X800XL vs. 6800GT

[dev0lution]

ATI X800 XL came today and after a bit of playing around, got to say it was well worth the $300. To all the 6800 GT owners, now I can at least partially relate and since AGP wasn't an option, I'm glad I saved the $100 or so!!

 

[doublejbass]

Originally posted by: RussianSensation

Originally posted by: doublejbass

Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Ok there should be 0 argument in this thread.

$300 X800XL for PCIe systems
$340 6800GT for AGP systems.

end of story.

Show me a single-slot AGP 6800GT with quality build, decent noise management (once again, the BFG is LOUD), and a 3-year warranty minimum.

EDIT: I'm not saying there isn't one, I'm saying show me.

1) How often do videocards fail though? I am certain the quality of 6800GTs is just as good as ATI cards given that neither of us has any statistical data to see which fails more often. If Nvidia videocards were of much worse quality, this would be in the news .... remember on forums it's biased since you'll only see ppl who report problems - it's not like someone is gonan start a post saying "oh my 6800GT hasnt failed yet, oh no!" Also given that 6800GT sold more units than ATI's high end cards, the probability of consumers having more problems is increased simply due to more cards being distributed to owned. This doesn't explain anything wrt issues per 1000 units sold, for instance. Also how many ppl keep a $400 videocard for 3 years?

2) if you dont like the noise, download gainward expert tool and reduce the fan speed by 50%

3) given that todays cards have onboard sound, lan, etc, a 2 slot solution is no longer an excuse for anyone with a mid-tower case. Your motherboard probably has 4 slots open; so how is this an issue in the real world? Besides you can find single slot solutions on the market if you really wanted to put it in a SFF PC.

1) I'm not claiming that ATI's cards fail less, if you read correctly, you'd see that the advantage to a BBATI card is not "higher reliability," it's the three-year warranty! If it's a good enough card, I will keep it at least longer than a year, and the warranty then adds to resale value, as can be documented with the 9800 Pro. I've had cards fail on me multiple times in the past, the warranty is important to me.

2) The card already runs hot enough in an SFF system, and I've tried gimmicks with the fan speed, it only has a marginal effect, it's just a loud fan.

3) I HAVE an SFF PC as my main system. How is this not the real world? Yes, there are single slot solutions, but none that meet the requirements I outlined.

The reason my requirements are like they are is that's what you get from a BBATI card. I've heard questionable things about the ATI X800XL cooler as far as noise goes, so I'd be interested in seeing numbers on that. I have no attachment to that company, I'm not some sort of fanboy, and I'd happily switch it up, but no package seems to provide all the necessary features.

 

[NetDevil]

Hi guys. I read this thread and i`ve seen everybody says that for agp 6800gt is better. In romania the both pci-e cards are almost at the same price(x800xl is 10$ cheaper ). Should i buy the 6800gt ? And if i buy it which psu could handle it better, an antec truepower 430 26A@12v or a hiper-power 480w 18A@12v1 , 16A@12v2. I want to say that hiper power are very good psu`s. The quality equals antec.
The rig will be: Venice 3200+/Msi K8N Neo4 Platinum/2x512 Corsair C2pt/160Gb Seagate/Nec 3520A burner.

Thanks.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: NetDevil
Hi guys. I read this thread and i`ve seen everybody says that for agp 6800gt is better. In romania the both pci-e cards are almost at the same price(x800xl is 10$ cheaper ). Should i buy the 6800gt ? And if i buy it which psu could handle it better, an antec truepower 430 26A@12v or a hiper-power 480w 18A@12v1 , 16A@12v2. I want to say that hiper power are very good psu`s. The quality equals antec.
The rig will be: Venice 3200+/Msi K8N Neo4 Platinum/2x512 Corsair C2pt/160Gb Seagate/Nec 3520A burner.

Thanks.

6800GT & Antec. 18A on the "hiper" power 12V+ may not cut it.

 

[NetDevil]

I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: NetDevil
I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

Not enough AMPS per rail.

I use an Enermax 460W with 33A 12V+.

 

[NetDevil]

Ok thanks. Maybe i`ll get one too because it`s just a litlle more expensive than the antec. Is the FMA AX series silent ?

 

[NetDevil]

One more question: Is Leadtek 6800 nonGT slower than Gecube X800XL even if i activate the 4pipelines and 1vertex unit ?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: NetDevil
One more question: Is Leadtek 6800 nonGT slower than Gecube X800XL even if i activate the 4pipelines and 1vertex unit ?

Yes, its slower even when you unlock and overclock.

 

[fstime]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: NetDevil
I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

Not enough AMPS per rail.

I use an Enermax 460W with 33A 12V+.

Wrong.

Having dual rails is like having two hoses feeding a plaint.

Having a single rail is like having one larger house feeding a plant.

They both are the same in the long run.

I bet you my 600watt OCZ PS with 20A 12V1 and 18A 12V2 would perfom better than
your Enermax.

18A is pretty much as good as it gets on dual rails, some psus may have 19A or 20A.

Your trying to say no one here has a 6800gt running on a dual rail psu?



Back to the topic, assuming your PSU is of quality it should run a 6800GT fine.

As a matter fact, one of my single 18A will run a 6800gt fine with 11.90+ on the 12V.

(personal experiance.)

 

[whoster69]

I'm planning on building a new computer in about six weeks. I'm getting an Abit Fatal1ty AN8 (hate the name), AMD64 3700+ (or 3800+ -haven't decided which yet), and either a 6800GT or x800 XL.

I've got an Antec TruePower 480Watt PSU. Will there be any problems with either of these videocards and that PSU?

I'm still trying to decide between the videocards. Seems that each has benefits...

Thanks.

 

[impemonk]

starts eating hamburgers.****

HAPPYDA

 

[whoster69]

Originally posted by: impemonk
starts eating hamburgers.****

HAPPYDA

I don't understand what you're trying to say.

 

[Dukemaster]

I think he's trying to say that he likes hamburgers......?

 

[whoster69]

Originally posted by: whoster69
I'm planning on building a new computer in about six weeks. I'm getting an Abit Fatal1ty AN8 (hate the name), AMD64 3700+ (or 3800+ -haven't decided which yet), and either a 6800GT or x800 XL.

I've got an Antec TruePower 480Watt PSU. Will there be any problems with either of these videocards and that PSU?

I'm still trying to decide between the videocards. Seems that each has benefits...

Thanks.

Well, I'll quote my original questions then in an attempt to get this back to the topic of videocards....

 

[Dukemaster]

Hmm 6 weeks... there's a good chance that the new generation of cards have already been introduced by then, so a lot will have changed in the videocardmarket when you plan to buy a card. So i would stop thinking about it right now and look how the situation is in 6 weeks.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: NetDevil
I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

Not enough AMPS per rail.

I use an Enermax 460W with 33A 12V+.

Wrong.

Having dual rails is like having two hoses feeding a plaint.

Having a single rail is like having one larger house feeding a plant.

They both are the same in the long run.

I bet you my 600watt OCZ PS with 20A 12V1 and 18A 12V2 would perfom better than
your Enermax.

18A is pretty much as good as it gets on dual rails, some psus may have 19A or 20A.

Your trying to say no one here has a 6800gt running on a dual rail psu?



Back to the topic, assuming your PSU is of quality it should run a 6800GT fine.

As a matter fact, one of my single 18A will run a 6800gt fine with 11.90+ on the 12V.

(personal experiance.)

Before you flat out call somebody wrong, consider that I am speaking from my experience as well. 18A is not a lot these days. not a lot at all. So, you offer your experience to the OP, and so will I. Let him judge whos wrong or right or whatever.

As far as your PSU performing better than my PSU? That's just laughable. My PSU is server grade which is why I chose it. I'm sure your OCZ is good also, but does everything have to be a competition around here?

OP: based on my experience, you will do fine with the Antec 26A. Its enough power to run a prescott system with a 6800GT and a few extra case fans. My experience.

Now I'm angry at Bouzouki and can't give a damn anymore. Good luck to you.

 

[fstime]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: NetDevil
I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

Not enough AMPS per rail.

I use an Enermax 460W with 33A 12V+.

Wrong.

Having dual rails is like having two hoses feeding a plaint.

Having a single rail is like having one larger house feeding a plant.

They both are the same in the long run.

I bet you my 600watt OCZ PS with 20A 12V1 and 18A 12V2 would perfom better than
your Enermax.

18A is pretty much as good as it gets on dual rails, some psus may have 19A or 20A.

Your trying to say no one here has a 6800gt running on a dual rail psu?



Back to the topic, assuming your PSU is of quality it should run a 6800GT fine.

As a matter fact, one of my single 18A will run a 6800gt fine with 11.90+ on the 12V.

(personal experiance.)

Before you flat out call somebody wrong, consider that I am speaking from my experience as well. 18A is not a lot these days. not a lot at all. So, you offer your experience to the OP, and so will I. Let him judge whos wrong or right or whatever.

As far as your PSU performing better than my PSU? That's just laughable. My PSU is server grade which is why I chose it. I'm sure your OCZ is good also, but does everything have to be a competition around here?

OP: based on my experience, you will do fine with the Antec 26A. Its enough power to run a prescott system with a 6800GT and a few extra case fans. My experience.

Now I'm angry at Bouzouki and can't give a damn anymore. Good luck to you.

Someone sure takes things the wrong way.

I wasn't trying to offend you.




Back to the point, yes 18A isnt a lot but it does the job is some cases.


But in his case, its not only 18A, he has another rail.




No, im not trying to compete with your PSU just trying to make a point that a dual rail will perform equally if not better than a single rail.


BTW, I have my lovely external ajustable rails

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: NetDevil
I thought dual rails would be better for stability.

Not enough AMPS per rail.

I use an Enermax 460W with 33A 12V+.

Wrong.

Having dual rails is like having two hoses feeding a plaint.

Having a single rail is like having one larger house feeding a plant.

They both are the same in the long run.

I bet you my 600watt OCZ PS with 20A 12V1 and 18A 12V2 would perfom better than
your Enermax.

18A is pretty much as good as it gets on dual rails, some psus may have 19A or 20A.

Your trying to say no one here has a 6800gt running on a dual rail psu?



Back to the topic, assuming your PSU is of quality it should run a 6800GT fine.

As a matter fact, one of my single 18A will run a 6800gt fine with 11.90+ on the 12V.

(personal experiance.)

Before you flat out call somebody wrong, consider that I am speaking from my experience as well. 18A is not a lot these days. not a lot at all. So, you offer your experience to the OP, and so will I. Let him judge whos wrong or right or whatever.

As far as your PSU performing better than my PSU? That's just laughable. My PSU is server grade which is why I chose it. I'm sure your OCZ is good also, but does everything have to be a competition around here?

OP: based on my experience, you will do fine with the Antec 26A. Its enough power to run a prescott system with a 6800GT and a few extra case fans. My experience.

Now I'm angry at Bouzouki and can't give a damn anymore. Good luck to you.

Someone sure takes things the wrong way.

I wasn't trying to offend you.




Back to the point, yes 18A isnt a lot but it does the job is some cases.


But in his case, its not only 18A, he has another rail.




No, im not trying to compete with your PSU just trying to make a point that a dual rail will perform equally if not better than a single rail.


BTW, I have my lovely external ajustable rails

I'm sure your just trying to help but I would imagine all it did was just confuse the OP.

Like: Hmm, now WTF should I do? Single or dual rail?

Stick with high Amp single or the highest dual amp you can find. You don't want to have less than the 26A single you mentioned, and you don't want to have less than a dual 16A.

Bouzouki, how many actual leads come out of your PSU? Are they labeled or colored so you can tell which leads belong to which rails? Or are there only 2 leads, 1 for each rail?

 

[NetDevil]

Thanks a lot for help. I made up my mind. I`ll get the antec just because it`s antec . Anyways, if i can get some more money i`ll get the Enermax 33A@12V. That would really help my overclock with the "has to come venice"

Thanks again.

 

[BoboKatt]

Hum wow.... I run my BFG 6800GT OC on a Antec Overture case which comes with a 380watt truepower 12V PS. I run a new Intel 640 (3.2GHz).. 2 Gig of RAM and a few fans in there with a 250GB drive and I have never had any power issues EVER.


How much power should I get? Should I not be looking at the 12V listed in the 380Watt truepower statement? dual rail what?

 

[Jaxidian]

Just in case some of you have confusion about the 12v dual rail, here's what I know about it (though I'm far from an expert and would appreciate it if people would correct any inaccuracies in this):

Scenario 1 (Single Rail):
33A at 12v
This means that you can plug tons of things into that 12v rail until you reach the limit of 33A. However, ever single time you plug a single thing into that rail (depending on how much juice it sucks), your PSU is likely to drop the voltage a tad. For example, when very little juice is being pulled, the rail may be at 12.5v when pulling 5A total (this may be a bit high, I'm exagerating these numbers so don't take them as truth but just see the patern). Plug in a single video card and it may be down to 12.1v when pulling 16A total. Plug in a second video card and it may be down to 11.8v when pulling 25A. Add a DVD burner and while burning let's say you're pulling 30A, you might be down to 11.5v. See the pattern? Again, some numbers are a bit exagerated but you get the idea.

Scenario 2 (Dual Rails):
18A at 12v #1
16A at 12v #2
This means that the CPU has rail #1 all to itself. Typically expect your CPU to pull 10A or less so this rail has plenty of power to spare that, unfortunately, nothing else in your system can use. Despite my "unfortunately", this is good for CPU stability and with that CPU overclocking. Rail #2, now, is used to power everything else in your computer. Motherboard, video cards, hard drives, DVD burners, etc.

Do not be fooled into thinking that a PSU with a dual-rail can be thought of as practically the same as a single-rail PSU where the amps or sum of amps are the same. In this case, 18A + 16A does not equal 34A. You would be better off with the 34A single rail.


Another piece of info about the new ATX2.01 standard is that it states that none of the 12v rails should constantly be over about 70% load. That means that you should not be consistantly pulling more than 70% of that 16A. So that means you now only have 11.2A that you can pull nonstop before you begin declining the lifetime of the PSU (according to the standard).


Last piece of advice: I have no personal experience with dual rail PSUs. This is all based on the research I have done on them. I just purchased my first dual-rail PSU yesterday and have yet to put it in a system.

Hope this helps with any confusion.

-Jax