking "Oooh yeah- I'll be pwning those nVidiots now!" when most of the grown up ones are thinking "Cool- I only benefit with more fast cards to pick from."

Except I already said it better for the consumers? There are some that do not like to hear ATi doing better than NV. Im sure you can think of some yourself. Im sorry you dont like me pointing it out, but its the truth.

And sorry, I dont use words like "pwning" or "nVidiots". Lets not put words in others mouths again, ok?

 

[Jeff7181]

Well... seeing as how Carmack has said for the best performance in the highest quality mode you need a 512 MB video card, I don't think it's any mystery why the 512MB x1800XT is outperforming the 256MB 7800GTX.

 

[Ackmed]

True, yet the XT and XL win tests when its not in Ultra High Quality. And both get a large boost no matter what setting. The XT has a larger margin of win in Quality, not Ultra Quality. The XL is even faster than the GT in these settings; http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/quake_4_high-end_performance/page6.aspn Then in Ultra Quality the GT regains the lead. Based on these facsts, the 512mb doesnt seem to be giving them the win alone, if at all.

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: Rage187
As noted, this is good for everyone.

Since time has begun Nv hasnt had to improve their Opengl performance to compete with anyone, now Ati is making advances they will start to improve.

In the end both camps win, since competition is great for everyone.

that was exactly my point, NV havent had to do much on the ogl front for sometime....now finally theyre going to have reason to start mixing it up and getting more speed out of their cards...

the result of ATI's new speed = a win for the consumer, its only going to lead to better things from both camps for all of us

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: Dainas
Well hopefully this will teach Nvidia as to why they need to get out a 512mb/1500mhz 7800, that way ATI would be compleatly out for the count till they get their R580/R600 on market. Quake 4 is a very very memory hungry game and it illustrates the deficiencies in the 7800GTX memory.


It was however stupid of Raven to make High Quality settings not even saturate a 128mb card and then have Ultra Quality jump its needs to 500mb. Thought it was alright till I changed my AA to 2xQ.

You think a gtx with the same mem as the x1800xt will be better? I doubt it. The x1800xt still has a more efficient AA algorithm, and a programmable mem controller. Look at the x1800xl vs. the 7800gt - they both use 1ghz mem, and in HQ mode with 4xAA the xl beats the gt, even though the gt is slightly ahead without AA.

i believe their AA is programable too!

 

[DeathReborn]

Originally posted by: Sc4freak

Originally posted by: DeathReborn
Nice, use Beta drivers with "special" optimisations not made by the game maker....

I don't like how ATI does business, no cards, no money from me this time round.



Is there an official ATI Hater club or similar here?

Wow, you must REALLY hate Nvidia then. Nvidia has way more leaked beta drivers and has generally been known for more driver optimisation.

The thing is, these optimisations don't affect image quality. So you'd prefer nothing over completely free higher performance (which, by the way, is quite substantial in this case)?

First off, don't even think you can tell what I like & don't like. Right now I dislike you, ATI, Intel, McDonalds & furry dice in cars (always getting in the way).

The thing is, they could have put these optimisations into the 5.10 WHQL Driver but they chose to wait which is not a good thing. The XT does not beat the 7800GTX in the real world because.... YOU CAN'T BUY ONE IN THE REAL WORLD! It's a game specific optimisation and not a OGL fix (ATI seem to not want to fix OGL performance time & again).

Considering the price of the XL I can never reccomend that card over a GT, when prices change then i'll look again. If you want the absolute best performance right now, get a ASUS N7800GT Dual or a 7800GTX. Want something cheaper but still a good performer get a 7800GT.

I'd prefer for ATI to fix OGL once and for all instead of chucking out updates for specific games. Can you see that happening anytime soon?

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: Rollo
LOL - envisioning you rubbing your hands together, thinking "Oooh yeah- I'll be pwning those nVidiots now!" when most of the grown up ones are thinking "Cool- I only benefit with more fast cards to pick from."

Well said.

 

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: Ackmed
There are some that do not like to hear ATi doing better than NV. Im sure you can think of some yourself. Im sorry you dont like me pointing it out, but its the truth.

Here is another such post;

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Marshall1
Sweet! ....where again can I buy one of these cards?

Ouch :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Yeah, mocking and laughing really shows that you like ATi doing better than NV. And as a consumer are happy about it. As I said, the simple fact is, some like to do this all the time, and dont like ATi doing better than NV. Its pretty obvious with certain peoples posting habits.

But enough off topic... go Colts! err..

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Ackmed

Originally posted by: Ackmed
There are some that do not like to hear ATi doing better than NV. Im sure you can think of some yourself. Im sorry you dont like me pointing it out, but its the truth.

Here is another such post;

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Marshall1
Sweet! ....where again can I buy one of these cards?

Ouch :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Yeah, mocking and laughing really shows that you like ATi doing better than NV. And as a consumer are happy about it. As I said, the simple fact is, some like to do this all the time, and dont like ATi doing better than NV. Its pretty obvious with certain peoples posting habits.

But enough off topic... go Colts! err..

LOL

I imagine I'm one of those people you're referring to, but I can tell you honestly that if the X1800XL was twice as fast as my 7800GTXs, it would be in my box. There wouldn't be any thought about it- I'd just buy it and use it till something better came along.

That's why my post above about you pleased with some imaginary sadness in the ranks of your imagined "rivals" is so tragically true.

None of us work for nVidia, none of us work for ATI. We only win when there are more choices.

Have you ever considered that all those negative posts I made about ATI were just because there was interesting negative news about ATI?

I've only said two things about this:
1. I'll wait till it's in released drivers to form a final opinion.
2. That it's good news for everyone.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Ackmed
True, yet the XT and XL win tests when its not in Ultra High Quality. And both get a large boost no matter what setting. The XT has a larger margin of win in Quality, not Ultra Quality. The XL is even faster than the GT in these settings; http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/quake_4_high-end_performance/page6.aspn Then in Ultra Quality the GT regains the lead. Based on these facsts, the 512mb doesnt seem to be giving them the win alone, if at all.

Ackmed, just let me get this out of the way. I am commenting on this post of yours even though it was not directed at me. This is in no way a stalking action as you have told the mods I do to you. /disclaimer

If what you say is true, that you don't really care which company has the faster card, I don't think you would be going through all this trouble to show who won what and by how much. If it was true that all you really care about is both companies offering great products and the consumer benefits in the end, you would not be putting the effort to show who won. IMHO. I believe that ATI's memory controller is awesome to be able to offer performance gains like this just by tweaking it. The X1800XT will be a great product from ATI. As long as the consumers are happy with their purchases, it really doesn't matter which is a bit faster or a bit slower.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Also guys, i dont think this is an architectural strength. I think ATI finally got their shader replacement working correctly.

What the heck are you talking about? It's nothing to do with shader replacement, it's a different algorithm for the memory controller.

IS that what the patch does? Or is it simply what you think made it better?

-Kevin

 

[Paratus]

Kevin you seem to be having a hard time with this.

READ the article!

ATI tweaked the X1000 mem controller. Thats it. In fact thats what its designed to do.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: Paratus
Kevin you seem to be having a hard time with this.

READ the article!

ATI tweaked the X1000 mem controller. Thats it. In fact thats what its designed to do.

Dear god dont i feel like the biggest jacka$$ in the world right now. Sorry guys.

That is very impressive then. Way to go ATI.

-Kevin

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: Paratus
Kevin you seem to be having a hard time with this.

READ the article!

ATI tweaked the X1000 mem controller. Thats it. In fact thats what its designed to do.

Dear god dont i feel like the biggest jacka$$ in the world right now. Sorry guys.

That is very impressive then. Way to go ATI.

-Kevin

Don't sweat it.

We all make mistakes, and if you read enough of these articles it's easy enough to mix things up. Not like we get paid to know this stuff. (except Ronin)

 

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Ackmed, just let me get this out of the way. I am commenting on this post of yours even though it was not directed at me. This is in no way a stalking action as you have told the mods I do to you. /disclaimer

If what you say is true, that you don't really care which company has the faster card, I don't think you would be going through all this trouble to show who won what and by how much. If it was true that all you really care about is both companies offering great products and the consumer benefits in the end, you would not be putting the effort to show who won. IMHO. I believe that ATI's memory controller is awesome to be able to offer performance gains like this just by tweaking it. The X1800XT will be a great product from ATI. As long as the consumers are happy with their purchases, it really doesn't matter which is a bit faster or a bit slower.

Did you even read the post that I was replying to? I wasnt going thru any trouble to prove who won what. Its obvious from these benches that the XL&XT get a huge boost, and the the XT overtakes the GTX. While the XL under some settings, overtakes the GT.

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Well... seeing as how Carmack has said for the best performance in the highest quality mode you need a 512 MB video card, I don't think it's any mystery why the 512MB x1800XT is outperforming the 256MB 7800GTX.

This is the post I was replying to. What I said in my post was that I didnt think it was the 512mb that gave them the lead. He says thats its not mystery why the 512mb outperforms the GTX in the Highest Quality setting. All I said was that it outperforms the GTX in the lower setting too, where the extra ram should have no effect.

 

[Ronin]

I got bored this morning, and decided to take some screenshots:

Base 1
Base3Zoom
Cannon7Close
Cannon4Close
Cannon3Close
Cannon8Close

Yes, the framerate isn't all that impressive, but imo, the images are. Settings are as follows:

Q4Settings in the nVidia CP 1
Q4Settings in the nVidia CP 2
Q4Settings in Game 1
Q4Settings in Game 1

For those that don't want to see the settings:

Resolution: 1920x1200 (set in autoexec.cfg)
Quality: Ultra High
Image Settings: High Quality
FSAA: 8x
Anisotropic: 16x (set in game)
Gamma Corrrect AA: On
Transparency AA: Supersampling
SLi: Enabled

If anyone has any questions about the 7800GTX visual quality capabilities, I hope this clears it up.

 

[johnnqq]

those pictures just convinced me to spend $400 on a video card...then about 7 seconds later i looked at the fps... BACK to reality!