Xbox 360, Gamers Choice for Next Gen (Over the PS3)

[klah]

If thats how stingy you are, I'll pay the $5 a game or whatever it is myself..

I'd pay $50 to play through GoldenEye with the new Rev controller, but I doubt MS will let them offer it along with any other Rare games.

----------------------------

Looks like the PS2's market share may have been inflated by all of us that had to purchase multiple systems after hardware failure:

http://www.xbox365.com/news.cgi?id=GGPGLLPGLL11130359

Speaking to the Associated Press about Microsoft's Xbox 360, Gartner Inc, the leading provider of research and analysis on the global information technology industry, recently estimated that Xbox 1 had about 34% of the global game systems market. They also estimated Playstation 2 to have 51% marketshare and Nintendo at 15%.

If the estimates are close to fact then it appears that Microsoft has timed the launch of the Xbox 360 to coincide with the peak momentum of its previous system. In such a saturated market, 34% says a lot from when the system first launched and was predicted by many to die.

 

[BenSkywalker]

1. The PS2 launched and Sony had no competition (One could say the Dreamcast, but it was dead at that moment mostly because of pirating imo), so Sony had a huge window to get more content out and sell more systems before the Gamecube or the Xbox were released.

The DC had moved ~10Million units world wide by the time the PS2 launched in the US- from what I have seen MS is not planning on being able to match those numbers. The DC also had a much stronger software lineup then the 360 has lined up ATM.

2. The PS3 is going to cost more than both the 360 and the Revolution.

That is speculative. Sony gave indications that the PS2 was going to cost an enormous amount also- it was using processors that were more powerful versions of those used in Cray Supercomputers and had, for the time, a considerable amount of eDRAM and RDRAM. It ended up being at the same price point as the PS1.

3. And Blu-Ray, as nice as it may be is most definatly not needed, yet. Yes it would be nice to have, but if your wanting it for movies I assure you a dedicated Blu-Ray player will probably suit your needs better once movies are actually coming out for it.

The PS2's greatest launch title was 'The Matrix' on DVD. The fact that it was capable of playing DVDs out of the box was an enormous selling point. In the PS3's launch window based on all the indications from the manufacturers HD-DVD players are still going to be in the ~$600 range with BR's price yet to be nailed down. BluRay is going to be a major selling point to a lot of people.

Name one game on either system that requires more than one Dual Layer DVD.

You know how much space HD vid feeds take? Given that it is a requirement for MS certification this generation I think you will find this is going to be an increasingly large issue. I believe it was Kojima(although I may be mistaken) that has already come out and said they will have to use multi DVD9s for their first 360 game.

Instead your paying for something you dont need.

You are paying for next gen movie support along with next gen game support. If MS used DVD9 to get their price point down to $199 with HD included I would say that it was a good trade off in the long term. At $399 with last gen optical drive it seems quite foolish.

M$ weak launch lineup?

NO killer app- I don't think you will find too many people who will argue that. Nintendo has stated numerous times that they learned their lesson with the launch of the Cube and won't be launching a new console without their main franchise again. No Halo, no Rallisport, no Forza, no KoTOR, no ElderScrolls. They have an arcade racer and a couple of Rare titles whose last really good game was on a cart.

And again you act like that the 360 having a launch lineup that you dislike somehow excuses the fact that Sony wont have anything out for a year later.

Sony launches with the ability to play thousands of games on day one. MS doesn't stand a chance of building that kind of library.

Who cares if they dont have the strongest launch lineup, when many many good games are in creation and will be out shortly, with many more good games following.

This is their only chance- and they are blowing it. They are going to wait to launch their major franchises until the PS3 hits(according to Gates). If you want to talk about them launching first being an advantage(for some time every console that launched first has ended up finishing last btw) how exactly are they going to capitalize on that with such a weak lineup? They need their killer apps before Sony hits.

M$ will do everything in their power to milk every ounce they can out of this lead they have on Sony.

In your wildest dreams they will. Halo3 would be launching if that were the case- it isn't.

M$ is not a dumb company, they may make mistakes, but you dont become a company they size of M$ by being dumb or making and repeating dumb mistakes.

They are proving themselves to be quite dumb in the console space. No company in the history of console gaming has lost as much money on a platform as MS has on the XBox. What's more- they managed to do this while holding onto last place in world wide installed base for pretty much this entire generation. MS is full of brilliant people- they just aren't working with the 360 ATM(clearly).

I still swear that has a huge amount to do with defective PS2s. I personally know ten people who have all had defective PS2s. I personally know many more than ten people who have all had the exact same Xbox they first purchased.

I absolutely agree with you that defective PS2s are a good reason for their huge installed base. Of course, I also have two dead XBoxs that I have had to replace. Only my Cube lasted from launch until now. Sony and MS both produce very low quality hardware- no doubt about that. Who is worse is a bit of a toss up I would say- I've had to replace two of each though my PS2s did last longer then my XBs.

Wingz-

As dfloyd said, online gaming for consoles is rather new territory. Many people in the industry (both hardware and software side) believe that this new territory is where the next generations will be won and lost.

MS said on line and the hard drive were going to decide last gen. Fairly comical in retrospect.

But I still completely appreciate what Live offers over the competition.

No argument there, I just don't see it as too much of an assett when the market penetration was so tiny this gen.

southpawuni-

My thoughts on Xbox: they have Halo. Easily the most popular game in America on all consoles.

Actually GTA and Madden are both far more popular then Halo in terms of titles sold per gen. Actually GTA3 for the PS3 by itself sold more copies then Halo and Halo2 combined. That said, MS did an excellent job of building the franchise into a killer app to the broader market- which is one of the reasons it surprises me so much that they completely dropped the ball by ignoring it for their system launch.

 

[TecHNooB]

Actually, Halo 3 is going to be the supposed PS3 Killer aka it's being released the day PS3 is launched.

 

[Wingznut]

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
MS said on line and the hard drive were going to decide last gen. Fairly comical in retrospect.

I don't know about that... MS never predicted they would win last generation. But even still, the market share that the Xbox did garner is very impressive considering it was their first forey (sp?) and how poorly it was received in Japan. Maybe the online play and hd WERE the difference. Maybe without those, their market share would've been dismal.

No argument there, I just don't see it (online gaming) as too much of an assett when the market penetration was so tiny this gen.

The manufacturers would be quite naive if they were to base future offerings solely on current gen pentetration.

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
southpawuni-

My thoughts on Xbox: they have Halo. Easily the most popular game in America on all consoles.

Actually GTA and Madden are both far more popular then Halo in terms of titles sold per gen. Actually GTA3 for the PS3 by itself sold more copies then Halo and Halo2 combined. That said, MS did an excellent job of building the franchise into a killer app to the broader market- which is one of the reasons it surprises me so much that they completely dropped the ball by ignoring it for their system launch.

And the Sims outsold either one of those games as well.
Look at how many Nintendo games are the top selling games of all time?

A non-Nintendo branded system doesnt take a place on the list until #9 (GTA)!

Halo is considered a 'hardcore' gamers choice. Madden/GTA/Sims are not.

And dont be so anti-MS, Microsoft isnt some little pussy you can just write off as some sort of joke. They are incredibly wealthy and powerful, and are indeed formidable to Sony.
Sony takes them seriously.. you should too.

I am not discounting anyone at this point. Nintendo/Sony/MS has experts working for them that get paid big $$ that know way more about the market and the stategy on how to win than you or I, or anyone else do knows.

If I were to toss my hat into anyones camp though it would be Nintendo, I'm one of those loyalists who have appreciated their stunning titles since the NES.
I havent been impressed by a console since the N64.

PS1/2 I was let down by the step backwards that sony took with remaining only 2 player when the 64 had 4player built in.
Xbox is a superb console (best one out at the current point in time) with its innovative Xbox Live, 4 player support and built in hard drive.

I was pretty pleased with what MS did with the Xbox1 myself. I'm disappointed in dropping the HD in the 360, if it had one mandatory I would probably buy one.

Its a sign they are getting ready for a price war with Sony, and to increase their margins when that happens.
I'd rather just go with gaming innovation with my Revolution, forget all that "I have better graphics than j00 on my PS3!!" and other marketing crap.

But I'm the guy who still misses (and enjoys) PC adventure games. I'm a way different breed than the 3dmark/FPS kiddies in this forum, of course my perspective is going to be way different in what makes a good game.

 

[gi0rgi0]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
Actually, Halo 3 is going to be the supposed PS3 Killer aka it's being released the day PS3 is launched.

Thats going to be a hard one to pull off. Ive heard its more likely to be released
in 07 along with the movie.

Also I went to BB last night and I played a little of the 360 since Im thinking of picking one up
in a couple of months. I played the CoD demo and while it was fun and looked good for a console
my 7800gt driven pc looks alot better. It was the same single player demo so I went back home
and played it to see the differences. It was much more realistic. I really noticed this in the tanks
in the beginning. They looked real on the pc while being pretty lame looking on the console.
And also the smoke from the smoke grenades looked alot cooler on the pc. On the console it looked
like ****** and you couldnt tell what dirction to go. Ive heard that the demos werent the final release though
so maybe it'll look better. I was hoping to see graphics on par with my pc though.

Whats cool is that the ps2 still has some life. I picked up guitar hero and thats such a fun game.

 

[liquid51]

Originally posted by: JRW

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
arr bad poll for people that don't crap about console.. anyways I am going to buy an XBOX 360 , PS3 and rev ! because i have bought nearly every major console since Intellivision days!

Ditto.

Ha! You guys crack me up. Yup, really sounds like you don't give a crap about consoles
A tad bit oxymoronic, don't ya think?

 

[dfloyd]

Originally posted by: southpawuni

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
southpawuni-

My thoughts on Xbox: they have Halo. Easily the most popular game in America on all consoles.

Actually GTA and Madden are both far more popular then Halo in terms of titles sold per gen. Actually GTA3 for the PS3 by itself sold more copies then Halo and Halo2 combined. That said, MS did an excellent job of building the franchise into a killer app to the broader market- which is one of the reasons it surprises me so much that they completely dropped the ball by ignoring it for their system launch.

And the Sims outsold either one of those games as well.
Look at how many Nintendo games are the top selling games of all time?

A non-Nintendo branded system doesnt take a place on the list until #9 (GTA)!

Halo is considered a 'hardcore' gamers choice. Madden/GTA/Sims are not.

And dont be so anti-MS, Microsoft isnt some little pussy you can just write off as some sort of joke. They are incredibly wealthy and powerful, and are indeed formidable to Sony.
Sony takes them seriously.. you should too.

I am not discounting anyone at this point. Nintendo/Sony/MS has experts working for them that get paid big $$ that know way more about the market and the stategy on how to win than you or I, or anyone else do knows.

If I were to toss my hat into anyones camp though it would be Nintendo, I'm one of those loyalists who have appreciated their stunning titles since the NES.
I havent been impressed by a console since the N64.

PS1/2 I was let down by the step backwards that sony took with remaining only 2 player when the 64 had 4player built in.
Xbox is a superb console (best one out at the current point in time) with its innovative Xbox Live, 4 player support and built in hard drive.

I was pretty pleased with what MS did with the Xbox1 myself. I'm disappointed in dropping the HD in the 360, if it had one mandatory I would probably buy one.

Its a sign they are getting ready for a price war with Sony, and to increase their margins when that happens.
I'd rather just go with gaming innovation with my Revolution, forget all that "I have better graphics than j00 on my PS3!!" and other marketing crap.

But I'm the guy who still misses (and enjoys) PC adventure games. I'm a way different breed than the 3dmark/FPS kiddies in this forum, of course my perspective is going to be way different in what makes a good game.

Woo Hoo, Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers for the win. That game actually scared the crap out of me. Dang big snake. Not to mention the voodoo stuff popping up around every corner. Man I loved that game.

And I completly agree with your assessment friend. I still feel that dropping the hard drive was one of the worst mistakes the 360 has made. At the very least they should of kept a 5-10 GB hard drive. Heck using current generation Xbox hard drives could not of added much to the overall cost of the Xbox and imo made the Xbox what it is. The most innovative amazing and complete console to date. I say this for many reasons, but for anyone whom has ever modded their Xbox knows you can do just about everything with it. I watch any kind of movie (Not just kiddie stuff here but true Hight Definition Movies), play any kind of music, boot it up with the real mans Linux (Gentoo for da win), and am able to copy all my games to the bigger hard drive that I installed so I get no dvd-rom wear and tear, no wait, and so much more. I am using a totally different dashboard which allows everything from downloading the weather everyday, to playing movies, dvds, editing my files and more.

Want to talk about playing games? I can download mods for my games, extra maps, all kinds of custom content. Leisure Suit Larry did not have any bars hidding what all you wanted to see if you did not want to. (Call me a perv if you wish but its more a point of the ability to do so or not). But there are just so many things you can do with the current Xbox, it really is amazing and is the center of my home entertainment system. MP3 Player, Divx Player, Gaming System, Xvid Player, Mpeg Player, HD Video, News Service, Web Surfing, and so much more, and all that without even opening the case. Heck I understand its capable of even using it as a DVR (Not tried this though). Its just amazing what can be done with a $150 console.

So anyone calling the Xbox a failure cannot be looking at the whole picture. M$ never planned on making a huge profit with the first Xbox. The knew what the market was, they understood consoles from the research they had done about it. There whole objective was to gain market share. Now if they gained thirty something percent market share on their first try then I would have to say they did a heck of a job. Want an example of what they will do for market share? Just look at IE. My first version of Netscape was Netscape 1.0, it costs me $40 from my local ISP. Wanna know how much IE cost me? And the reason I switched to IE had nothing to do with price, it had to do with M$ sticking with it until they eventually did create a better browser than Netscape did. I paid for two more versions of Netscape after the first one, but M$ kept on, stuck with it, and eventually did what they set out to do (And making profit was not the issue, gaining market share was). So if I was Sony I would really try hard to learn from Netscape.

Edit: The lower info in my post was not in reply to the quote above, just in reply to several other posts I had read lower. What the person is stating in the quote above though I completly agree with. M$ is a huge powerful and persistant company who will work hard to get what they want. They are not in the business of giving up. Sort of like a bulldog, once they latch on, good luck getting them to let go.

 

[johnnqq]

i'm not sure if this was posted but let me clear something up. yes, the revolution will be able to play nes games but AT A PRICE. not for FREE like the ps3->ps1 games

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: johnnqq
i'm not sure if this was posted but let me clear something up. yes, the revolution will be able to play nes games but AT A PRICE. not for FREE like the ps3->ps1 games

you still have to pay for them at one point or another. and NES games are so old now, most ppl arent still hording them (although I am ) so its very convenient that Nintendo will have these up for download in the comfort of my home.
Cant download that scratched up PS1 disc that someone loves so much. Have to go on ebay, wait, yet still pay twice.


I'm assuming that the Revolution will be the ONLY console with a dedicated hard drive this generation.. SAD!
Thats not evolution to cut that out. But the Rev pretty much has to have one to offer those NES/SNES/N64 games.
:shocked:

Its also looking like the only one with a dedicated physics processor.
First gen Rev games will prob look better than either the PS3 or 360 games due to its single core CPU/physics chip/the ATI Hollywood chip/HDD.
Of course thats just a guess, but highly likely.

One of the other two consoles will take the majority of the sales, no doubt. The marketing and fanboyism behind them is very powerful (yet mindless, its clear Nintendo has the best designed console yet will still undercut both of the other two in price at the same time).
I think the old N has got it truley figured out, yet they are still innovating with the online back catalog and truley revolutionary controller (which looks like the next natural step beyond mouse+keyboard for FPS).

 

[bunnyfubbles]

If Nintendo can get their controller done right, they'll have the biggest advantage. Sony has proven you do not need the prettiest games or most powerful system in order to be the most successful. If Nintendo can keep their price down and innovative play up, then I believe they have a legit shot to take down one of the hyped up titans.

 

[imported_Rampage]

Originally posted by: dfloyd
Woo Hoo, Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers for the win. That game actually scared the crap out of me. Dang big snake. Not to mention the voodoo stuff popping up around every corner. Man I loved that game.

And I completly agree with your assessment friend. I still feel that dropping the hard drive was one of the worst mistakes the 360 has made. At the very least they should of kept a 5-10 GB hard drive. Heck using current generation Xbox hard drives could not of added much to the overall cost of the Xbox and imo made the Xbox what it is. The most innovative amazing and complete console to date.

ironically I agree with pretty much you said as well.

and GK:SOTF was an excellent game!!

oh how ive dreamt for years how beautiful a top-down isometric, 'screen-by-screen' adventure game would look powered by a Geforce6 or 7.
It could simply simply stunning due to the amount of detail that could be put into the scenes.. thousands of individual leaves falling from trees, other environmental wind effects pushing trees to sway back and forth (and also moving the ego's cape back and forth with the wind along with his hair).. it could definitely look much better than any FPS title out today due to the fact you wouldnt have to move everything at breakneck speeds and the screen doesnt move unless you leave the current scene.

I couldnt imagine an adventure game in widescreen with that level of detail.. then for battle scenes zoom in real-time.. ok ok I'm not going to let go of all of my ideas on how to revolutionize how battles are fought in games.
But I do have some fresh ideas that people have never seen before on how to put in-game combat within a modern title.

I'm one that believes its time for something fresh, I think Battlefield 2 is the pinnacle of FPS games.. the only thing we will see are refinements and slight changes to that (Quake Wars ect)

I think theres much more room left in the abandoned Adventure genre and in the RTS and/or turnbased strategy titles for innovation.
FPS have come to push graphics and thats it. Ala men like Carmack.
Graphical innovations are def not pushing gameplay anymore.

Though it will come in handy once Revolution style controls add a new level of realism to all games and the mouse/keyboard is dead, theres just a whole new level of depth and realism with that type of control and it will open up lots of new ways of playing games.

 

[BenSkywalker]

I don't know about that... MS never predicted they would win last generation.

They stated those would be the deciding factors- remember that Sony was pushing their Ethernet and HD solutions around the launch of the XB also- it is just plain ignorance on MS's part.

But even still, the market share that the Xbox did garner is very impressive considering it was their first forey (sp?) and how poorly it was received in Japan.

Hehehe- that is a joke right? The NES was Nintendo's first system and the PS1 was Sony's first system. Saying that the XBox falls closer to the 'abject failure' category would be correct. Don't get me wrong, given the market they were facing they did OK, given that they completely ignored extremely large portions of the market altogether. But let's be realistic about what MS managed to do- not lose by an embarassing amount.

The manufacturers would be quite naive if they were to base future offerings solely on current gen pentetration.

Off line gaming is still the overwhelming majority of the market for every platform including PC. Every year we have heard the ignorant talk of analysts saying 'this will be the year of online' and it hasn't happened- nothing is on the horizon that will change that. The original Famicom was online, the Saturn was online, the DC was online, the PS2 was online and the Cube is online to go along with the XBox- it hasn't meant jack yet. This isn't about blasting a choice made by MS, this is about the market reality.

southpawuni-

And the Sims outsold either one of those games as well.

That list is oudated and it was wrong when it was first made. It combines sales numbers from the US market for some titles, and then world wide for others.

Halo is considered a 'hardcore' gamers choice. Madden/GTA/Sims are not.

GTA most certainly is- it just has crossover appeal to the general gamers the same as Halo.

And dont be so anti-MS

How am I being anti MS in any way? Very happy Windows and Office user here browsing in IE and using Outlook as my email client- also own multiple XBoxs with a considerable library to go along with them. That doesn't indicate that I need to shut off my brain to the obvious.

Nintendo/Sony/MS has experts working for them that get paid big $$ that know way more about the market and the stategy on how to win than you or I, or anyone else do knows.

Interactive TV and Microsoft Bob are going to be the next big things in computer evolution, the internet is just a niche product and a fad that will be short lived.

Carts are the only way to go this generation, moving over to optical media is a poor choice.

BetaMax will be the dominant platform and prevail over VHS.

Yeah, they have flawless track records all of them......

If I were to toss my hat into anyones camp though it would be Nintendo, I'm one of those loyalists who have appreciated their stunning titles since the NES.

This has NOTHING to do with loyalty. I would enjoy it if Sony fell into utter collapse for all the cheap @ss sh!t they have pushed on to the public. Under engineered, designed to break after short periods of time and costing a sizeable premium to boot... they are one of the poorest major corporations in the world. On the other side of that, overall I have been quite fond of MS's products throughout the years, and have found them to provide me with products that I have had no major issues with and have found to be overall superior to their competition.

I'm not talking about what I want to see- I'm talking about reality.

I havent been impressed by a console since the N64.

The SP and DS both impressed me quite a bit and I have greatly enjoyed my Nin Cube titles also. The N64 represents the low point for Nintendo- where their refusal to listen to what the market wanted resulted in their staggering fall. I greatly enjoyed my N64 too, but their choice to go with carts over CD lost them Square and Enix which snowballed into almost every third party player.

I was pretty pleased with what MS did with the Xbox1 myself. I'm disappointed in dropping the HD in the 360, if it had one mandatory I would probably buy one.

You would probably buy one IF the HD were mandatory? That doesn't say anything to you?

But I'm the guy who still misses (and enjoys) PC adventure games. I'm a way different breed than the 3dmark/FPS kiddies in this forum, of course my perspective is going to be way different in what makes a good game.

Sounds like you are on the same page as Wingz and I. I buy every platform, I will be buying a couple of 360s at least(I have five kids ) in the coming years as I won't miss out on a great game due to it being on a different platform then the one I want. That said, if you look at most of the best titles this generation they haven't done very well at all. On the PS2 Ico was a huge flop sales wise, on the Cube Eternal Darkness was sucking wind at registers and on all of the platforms Beyond Good&Evil failed miserably. Talking about which platform will have the best games is something completely different then talking about which one is going to have market supremacy.

 

[imported_Rampage]

I dont necessarily disagree with alot of your reply. But I do feel you are a bit hard on MS, with little or no merit behind the claims.

MS has just as a big of a chance of trumping Sony this time as Sony does MS..

theres no magic crown that Sony holds.. this is the free market.. Sony could go down in utter FLAMES.
I just dont want to simplify things.. these are some of the worlds biggest corporations, MS isnt just rolling over dead for Sony to pump them in the buttocks like some of what you said would damn near suggest.


But yes, I would buy a 360 if the HDD were mandatory, I think it would have increased the quality of games further beyond what the PS3 is capable of if it had it.
Simply put, the time to not have a HDD is long overdue. The fact both of these consoles have 7 CPUs and wizzbang gadgets like the R520, yet no physics processor.. or any other innovations.. or even PAST innovations is just unacceptable.
I wont be partaking.

Its alot akin to a the N64 vs the PS1 or PS2.. N64 had rumble pads, 4 player support, memory cards conveniently in the controller, the first analog thumb hat.
Talk about a great system, Golden Eye, Perfect Dark, the introduction of the awesome Mario Party and Super Smash Bros series.. all in 4player glory
beats the hell out of playing a PS1 today

I think sony is in for a big surprise this round..
They already ran to NV begging for a GPU when they found out the cell wouldnt quite do graphics liek they expected it too.



MS has a nice package, 2nd only to Nintendos.
MS: Good dev tools, simpler programming (3core), tons of software experience behind them, and a mature Xbox Live network. Its gonna be great stuff.

Sony will do well because of their multitudes of little minions, but they are dying off.. Halo took a ton of loyal gamers away.

Its probably THE hardcore console game.
GTA is not hardcore gamer stuffs dude.. i dunno WHERE you get that idea.. the only game league worthy for consoles is the Halo series.

 

[ryo]

Honestly i don't get it why are u people so much in to FPS games and alike.
For me it's so repetitive and so so boring. Get the gun, load it, shoot it, and done.
From first level to last level it's all the same. Shoot everything in front of u. That's all. It makes me sick. Really. And the storyline really really suck too. Besides the good graphics, there's nothing new in this genre.
Thats why i will go for PS3 cos 360 obviouslly full of that kind of games that makes me sick the most.

 

[BenSkywalker]

MS has just as a big of a chance of trumping Sony this time as Sony does MS..

That is absolute luncay. I don't think you will find a single respected analyst, businessman or publisher in the industry who would agree with you.

theres no magic crown that Sony holds..

Yes, there is- actually I should say there are as there are several of them.

1- Playstation. They have the strongest brand name in gaming right now, and by a staggering margin. They have outsold all competitors on a year to year basis in every region in the world for ten years now- they are currently the king of the gaming platforms and it isn't remotely close.

2- GranTurisimo. IMO Forza was better- but it pales in comparison in terms of market demands to GT. GT5 is going to sell millions of units by itself.

3- FinalFantasy- MS is going to get a port of the least popular title in the main series history- Sony gets everything else. Again, IMO KoTOR was better then anything to come out of the FF series in an extremely long time without a doubt, but the market demand for FF on a global basis is enormous.

4- DragonQuest- MS has lost Japan. Period. Whatever platform DQ lands on wins the market- every time- without fail.

5- MetalGearSolid- A series that I think has sucked hard since it left the 8bit NES, but one that is enormously popular.

All of the gaming franchises I listed above have two common elements- they are going to the PS3 and they all are bigger then Halo in the global market. There are numerous other franchise such as DevilMayCry- but that is only roughly equal to what Halo manages.

The fact both of these consoles have 7 CPUs and wizzbang gadgets like the R520, yet no physics processor.. or any other innovations.. or even PAST innovations is just unacceptable.

In terms of PPUs Ageia has already come out and stated that Cell would handle everything their dedicated hardware can without problem. Those 7 SPEs aren't useless despite what you may hear from some extremely ignorant people. In terms of innovation- it doesn't get you anywhere in this industry most of the time. People may lament the lack of it all the time, but reality is that the masses don't want innovation, they want good.

Talk about a great system, Golden Eye, Perfect Dark, the introduction of the awesome Mario Party and Super Smash Bros series.. all in 4player glory
beats the hell out of playing a PS1 today

This may explain part of where you get your delusions about MS's chances this gen. The N64 was pathetic at best for the marketplace. YOU may like, but it was an extremely poor system to sell to John Q Gamer.

I think sony is in for a big surprise this round..
They already ran to NV begging for a GPU when they found out the cell wouldnt quite do graphics liek they expected it too.

Proves that they aren't taking any chances. They went with the company that whipped their team last generation- left MS with the also rans of last gen. Smart move on their part.

MS has a nice package, 2nd only to Nintendos.

I don't think of it as nice, more.... hideous beyond description. The people who came up with that design claimed they were trying to make it fit in to the living room.... they should walk in to an electronics store and see how much glossy ivory parts there are. Of course, this is entirely based on perspective(except the 360 isn't going to match existing electronics devices).

MS: Good dev tools, simpler programming (3core), tons of software experience behind them, and a mature Xbox Live network. Its gonna be great stuff.

With the exception of Live! which applies to a miniscule market segment as we already discussed, that does any of the rest of that have to do with the system being better? The original XB was far easier to develop for then the current 360 and that got its faced smashed into the ground and then urinated on by a system that required assembly level development for decent performance. Non factors to the marketplace.

Sony will do well because of their multitudes of little minions, but they are dying off.. Halo took a ton of loyal gamers away.

Do you realize the overwhelming majority of gamers don't like FPSs? That is the reality of the marketplace. Halo didn't do jack sh!t to Sony- they aren't a company that has ever focused on that element as MS has made it its center piece.

GTA is not hardcore gamer stuffs dude.. i dunno WHERE you get that idea.. the only game league worthy for consoles is the Halo series.

Go to a GTA launch event. I've done Halo and GTA, you don't have a clue what you are talking about if you think GTA isn't HUGE with the hardcore set. For that matter, GTA is huge with the entire development community also- it forced them to change the way they make games. Halo was a highly polished shooter, no more, no less.

 

[imported_Rampage]

you sure do like to argue every little point LOL.. i wish i had more time to respond to every little thing like that

 

[Heinrich]

THIS 40 year old gamer, who's been gaming for 25 years, was seriously perked up completely by accident when I booted AMPED up on my Xbox. I looked up at 2am and I still had my tie on from work on a Friday when I left a bit early and got home at 5pm. Amped 2 was a decent improvement. I am a bit scared of Amped 3 as apparently they're revamping it a bit, but, AMPED at least WAS a very unique and awesome game.

I have played everything - MMORPG (with 5 accounts on different games), flight-sims, FPS, RTS, stealth-combat...AMPED was a refreshing change that was quite addictive and extremely enjoyable.

Don't forget about amped!!

 

[Eureka]

Pssch, waiting for PS3. I'm sorry, but Halo does NOT catch my attention. If I want FPS, I have my PC (which I love it for). However, PS3 has Metal Gear Solid, which is my game of choice. Then again, I don't have any other console game that I want, so I might just borrow a friend's PS3 for MGS4.

Halo sucks the big one.

However, Yoshi is the best game character ever, it's even better than Snake, Jack Carver, Gordon Freeman, or Master Chief (okay, so he's at the bottom of game characters). They just need a new Yoshi-dedicated game.

Norm

Norm

 

[Wingznut]

Originally posted by: Heinrich
THIS 40 year old gamer, who's been gaming for 25 years, was seriously perked up completely by accident when I booted AMPED up on my Xbox. I looked up at 2am and I still had my tie on from work on a Friday when I left a bit early and got home at 5pm. Amped 2 was a decent improvement. I am a bit scared of Amped 3 as apparently they're revamping it a bit, but, AMPED at least WAS a very unique and awesome game.

I have played everything - MMORPG (with 5 accounts on different games), flight-sims, FPS, RTS, stealth-combat...AMPED was a refreshing change that was quite addictive and extremely enjoyable.

Don't forget about amped!!

THIS 37 year old gamer, who's been gaming since he got his first PONG console in '77, completely agrees! I'm not a Tony Hawk fan at all, but when I saw Amped at my friend's house, I HAD to get an Xbox! I really liked Amped 2, especially the online component... It's just too bad that I sucked at it.

 

[klah]

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker

MS has just as a big of a chance of trumping Sony this time as Sony does MS..

That is absolute luncay. I don't think you will find a single respected analyst, businessman or publisher in the industry who would agree with you.

http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/11/03/console/index.php

Microsoft Corp. is likely to win the next round of the game console fight against Sony Corp. based on a potentially huge cost difference that could see the Xbox 360 selling for half the price of a PlayStation 3 (PS3) by the end of next year, investment firm Merrill Lynch said in a Wednesday analysis.

http://sanfrancisco.bizjournals.com/sanfrancisco/stories/2005/11/14/story2.html

Xbox 360 has a six-month lead on Sony's PlayStation 3 and Nintendo's Revolution, new consoles out next spring. Thanks to its head start and souped-up features, the new Xbox will far outsell the other consoles in 2006 and likely in 2007, predicted IDC analyst Schelley Olhava. That would shake up the game world's hierarchy.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/09/29/news_6134710.html

Analyst: Xbox 360 leads console wars through 2008

In their latest gaming industry overview for investors, Piper Jaffray analysts Anthony Gikas and Stephanie Wissink...

Starting with the home hardware, Gikas and Wissink released their sales projections for each system over the next three years. Through 2008, Gikas and Wissink expect Microsoft to sell 19.6 million Xbox 360 units, with the PlayStation 3 and Revolution trailing at 15.5 million and 5 million units, respectively.

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker

...they are currently the king of the gaming platforms and it isn't remotely close.

http://wham.canoe.ca/360/2005/11/11/1303036-ap.html

Gartner estimates that PlayStation 2 currently has about 51 percent of the worldwide market for the most recently available consoles, compared with about 34 percent for the first Xbox and 15 percent for Nintendo Co.?s GameCube.

 

[BenSkywalker]

klah-

The DC outsold the PS2 up to a point too- what does the quotes you provided have to do with the discussion at hand? The furthest out any analyst would wager that you could find was '08- a couple of years into the PS3's likely 6-7 year life cycle. Go ahead and search some more, that is about the most generous to MS you are going to find.

Gartner estimates that PlayStation 2 currently has about 51 percent of the worldwide market for the most recently available consoles, compared with about 34 percent for the first Xbox and 15 percent for Nintendo Co.?s GameCube.

This one is particularly amusing as we have these things called sales numbers, and they aren't coming close to falling in line with the estimates that article claims. That said, even if they were- the PS2 would have a 50% lead over the XBox(it is actually much larger then that).

Don't forget about amped!!

For some reason I always enjoyed 1080 more. Don't get me wrong, Amped is an in depth comprehensive simish type game while 1080 is arcade style racing- I just tend to enjoy arcade style racing more in my snow board titles(polar opposite of my auto driving choices for some reason).

 

[Heinrich]

I'm SOO here, you guys can keep your Halo, Knights of the Old Republic, PGR3, Metal Gear Solid, Mario



The Best Console Game

 

[Phluxed]

Ps3. Killzone2 > Anything the 360 will be able to produce.

 

[dfloyd]

I am very glad so many of you are pointing out Amped because it does prove a very valueable point. Certain games can only push a console so far. So please lets stop saying Halo is all that M$ has, there are tons of games coming out for the 360 that are very impressive that have nothing to do with Halo. Personally I would buy the 360 for the next KOTOR or Jade Empire any day over Halo, and every day over MGS. So just saying Halo was a good or bad game does not tell very much of the story.

And I am not saying this about MGS either, yes Sony has many other games. Games that I myself do not like. I dont like Sonys PS1 or PS2 control system, and the majority of games I have played on the PS2 do not look nearly as good as they should, do not control nearly as good as Xbox or Gamecube counterparts, and just overall are not as in depth or as fun as either of the other systems. They are trapped in the world of Anime and it seems the majority of games they can create are only based loosely on this vision of the world. So many PS based games are so dang similar.

And those arguing that they have a computer and they dont need the Xbox for another FPS. Fine dont get one for another FPS, but Jade Empire is not a FPS, Dead or Alive is not a FPS, Nor is Amped, Project Gotham Racing, Fuzion Frenzy, Ninja Gaiden, and nor are many other games FPS that are better on a console. For instance Racing games, fighting games, platform games, multiplayer games (The kind where you friend sits and laughs beside you), coop games, etc . Yes the FPS shooter is better on a PC, but most other types of games, save maybe strategy and MMORPGs, are better on a console. That and a PC cannot compare to the fun of a console when you have 3-4 friends over to hang out. Its just not designed to be played the way a console is. Yes you can play it over the net with others but its still not the same.

So while I agree PC gaming to me has been more fulfilling overall I think discounting a console because of FPS is a bad mistake, and making it sound like FPS is the only thing the Xbox has going for it is far from true. Halo was the best Console based FPS ever at the time it was released. Even if you did not like the game, you cannot deny that no other console FPS had ever come close to accomplishing what it did. The coop alone in that game was priceless. Nothing like following your friend along with your trusty shotgun otu, your finger twitches and its oops, sorry man I slipped. Talk about getting cracked up . Oh that and the first time you find the rocket launcher you look over at your friend in the jeep and say hmmm, should I?, and you do and laugh your ass off as the jeep does a 360 flip up in the air. Its just pricelss and fun, the whole point of gaming. Gaming is not to fit into a little prescirbed box where everyone thinks its supposed to be a certain way. This does nothing but create boring games. Instead gaming should be everything it can be in every way it can be. So yes this means we should have FPS on consoles, even though PCs do a better job. And console makers listen up, this also means we need games like Baldurs Gate: DA and D&D Heros on the PC. Those games were made for the PC and internet TCP/IP.