XGL vs Aero Glass

stupidkid

Member
Jun 21, 2006
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Which one do you think is better?

I find it funny how Aero Glass requires a min of 1 Gb RAM and 1 GHz cpu. Also it took Microsoft 5 years just to get the beta version working while XGL has only been out for a few months. Granted it is also in a very unstable stage, but nevertheless, XGL's development has been many times faster than that of Aero Glass.
 

CTho9305

Elite Member
Jul 26, 2000
9,214
1
81
I find it funny how Aero Glass requires a min of 1 Gb RAM and 1 GHz cpu. Also it took Microsoft 5 years just to get the beta version working while XGL has only been out for a few months. Granted it is also in a very unstable stage, but nevertheless, XGL's development has been many times faster than that of Aero Glass.

I find it funny how you compare something that's already in widespread use to something that is "in a very unstable stage". If you read carefully, you'd also know that Vista itself doesn't require 1GB for itself, but MS set that requirement so that OEMs wouldn't be able to sell "Vista-ready" machines with skimpy RAM amounts (like they used to for a long time with XP - enough to run the OS, but not any apps).
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
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Areo glass will cause people less problems then XGL. Mainly because Microsoft's monopoly status dictates hardware design for video cards nowadays and video card companies spend millions and millions of dollars designing, testing, evaluating, and programming to make sure that their stuff works ok with Windows Vista.. were with XGL they couldn't give a sh1t less.

The advantages of XGL would be that it's probably much more flexible then Areo (or Aqua). End users would get a chance to design and program their own visual effects and special 3d tricks. I figure that with enough people playing around with eye candy somebody will actually create something usefull for the Linux 3d desktop, rather then just having 'bling'.

Also, as always, X has the advantage of not being restricted to local applications, and XGL will be no exception. The ability to have indirect acceleration for vector graphics and other items while doing compositing will be a big advantage for XGL over Areo's compisition stuff. Last I noticed while in compisition mode there is no hardware acceleration for the win32 GDI stuff. Not that a lot of people will notice this since computers are so fast compared to what they used to be (and X render stuff doesn't realy do a good job of utilizing acceleration anyways)

As for 'XGL' being unstable or whatnot, it's not nessicarially true. AIGLX (which has XGL at it's core) impliments features like accelerated indirect rendering and is included by default with the latest release of Xorg's X server. (X.org release 7.1) You can use compiz with that to get Novell's special effects like cubed desktop/fancy window switching/wobbly windows, if you like.. I beleive. I beleive that it's not enabled by default though. Not all cards/video drivers will support it... Although eventually even old machines should be able to run it well.

With some work you can probably either use AIGLX + metacity's special upgrades (the luminocity stuff) or Novell's compiz on Fedora Core 5 currently. I am not sure though since I haven't tried it out yet.

As far as the resource usages go Apple is clearly the winner. Their original Aqua compisitioning stuff ran with NO hardware acceleration what-so-ever with the early releases of MacOS 10, and it was still fast enough to be usable on 300mhz machines with 128 megs of RAM.
 

luigionlsd

Senior member
Jan 21, 2005
256
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XGL was sweet... my friend showed it to me on an IBM Thinkpad T30 notebook with 32-64mb(tops) integrated video, 1.6 Pentium 4M with 256 RAM, running on SuSE Linux 10.1. It was really impressive, and it's something Vista may be up to in 2 years, but definitely not on that old of hardware. My vote goes to XGL!
 

n0cmonkey

Elite Member
Jun 10, 2001
42,936
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Originally posted by: CTho9305
I find it funny how you compare something that's already in widespread use to something that is "in a very unstable stage".

Wait, what's in wide spread use already?
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
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76
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
I'm still trying to figure out what this stuff will be useful for...
Oh, come on. It's purty!

I like it. I like the 'eye candy' and I think it looks very slick. I'm going to have to try this out when I get a chance.

 

n0cmonkey

Elite Member
Jun 10, 2001
42,936
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Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
I'm still trying to figure out what this stuff will be useful for...
Oh, come on. It's purty!

I like it. I like the 'eye candy' and I think it looks very slick. I'm going to have to try this out when I get a chance.

I'm not trying to put that aspect of it down at all. I'm just hoping there's some real world uses for it too...
 

Seeruk

Senior member
Nov 16, 2003
986
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Im in agreement with nocmonkey

Both are purdy... but neither has demonstrated any great advance in UI or interface design. The number of clicks from data on screen to user's eyeballs is as high as ever which neither address.

EDIT: Wait Ctrl+Arrow keys is nice to switch desktops iin XGL
 

dawks

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
5,071
2
81
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
I'm still trying to figure out what this stuff will be useful for...
Oh, come on. It's purty!

I like it. I like the 'eye candy' and I think it looks very slick. I'm going to have to try this out when I get a chance.

I'm not trying to put that aspect of it down at all. I'm just hoping there's some real world uses for it too...


I think one of the keys will be with WPF. Just an accelerated interface in itself isnt that useful, other then looking cool. But WPF will make 3D applications MUCH easier for developers and it can be used for some cool things such as e-commerce, allowing users to get a more indepth view of products, or like a video on Channel9 shows, Power companies can use it to get a much more detailed and interactive view of their grid for another example. Sure this is possible without WPF, but its much more difficult, and much more work. It can take months to code a 3D app properly, but now it can be done in a matter of days with WPF.

Also note WPF is designed in such a way that 3D can be done over remote desktop with Vista now, or so a WPF developer said.

I know there are a ******-ton of people here who would be completly content with a text only interface (console humpers), but the majority of computer users want a fancy 3D interface like in Minority Report or other such movies..
 

EndGame

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2002
1,276
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I could honestly give a rats behind about either.......I'm still partial to 2K, Linux without the "fluff".
 

darkdemyze

Member
Dec 1, 2005
155
0
0
Xgl looks pretty, Aero has support. If you have the time ( which I don't ) for frequent crashes then xgl looks great. But for those of us who need a solid OS gnome / kde + xp works fine for me. I'm still excited for Vista though, but since it' still in beta, I don't bother using it exclusively.
 

sourceninja

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2005
8,805
65
91
I have no use for any of this new Aero and xgl stuff. I want my UI as simple as possible.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
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76
Originally posted by: KarmaPolice
I just installed ubunto..how hard is it to install xgl?

<---linux newb

I got it working. First time it bombed. I had to install the latest fglrx ATI drivers. Now it's working but not properly. I can't resize windows or drag them around. In fact, there's no 'menu bar' on top of the window to drag. Open apps don't show up in the taskbar. Alt-tab doesn't switch between open apps. I'm sure I've got something configured wrong.

I will say it's *much* slower than my regular Gnome desktop was before. For what it's worth I'm using the IBM laptop in my sig.

Edit: In the instructions there's a list of things to organize under 'System | Preferences | Sessions'. I had to give the 2 items added for XGL higher priority and it worked. I was playing around with Thunderbird & Firefox and my X just crashed. Looks neat but slow and aparently crash happy. Now I've got to figure out how to put 'regular Gnome' back.
 

stupidkid

Member
Jun 21, 2006
113
0
0
Originally posted by: KarmaPolice
I just installed ubunto..how hard is it to install xgl?

<---linux newb

Go to their forums, there are many very very detailed guides. Just make sure your graphics card is supported first.
 

screw3d

Diamond Member
Nov 6, 2001
6,906
1
76
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: KarmaPolice
I just installed ubunto..how hard is it to install xgl?

<---linux newb

I got it working. First time it bombed. I had to install the latest fglrx ATI drivers. Now it's working but not properly. I can't resize windows or drag them around. In fact, there's no 'menu bar' on top of the window to drag. Open apps don't show up in the taskbar. Alt-tab doesn't switch between open apps. I'm sure I've got something configured wrong.

I will say it's *much* slower than my regular Gnome desktop was before. For what it's worth I'm using the IBM laptop in my sig.

Edit: In the instructions there's a list of things to organize under 'System | Preferences | Sessions'. I had to give the 2 items added for XGL higher priority and it worked. I was playing around with Thunderbird & Firefox and my X just crashed. Looks neat but slow and aparently crash happy. Now I've got to figure out how to put 'regular Gnome' back.

Moving windows is still a little buggy.. but if you hold alt and click anywhere on the window, you should be able to move it.
 
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