YAGT: OMG I love guns

[clamum]

Can we have an Anandtech gun meet or something? That'd be wicked. :awe: Then I dont need to go from place to place testing them.

Ypsilanti, MI here. Sounds like fun! Hehe.

I disagree. Sigs and HK's are extremely reliable when properly maintained. Striker fired guns just tend to be more reliable when abused and neglected. That said I know from personal experience that Sigs can be abused and neglected and still be dead nuts reliable. I imagine HK's will do the same.

Uh yeah, I agree, I'd say the SIG P226 I have is fairly reliable. I wouldn't think the Navy Seals use it if it was a piece of shit.

 

[ManBearPig]

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[pontifex]

We all gotta start somewhere

yeah, but he already shot some guns, this should have been explained to him BEFORE he shot them...

 

[pontifex]

Wtf does a decocker do? In laymans terms...i cant understand the shit posted on the internet.

safely lowers the hammer without you having to pull the trigger.

 

[jpeyton]

Ha! I plan on it.

Can you guys please recommend a nice fireproof gun safe (BIL)? He says thanks for all the info btw!

http://www.amazon.com/SentrySafe-GM2...918354&sr=8-12

 

[jpeyton]

Wtf does a decocker do? In laymans terms...i cant understand the shit posted on the internet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decocker#Decocker

 

[Pia]

OP: if you want to actually learn to shoot, not just own cool guns, you are going to be shooting a lot. For instance, I use 50-120 rounds per range trip. If I went to the range once a week, it would be about 4000 rounds a year. Owning a .22 gun pays itself back pretty fast because .22 is so cheap even compared to 9mm. Quality .22 guns are also more accurate than mid-priced guns in larger calibers, so they show your mistakes better and are more effective for basic practice. Low recoil is another factor that helps you learn faster. And finally, I don't know what your range situation is, but for me there are more places I can shoot a .22 than places I can shoot bigger calibers.

I recommend the CZ Kadet. It's shaped exactly like the 9mm/.40 CZs, so muscle memory acquired with it will transfer to the CZ75, and it fits into the same holsters. I don't own an entire Kadet myself, but I have the Kadet .22 conversion (slide and magazines) for my CZ75. Highly recommended.

You can see a Kadet conversion on a CZ75 here.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/forums/posts.aspx?postID=18898&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1

 

[Pia]

3)If im right handed, do I close my left eye and look with my right, or does it not matter? For whatever reason, I kept closing my right eye and using my left.

Both of these are wrong. You should not close either eye when aiming. Doing so introduces unnecessary tension which makes you shoot worse in a range situation. It's also bad for a tactical application since it cuts your field of vision almost in half.

Which eye you line up with the sights depends on which one is dominant. You can find this out by looking at your thumb and holding the thumb on top of a target in the distance. Now, when you close the dominant eye, you see the thumb moving off target. When you close the weak eye, the thumb stays on target.

 

[Merad]

Wtf does a decocker do? In laymans terms...i cant understand the shit posted on the internet.

Without the decocker you have to hold the trigger back and use your thumb to lower the hammer. So if your thumb slips and there's a round chambered, the gun goes boom.

Normally with a single action gun like a 1911 there's no reason to uncock it unless its already unloaded. But on a DA/SA like the P226, you need to uncock the gun to put it in DA mode and make it safe to carry - in other words you need to do it with the gun loaded. So the decocker gives you a safe way to do that.

 

[gorcorps]

Both of these are wrong. You should not close either eye when aiming. Doing so introduces unnecessary tension which makes you shoot worse in a range situation. It's also bad for a tactical application since it cuts your field of vision almost in half.

Which eye you line up with the sights depends on which one is dominant. You can find this out by looking at your thumb and holding the thumb on top of a target in the distance. Now, when you close the dominant eye, you see the thumb moving off target. When you close the weak eye, the thumb stays on target.

Neither of those is "wrong" if you train yourself that way. Do what's natural. A lot of people can't sight in properly with both eyes open regardless of how long they force themselves to do it. Then when you can't hit anything you get frustrated and give up.

The dominant eye test is also quite hard to do properly if you know what it's doing. You can see both viewpoints at the same time, so I can line up the test to whichever eye I want to be dominant. Or maybe I don't have a dominant eye and others don't have this "problem" with the test. I just treat my right as dominant and go from there.

Lately I've been trying to shoot both eyes open, and focusing on target. This gives me a "double image" of the gun in my peripherals, but it's not that hard to line up in reality.

 

[Pia]

Neither of those is "wrong" if you train yourself that way. Do what's natural.

A lot of good shooting is doing what is unnatural. What do you naturally do when a gun goes off in your hand (or you are expecting it to)? Tense up, squeeze harder, push gun away from body, pull head away, flinch, blink your eyes. We don't want any of that to happen.

A lot of people can't sight in properly with both eyes open regardless of how long they force themselves to do it. Then when you can't hit anything you get frustrated and give up.

Most people can do it, and everyone should if they can. So at least one should seriously try. There are methods which help to learn the correct focus and reinforce the dominance of one eye. Some classic ones are putting a piece of transparent tape on glasses to blur the vision of the weak eye, or outright block the weak eye with something.

The dominant eye test is also quite hard to do properly if you know what it's doing. You can see both viewpoints at the same time, so I can line up the test to whichever eye I want to be dominant. Or maybe I don't have a dominant eye and others don't have this "problem" with the test. I just treat my right as dominant and go from there.

Knowing what the test is for has nothing to do with being able to do the test. You thrust the thumb hard towards target (say, the nearest doorjamb) and freeze the thumb in place. This should take much less than half a second. If there's time to think, line up or aim, you are doing it wrong. Only worry about doing stuff with the eyes after the thumb is out there.

The test will produce a result no matter what. I guess with very equidominant eyes you'd see the thumb move no matter which eye you close.

Lately I've been trying to shoot both eyes open, and focusing on target. This gives me a "double image" of the gun in my peripherals, but it's not that hard to line up in reality.

Focus on target is generally recommended only in very fast, short distance shooting. I end up using it in a half-assed way when timer is running because I'm greedy, though I don't even have decent regular sight focus yet and certainly can't shoot reliably with target focus.

 

[slag]

I'm a noob when it comes to firearms, but I wouldn't want to "train" on a 22 pistol and then move up to a 9 mm or larger. The weight of the gun, coupled with the recoil and recovery is totally different and to learn on one and then have to switch to another would make the training almost null. I can see getting a benefit of having your stance correct and arm position, but aside from that, I'd probably want to stick with the weapon I'd be intending to use.

 

[irishScott]

Lately I've been trying to shoot both eyes open, and focusing on target. This gives me a "double image" of the gun in my peripherals, but it's not that hard to line up in reality.

Yep, and it's going to be that way for a while until you get your eyes trained. Easiest way I found was to focus on the front sight post. The I just unloaded my gun, picked a spot on the wall and drew/aimed a few times until it finally clicked (this was after the "eye dominance test" readily determined that I was right-eye dominant). I still see the double image, but the images are more separate now and I've trained my mind/eyes to focus on the correct one.

 

[ManBearPig]

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[irishScott]

This is kinda what I thought too. It was such a huge difference using the .40 after the .22 I felt like I'd have to learn everything all over again.

.22 is primarily for fundamentals. You can learn how to control a trigger, how to hold the gun properly, how to aim, etc for much cheaper. The only advantage of practicing with a larger round is learning how to handle the increased recoil.

 

[ManBearPig]

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[Merad]

Gotcha. How do you guys feel about buying used? Also, did prices go up a lot or something? I keep seeing guns in forum posts and stuff from a while (not long while) ago and they're a lot more expensive when I look now.

This is because of people freaking out about Obama?

I would be very hesitant about buying used unless there's someone you trust who has good knowledge of guns (preferably is a gunsmith) that can inspect a potential purchase and give you an honest assessment of its condition.

I haven't really paid attention to gun prices, but ammo has been going up lately, largely because of the election. (P&N)

Spoiler

A lot of the crazies believe that Obama will go all out on gun control if he's re-elected, and groups like the NRA are encouraging that message.

The same thing happened in 2008-2009.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

If you get a 1911 get one in .45 and get a Colt.

Another option is the Browning High Power (same designer as the 1911) in 9mm:

Might be a bit past your budget though.

I'd get the CZ75.

Why just the Colt? There are many makers of 1911's that offer equal or better quality than the Colts. Colt is living off of it's name at this point.

Springfield, Remington, STI, Sig, Kimber, Rock Island, Smith and Wesson all make 1911's that are just as reliable as a standard Colt. Rock Island is really the only one in that group that makes a very affordable 1911. Though the finish on them is not as good as the rest of them, they are highly regaurded as good entry/begineer 1911's. You can get decked out Tactical 1911 (ie extended ambi safety, beavertail grip safety, novak style sites) in 9mm or .45 for under $500. I think you can even get the full rail version for right at $500. There are a few lemons that make it out, but RIA will make it right, and quickly.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

ouch....go do some learning before you buy anything

Hence, he is asking questions here.

Wtf does a decocker do? In laymans terms...i cant understand the shit posted on the internet.

It's a manual lever that de-cocks the hammer. Some guns like the Sigs, the decocker drops the hammer. Other guns like the Beretta 92FS it will drop the hammer and disengage the firing pin.

yeah, but he already shot some guns, this should have been explained to him BEFORE he shot them...

Why? As long as he was told the safety rules, why does he need to know how the gun works?
Do you know the mechanical principles of all the components of your car? Do you know the circuit design of the computer you are using?

As far as striker fired vs. hammer fired. 99% of hammer fired guns, ie DA/SA offer second strike capability. IE if you pull the trigger and the round doesn't go off for some reason, you can just pull the trigger again and it will cock the hammer and drop the hammer again. Sometimes primers just do go off on the 1st try.
With a Glock, you would have to pull the slide back a bit to get it to reset the striker/trigger so you can pull the trigger again.

Guns like the 1911 and Browning Hi-Power are hammer fired, but are Single Action only, and do not have second strike capabilities. You would have to thumb the hammer back to try again or rack the slide to eject the failed round and load the next one in the mag.

 

[ManBearPig]

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[Pia]

I'm a noob when it comes to firearms, but I wouldn't want to "train" on a 22 pistol and then move up to a 9 mm or larger. The weight of the gun, coupled with the recoil and recovery is totally different and to learn on one and then have to switch to another would make the training almost null. I can see getting a benefit of having your stance correct and arm position, but aside from that, I'd probably want to stick with the weapon I'd be intending to use.

Pretty much all of that is BS. Fundamental shooting skills transfer easily between different guns. .22 pistols can weigh as much or more as larger caliber guns. In the case of a .22 conversion being used on a larger caliber gun frame, you are even holding the exact same gun and squeezing the exact same trigger.

"Recoil and recovery" naturally changes when you switch to different caliber. (It also changes when you switch to different ammo.) But nothing the shooter does is significantly different. "Recoil control", when the goal is fast and accurate follow-up shots, pretty much equals relaxation, correct grip, and good body alignment, all of which you learn shooting a .22. Relaxation is actually easier to learn with the .22. (Why would you expect your body to relax next to large explosions if it can't yet even relax next to small explosions?)

 

[BladeVenom]

.22 is primarily for fundamentals. You can learn how to control a trigger, how to hold the gun properly, how to aim, etc for much cheaper. The only advantage of practicing with a larger round is learning how to handle the increased recoil.

Agreed. Learning with a .22 also helps you from developing bad habits like flinching and anticipating recoil. When you anticipate the recoil, it throws off your aim.

 

[pontifex]

Hence, he is asking questions here.


It's a manual lever that de-cocks the hammer. Some guns like the Sigs, the decocker drops the hammer. Other guns like the Beretta 92FS it will drop the hammer and disengage the firing pin.


Why? As long as he was told the safety rules, why does he need to know how the gun works?
Do you know the mechanical principles of all the components of your car? Do you know the circuit design of the computer you are using?

As far as striker fired vs. hammer fired. 99% of hammer fired guns, ie DA/SA offer second strike capability. IE if you pull the trigger and the round doesn't go off for some reason, you can just pull the trigger again and it will cock the hammer and drop the hammer again. Sometimes primers just do go off on the 1st try.
With a Glock, you would have to pull the slide back a bit to get it to reset the striker/trigger so you can pull the trigger again.

Guns like the 1911 and Browning Hi-Power are hammer fired, but are Single Action only, and do not have second strike capabilities. You would have to thumb the hammer back to try again or rack the slide to eject the failed round and load the next one in the mag.

you seriously asked "why does he need to know how a gun works?" are you kidding? there is no comparison to a car and a gun. you have to know how to fucking operate it! I know how to operate my car, know what all the pedals and knobs, and shit does.

is he going to take the gun to a smith every time he needs to clean it?

I'm not saying he has to know every intricate little detail, but he should fucking know what what all the levers and buttons do to operate it.

 

[pontifex]

THANK you for that explanation!! I actually googled around before you wrote this and those RIAs are indeed supposed to be sweet.

For reference...what were the Ruger 22 and Glock 22 that I fired?

All we did was (basically) slid the top back (or after all bullets were ejected it did it automatically), put the magazine in, then slid the top back and fired.

Are you guys ok with stainless finishes on guns?

stainless is easier to maintain. won't rust as easily and won't show wear as bad a blued will.

 

[ManBearPig]

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