YaGunT: .380 vs .38special for ccw

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schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,769
52
91
He could probably do it...mere mortals, and you especially, not so much

Whatevs brah. Most people never practice beyond 10 yards, and most people never practice double action. That means most people can't shoot a handgun if you take away their easymode single action pistol.

I've been shooting handguns regularly for only two years and I'm a better shot than everyone at the range I go to. The average person is not even close to competent with a handgun.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
126
Whatevs brah. Most people never practice beyond 10 yards, and most people never practice double action. That means most people can't shoot a handgun if you take away their easymode single action pistol.

I've been shooting handguns regularly for only two years and I'm a better shot than everyone at the range I go to. The average person is not even close to competent with a handgun.

Which is precisely why I posted what I did.

I've owned a couple snub nose .38s. Shooting them, especially the air-weight Smith, is just punishing and yes, a longer barrel helps with both accuracy, faster target acquisition and absorbing recoil.

Tell you what, I'll take you up on a shooting competition. I'll bring my Model 629 w/8" barrel and you can bring your snub nose .38 and we'll see who has the tighter group at 25 yards... let alone under the duress of an armed attack. And I do shoot that double action.
 

schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,769
52
91
Which is precisely why I posted what I did.

I've owned a couple snub nose .38s. Shooting them, especially the air-weight Smith, is just punishing and yes, a longer barrel helps with both accuracy, faster target acquisition and absorbing recoil.

Tell you what, I'll take you up on a shooting competition. I'll bring my Model 629 w/8" barrel and you can bring your snub nose .38 and we'll see who has the tighter group at 25 yards... let alone under the duress of an armed attack. And I do shoot that double action.

The secret to shooting snubnoses well is to use target velocity full wadcutters. They recoil quite a bit less than full power ammo, and even work as a defensive load since they penetrate well and make a full caliber hole.
 

corwin

Diamond Member
Jan 13, 2006
8,644
9
81
The secret to shooting snubnoses well is to use target velocity full wadcutters. They recoil quite a bit less than full power ammo, and even work as a defensive load since they penetrate well and make a full caliber hole.

And I'd still put money on you not pulling off a 5" group at 25 yards, even shooting single action
 

phucheneh

Diamond Member
Jun 30, 2012
7,306
5
0
A good ol' .38 Colt with a long barrel is stupid-accurate and easy to handle, even with the cowboy grip.

'Accurate' meaning, of course, the gun is more accurate than anyone (unless we have professional fucking comp shooters here) on this forum is going to be able to utilize. 5" at 25 yards? Bullshit; I don't think someone who claims that knows what 25 yards is like with a handgun. I'm sure some of you guys could do it, but you'd need very good sights.

I'm trying to think of how much a typical front sight post would cover at 25 yards. Probably a solid square foot of target.

edit: oh, but schneider's comment is LOL-worthy. I was replying to the talk about general 'revolver vs pistol.' Snubnose getting ANY group at 25 yards? LOL. Pretty sure you're not doing that with a benchrest and a boresight, even. It's been a while since I've read much on barrel length, but I think the minimum needed to get some kind of consistency is maybe 3" or so, with a point of diminishing returns for pistol shooting at some point soon after that.

2" barrel? Plus average revolver sights? LOL again.
 
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Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
I mostly used a S&W Police Chief Special (.38 special).

It's a 5 shot revolver. If you're shooting at a distance in excess of 10' you will likely have trouble with police/courts trying to claim self defense. If 5 rounds won't do it, a couple of extra ain't likely to help.

I don't have any real problem with auto's. If it jams I can clear and fire a shot in a single move. For people who can't do that I'd suggest they stick with a revolver. What with Murphy's Law and all.

Fern
 

schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,769
52
91
'Accurate' meaning, of course, the gun is more accurate than anyone (unless we have professional fucking comp shooters here) on this forum is going to be able to utilize. 5" at 25 yards? Bullshit; I don't think someone who claims that knows what 25 yards is like with a handgun. I'm sure some of you guys could do it, but you'd need very good sights.

5" at 25 yards isn't even that good for a full size handgun. I can shoot 2" groups at 25 yards with a 4" K-frame .22 or .38, or my S&W M41. The front sight on a 4" S&W revolver covers about 6" at 25 yards.

I could post pictures of groups I've shot but it doesn't sound like you guys would believe me anyway.
 
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Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
I mostly used a S&W Police Chief Special (.38 special).

It's a 5 shot revolver. If you're shooting at a distance in excess of 10' you will likely have trouble with police/courts trying to claim self defense. If 5 rounds won't do it, a couple of extra ain't likely to help.

I don't have any real problem with auto's. If it jams I can clear and fire a shot in a single move. For people who can't do that I'd suggest they stick with a revolver. What with Murphy's Law and all.

Fern

15 yards is about the distance from my dinning room table to the front door. There's another 5 yards to the back door. I could see 7 yards being a reasonable distance to practice at with 10-15 yards being where you should be comfortable at least getting minute of man accuracy.

I can see the benefits of a revolver, but under stress I'd rather carry at least a semi auto 9mm and a spare magazine. Hit %s in stressful situations go in the toilet immediately.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
126
My snubnose is double action only


I had one of those once many years ago. It had a black anodized finish though. Those sights are fucking worthless... hell, that entire gun is fucking worthless. So is the Beretta Tomcat I own today.

Actually, the Tomcat is even worse...
 
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schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,769
52
91
I had one of those once many years ago. It had a black anodized finish though. Those sights are fucking worthless... hell, that entire gun is fucking worthless. So is the Beretta Tomcat I own today.

Jules pls. It's an excellent concealed carry gun.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
15 yards is about the distance from my dinning room table to the front door. There's another 5 yards to the back door. I could see 7 yards being a reasonable distance to practice at with 10-15 yards being where you should be comfortable at least getting minute of man accuracy.

I can see the benefits of a revolver, but under stress I'd rather carry at least a semi auto 9mm and a spare magazine. Hit %s in stressful situations go in the toilet immediately.

Sounds good.

But for me if the situation occurs in my home they're unlikely to be facing my CC gun. I've also got a couple of Colt .357 mag's readily handy.

Fern
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
I had one of those once many years ago. It had a black anodized finish though. Those sights are fucking worthless... hell, that entire gun is fucking worthless. So is the Beretta Tomcat I own today.

Actually, the Tomcat is even worse...

I've got a Bobcat that I've used as my carry

Just put the little F'er in my front pocket.

Fern
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
126
I've got a Bobcat that I've used as my carry

Just put the little F'er in my front pocket.

Fern

You ever shoot it? My Tomcat is brutal to shoot. 32ACP is surprisingly punishing when shot out of that tiny package. My trigger finger and the web of my hand was bleeding after about 20 rounds. I don't think I ever shot it after the first time I took it to the range. If you have medium to large size hands it is not a fun gun to shoot. Probably not much fun to shoot if you have small hands either.

The recoil spring is very strong and the slide has a tendency to scrape the web of your hand. The trigger is very heavy too and thin and sharp so when the gun flips up (and it will because it is hard to hold onto having such a small grip) it bites into your finger.

It is small and lightweight, I'll give it that. I used to toss it in my pocket when I'd take the dog for a walk after dark. I don't bother though any more. I think I'd rather get mugged than deal with the repercussions of using a gun for self defense in this state.

 
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Phanuel

Platinum Member
Apr 25, 2008
2,304
2
0
Sounds good.

But for me if the situation occurs in my home they're unlikely to be facing my CC gun. I've also got a couple of Colt .357 mag's readily handy.

Fern

Thinking about it more. What situations do you see yourself employing your CC pistol in?

If it's a mugging, sure, that works.

But if you're in an active shooter situation like a lunatic shooting people in a public area are you falling into the 1) get out of there and let the police clean it up or 2) try and stop them?

If I had the stones to attempt number 2, I'd definitely want something I knew I was comfortable with at a little distance. But this is a big moral/legal minefield.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Personally, I'd go with a revolver. The reliability is there (even if modern automatics don't jam nearly as much as people would like to believe, at least in my experience) and you are ready. Especially if you're focusing on personal defense. You don't specify a particular revolver, but some can be very small and light. I know someone with a titanium .38 snub nose and it weighs so little, you can barely notice it. I think the sum of the 6 rounds weighs more than the gun itself; it's that light.

Yep I had a S&W Airweight revolver made of Scandium and Titanium. Fit right in the pocket and it could shoot full .357mag rounds if you wanted. Load it up with some .38spl JHP and you're well armed for sure.

The ease of use is there as well. Point and pull the trigger and the trigger is stiff so it would be hard to accidentally pull.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,371
14
61
Thinking about it more. What situations do you see yourself employing your CC pistol in?

If it's a mugging, sure, that works.

But if you're in an active shooter situation like a lunatic shooting people in a public area are you falling into the 1) get out of there and let the police clean it up or 2) try and stop them?

If I had the stones to attempt number 2, I'd definitely want something I knew I was comfortable with at a little distance. But this is a big moral/legal minefield.

Not for me. If I can stop them, I will.

I'm a decent shot and I make sure I know my gun. I know that I can hit someone at 25 yards no problem. I know I can hit center mass every time at 15 yards. I know I can hit a 6" group at 7 yards.

I just got some zombie hostage targets to really dial things in. I'm finding that a 24" target is just too much area to shoot at. I want to get to 6" groups at 15 yards at full speed.
 

sixone

Lifer
May 3, 2004
25,162
4
61
Not for me. If I can stop them, I will.

I'm a decent shot and I make sure I know my gun. I know that I can hit someone at 25 yards no problem. I know I can hit center mass every time at 15 yards. I know I can hit a 6" group at 7 yards.

I just got some zombie hostage targets to really dial things in. I'm finding that a 24" target is just too much area to shoot at. I want to get to 6" groups at 15 yards at full speed.

That's what shooting practice is for. If you don't KNOW that what you can hit, put the gun back in your pocket before you hurt someone.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
That's what shooting practice is for. If you don't KNOW that what you can hit, put the gun back in your pocket before you hurt someone.

I know what I can hit, but I don't know what that bullet will do once it hits. Will it expand or not? If it doesn't for whatever reason, will it hit someone else? Unknowns scare me more than anything.
 
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