YAGT - safety or no safety?

[KillerCharlie]

I'm going to buy a S&W M&P 9mm. I've put a few hundred rounds through that model already at the range, and I own a couple other pistols (Ruger 22, 1911).

Would you buy the version with or without the thumb safety? The DAO trigger is like a glock so by default they didn't make safeties (trigger has to be fully pressed all the way to fire). I imagine a thumb safety would just get in the way. However if I get one with a thumb safety it's relatively simple to remove.

I've never carried a pistol but I think I might be more likely too once I buy this. After the crazy guy that shot a ranger at Mt. Rainier a few months ago and the crazy guy who hid in that bunker here a couple days ago, concealing is starting to sound like a decent idea.

Picture with thumb safety here (it's a newer 1911 style thumb safety):
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...n+17+++1+9MMAmbidextrous+Manual+Safety4.25"+B

 

[irishScott]

Assuming you have a holster that properly covers the trigger, I wouldn't bother. The thumb-safety models are to satisfy the requirements of the gun law short-bus states.

The reason such safeties are around on 1911s and such is due to the single-action-only operation of the trigger.

 

[KillerCharlie]

That's what I was leaning towards. If I carried it I would buy a holster specifically designed for it. In an emergency it seems like a safety would just be one more thing to worry about.

 

[irishScott]

That's what I was leaning towards. If I carried it I would buy a holster specifically designed for it. In an emergency it seems like a safety would just be one more thing to worry about.

It's a trainable reflex, but yeah it is one extra step. On a 1911 IMO it's worth it for the better trigger, but on a gun like the M&P, not so much.

 

[Kelvrick]

If you like to shoot 1911's, then get the version with the safety. Even with the DAO, the trained reflex will still work the same. Draw and flick off safety as you extend.

All of my "carry" handguns don't have safety and are all dao. These are also the ones I train the most with.

I have some 1911's that I sometimes to go competition with, but I can mentally prepare myself to operate the safety. Not something I want to deal with in potentially dangerous situations.

If you're inexperienced, then go to a store and play with both kinds. Then train with whatever you buy.

 

[boomhower]

There's really no right or wrong answer. It's just a matter of training. Whatever you buy make sure you train with it. If you buy one with a safety it will just be a muscle reaction every time you draw. Personally, no safety for me. I was trained based on no safety(Glock's) so I am not going to start now. As long as you follow basic firearms safety there is no reason for a manual safety on DOA or Glock style trigger systems. Revolvers were ran for a long long time with no safeties, just because the gun is a semi-auto doesn't change the fact a safety isn't needed for a properly handles gun.

The only guns that need a safety are SAO guns with the 1911 style being far and away the most popular and about the only one out there. Off the top of my head some Sig and CZ are the only other ones that come to mind.

 

[TallBill]

If you buy a firearm with or without a safety DO NOT buy a index finger retention holster. Great way to shoot yourself in the leg by true accident.

 

[Kroze]

No safety.

 

[Merad]

Would you buy the version with or without the thumb safety? The DAO trigger is like a glock so by default they didn't make safeties (trigger has to be fully pressed all the way to fire). I imagine a thumb safety would just get in the way. However if I get one with a thumb safety it's relatively simple to remove.

Glocks do have a safety - the trigger can't be pulled unless your finger is on it, and the gun can't be fired unless the trigger is pulled (trigger pull fully cocks the striker and removes the firing pin block). /nitpick

Anyway, a DAO trigger is (should be) very different from a Glock's trigger. DA trigger pulls are long and heavy, usually 10 lbs+, while he Glock is lighter (5.5 lbs stock) and shorter.

Either one is fine IMO. If you're reckless about putting your booger hooker on the bang switch when it shouldn't be there, a manual safety isn't going to save you.

 

[sourceninja]

I don't see the point of a safety and a modern firearm. None of my carry pistols have a safety and I have never shot anything I didn't intend to shoot. With all the internal safeties built into modern pistols, there really is no reason to have a manual one.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

For all intents and purposes, a glock has no safety and you have to be very careful because of that. Get a good grip on the gun, pull out of holster and trigger gets caught on clothing and it will go boom.

IMO no safety means outside waistband holster only IE LEO and other "job related" carrying setups.

I would not be comfortable tugging a glock out of a tight inside waistband holster or pocket holster due to the risk of the trigger getting caught as you're pulling it out in a life or death situation.

Plus, I grew up around handguns and rifles. Flicking off a safety is truly second nature for me, it's an absolute non-issue to remember it as it's just part of firing a gun. It's no different than "remembering" to pull the trigger.

It's all about training, IMO. I would not want to have a glock as a range toy then carry a 1911 as I could see someone forgetting to flick off the safety. Personally all of my guns are 1911-style because of this.

 

[sourceninja]

Umm, caught as you pull it out would not in any way press the trigger in the direction it needs to fire. Pushing it back in because it got caught and you were not properly trained might, but I have never drawn my gun and had it fire due to forward pressure on a trigger.

 

[xBiffx]

For my carry weapon, I prefer no safety aside from the built in trigger and grip safeties on my XD. Safety switches for a carry weapon are beyond stupid. By the time you disengage it, it might be too late. For any other weapon, I really don't care one way or the other.

 

[corwin]

Another vote for no safety...kinda pointless if you're not in a nanny state that requires it

 

[jessieqwert]

If you buy a firearm with or without a safety DO NOT buy a index finger retention holster. Great way to shoot yourself in the leg by true accident.

like a serpa? don't see an issue

vote for no safety - if the safety keeps you from firing a gun "accidentally" you need to get rid of your guns

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Umm, caught as you pull it out would not in any way press the trigger in the direction it needs to fire. Pushing it back in because it got caught and you were not properly trained might, but I have never drawn my gun and had it fire due to forward pressure on a trigger.

In some dire situation, such as a thug brutally bashing your head against the ground, it may be difficult to pull your gun out without having a firm grasp on the grip. It's very possible for the trigger to get snagged on something while drawing. I'm not saying it's likely, but I do think it's more likely than someone who has practiced using a safety forgetting that it's on.

 

[shortylickens]

For carry I prefer no manual safety or extra junk on the outside.
LCP is perfect for me.

 

[hanoverphist]

If you like to shoot 1911's, then get the version with the safety. Even with the DAO, the trained reflex will still work the same. Draw and flick off safety as you extend.

All of my "carry" handguns don't have safety and are all dao. These are also the ones I train the most with.

I have some 1911's that I sometimes to go competition with, but I can mentally prepare myself to operate the safety. Not something I want to deal with in potentially dangerous situations.

If you're inexperienced, then go to a store and play with both kinds. Then train with whatever you buy.

this. i have an old p89 ruger with the thumb safety, and its such a normal thing for me to draw and hit that safety i have to consciously make myself NOT turn the safety off when i pull it to put it in the safe or check/ clean it. but, thats a lot of years of carrying and practicing with the same hand gun, so the training thing is a must regardless of what fire arm you choose.

 

[jessieqwert]

In some dire situation, such as a thug brutally bashing your head against the ground, it may be difficult to pull your gun out without having a firm grasp on the grip. It's very possible for the trigger to get snagged on something while drawing. I'm not saying it's likely, but I do think it's more likely than someone who has practiced using a safety forgetting that it's on.

This sounds like not wearing a seatbelt to prevent being trapped in a fire.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

No external safety, especially on a carry piece.

There was a guy a couple of years ago who carried a 1911. He got in an altercation, a room of lawyers getting shaken down by an armed robber.

The click of the safety being turned off got the robbers attention, and proceeded to hit him with 5 out of 6 shots. One of the shots hit his hand, making holding the grip safety difficult to disengage.

Freak odds? Yeah. But it happens. I prefer whatever makes it easiest to just make it go bang.

 

[Merad]

In some dire situation, such as a thug brutally bashing your head against the ground, it may be difficult to pull your gun out without having a firm grasp on the grip. It's very possible for the trigger to get snagged on something while drawing. I'm not saying it's likely, but I do think it's more likely than someone who has practiced using a safety forgetting that it's on.

It's just as likely that you wouldn't be able to disengage a safety in that type of situation.

 

[hanoverphist]

No external safety, especially on a carry piece.

There was a guy a couple of years ago who carried a 1911. He got in an altercation, a room of lawyers getting shaken down by an armed robber.

The click of the safety being turned off got the robbers attention, and proceeded to hit him with 5 out of 6 shots. One of the shots hit his hand, making holding the grip safety difficult to disengage.

Freak odds? Yeah. But it happens. I prefer whatever makes it easiest to just make it go bang.

how loud does that safety have to be? mine is whisper silent.

did the guy die from the other 4 shots? just curious, since in my experience, gangstas with gaks rarely hit 5 out of 6 shots fired. most ive come across have not put in the range time to even get to know their firearm, let alone be that accurate.

 

[hanoverphist]

It's just as likely that you wouldn't be able to disengage a safety in that type of situation.

not every situation is a gun situation. if someone surprised you and got you to the ground, you should be focusing on hand-to-hand instead of trying to pull a weapon. grapple his ass off you before he has a chance to get your face to the concrete and beat some ass. hopefully. 99% of the time a firearm is a ranged weapon, and shouldnt be the first go-to in a face-to-face altercation.

 

[shortylickens]

yeah thats why if yur walkin thru a dark parking lot or whatever, you should have your hand on the gun ready to go. You waste time digging for it you may already be screwed.

 

[Mutilator]

Would you buy the version with or without the thumb safety? The DAO trigger is like a glock so by default they didn't make safeties (trigger has to be fully pressed all the way to fire). I imagine a thumb safety would just get in the way. However if I get one with a thumb safety it's relatively simple to remove.

I would strongly recommend you DO NOT do that. If you ever had to shoot someone with that gun I have a feeling the legal team would have a field day ripping you a new one for removing a safety device from your weapon and make you look like some blood thirsty gun toting maniac. Remember every time you shoot someone, even if it's in self defense, there will be a lawsuit. It's just a matter of is it criminal, civil, or both.

IE if you don't want the safety, buy the one without the safety.