YASECT: cop shoots at minivan full of kids

[TurtleCrusher]

What about politics and NEWS do you not understand?

 

[SandEagle]

You're an idiot if you think the other Officer had no idea what was going on. There are these things called radios, and laptops in police cars.

Oh wait, you're an idiot already. Keep trolling with your pathetic agenda.

ok, so lets say he was relayed the information by "radio" or "laptop" in "police cars". that means he knew there were unarmed children in the minivan yet he continued to fire away?
what agenda are you trying to hide, Agent Ackmed?

 

[SandEagle]

Actually in Michigan if I had a fear for my life, the life of others, the threat of great bodily harm that could cause death or rape I do have the right. In this case the people already assaulted the cop and now have a deadly weapon (the van. Legally it would more than likely fly. As a citizen I have the right to defend myself with whatever force is necessary to stop that threat.

Thanks for those links. The police really don't have a duty to protect us? Then WTF are they there for?

fyi, i mentioned this two years ago. nobody listens to me.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=32076031&postcount=55

 

[rudeguy]

I think they should get put under a microscope. Anyone entrusted with that level of power should be scrutinized in cases where force was used; I sure don't want police being able to use force with little repercussions or consequences. I understand that it could make some hesitate to employ force but you have to draw the line of balance somewhere (between allowing officers some leeway and understanding under stressful situations and ensuring they do not abuse their power and position).

For sure and this is exactly why I could not be a cop. The first cop had exactly .3 seconds to decide to use force or not. We can only guess at what he was thinking but he decided not to. The other cop came in after hearing the first cop got assaulted and saw the suspects get into the van and try to drive away. His instinct was to try to stop them at all costs.

Do I think it could have been handled differently? Sure! There are 1000 ways it could have been handled. Do I think the second cop did anything wrong? Nope. I actually think the first cop should get some additional training for not putting a stop to the situation sooner.

I just hate scum like this who make it difficult for the rest of us. Its people like this that make it so a cop greets you with his hand on his gun instead of with a smile. Fuck these people.

 

[rudeguy]

fyi, i mentioned this two years ago.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=32076031&postcount=55

Yea but you also said Katie Holmes is hot so I stopped listening to you.

 

[Newbian]

The lady is issued a ticket and she decided to leave. Thats not enough to shoot her. Just mail the ticket. She doesn't need to stand her and sign the citation. If that is not sufficient for the officer then how about a pursuit? Shooting is overkill

The thing is he did chase after her once and after she pulled over the 2nd time they, the mom and kid, proceeded to assault the officer so it's a lot more then just a ticket offense there.

 

[Howard]

I'm going to bet a significant sum of money that the occupants were not East Asian.

 

[classy]

This is a little tough. Because you don't hear the entire argument. Now she should have kept her mouth shut, but that seemed to be a little to much. Now on one hand I can understand the cop shooting at the van, but on the other hand I think he should have maybe paused for a second to get some type of info, not like a officer was down. The kid, well he is 14, if he thinks his mom is in danger, his response was somewhat understandable. The only thing I don't get it is, why bust out the window where the kids were, why not subdue the driver of the vehicle? All that over a ticket is kinda like out there.

 

[classy]

I also don't believe chasing people over minor offenses like this when they become erratic like she did makes no sense. It endangers everyone. You know her address pick her up later or just mail the citation.

 

[BikeJunkie]

Then eat your hat.

So that's why he's being investigated? Because it's SOP? Riiiiight.

Also
WWYBYWB?

I love how I get asked this whenever I say something someone doesn't like ()

 

[smackababy]

So that's why he's being investigated? Because it's SOP? Riiiiight.



I love how I get asked this whenever I say something someone doesn't like ()

I am fairly certain it is SOP to investigate any time a cop fires their weapon in the line of duty.

 

[BikeJunkie]

Makes sense. Still I've never heard of shooting out a moving vehicle's tires as SOP. We'll find out soon enough :shrug:

 

[waggy]

Makes sense. Still I've never heard of shooting out a moving vehicle's tires as SOP. We'll find out soon enough :shrug:

me neither. Considering how badly cops shoot i am totally against them doing it too (i guess in rare cases sure).

for this? oh man that was idiotic.

I am fairly certain it is SOP to investigate any time a cop fires their weapon in the line of duty.

yeah i would think it would be.

 

[mizzou]

its obvious he tried to pop a tire. later u see the minivan with a flat?
anyway, discharging a firearm into a moving vehicle, tire or not, is not allowed anywhere i can think of.


oh and i love how the media fucking titles the video, assholes

 

[smackababy]

its obvious he tried to pop a tire. later u see the minivan with a flat?
anyway, discharging a firearm into a moving vehicle, tire or not, is not allowed anywhere i can think of.


oh and i love how the media fucking titles the video, assholes

Of course the media is going to spin this. "Cop breaks SOP to ensure safety of fellow officers and all motorists" isn't going to get 1/4th of the hits as "White cop fires at black family in minivan!"


And for everyone saying they were unarmed, how were the cops at the scene supposed to know that? They resisted arrest, attempted to assault an officer, and sped away to evade capture. The police did not search the vehicle, you can bet they assume there is a weapon in there. If you don't, you're going to get shot.

I agree, it wasn't the best move to fire at the tire, however, I feel they are fully justified in doing so. Police have to make incredibly quick decisions in incredibly high stress situations. The fact the first officer didn't shot, taze, or engage the 14 year old says a lot of just how composed he was.

And if you think firing at a van is bad, some of the training we had in the military concerning the safety of anything nuclear related will baffle you. We were told specifically if a suspect is attempting to steal nuclear weapons and is using a baby as a human shield to shoot through the baby.

 

[Hugo Drax]

JUSTIFIED.

Next.

 

[Skel]

anyone have a link to the unedited version of the dash cam? I can't help but feel there's more that happened. I don't agree with a cop attempting to shoot a tire out with a van full of kids. I shoot with a lot of cops at my range and I wouldn't trust them to shoot anywhere near me downrange they're that bad. More importantly, why didn't the backup block her van in? They park in front of it, and it would have stopped her from going anywhere.

 

[randay]

welcome back sandeagle!

 

[HumblePie]

Based on the "edited" video that we see, it's justified.

Cop pulls lady over for doing 71 in 55. Asks her to turn off vehicle while he walks back to his vehicle. Woman speeds off from that point. Cop chases her down and gets her pulled over again. Woman is going bat shit insane in yelling at the cop. Of course is cop is yelling at her, but giving her lawful orders especially in light of the fact she just fled from an officer moments ago. Cop asks woman to stand at the back side of the vehicle so she is in plain view while he goes back to his car. She instead rushes back into her vehicle forcing him to chase her. Then her teenage son exits the van to assault the officer. First officer brings out his taser to stop the boy and chases him around to side door. Boy locks the door as other police are arriving and witnessed the scene of the first officer being attacked and then chasing the boy back into the van. First officer tries to break window in to get at the family inside. Van starts to speed off as a third officer appears at the scene. Third officer is unaware of the occupants in the van, only that they assaulted a fellow officer and are now speeding off to resist arrest.

Cops can use up to deadly force in that instant. You DO NOT FLEE FROM OFFICERS AFTER PERFORMING A CRIME. Third officer fires, but it is clear he is shooting out the tires as the van flees. The video shows a tire was hit while being shot and later when the police catch up to the van the back left tire is flat.

All I can say from the editted video is that the shooting by the third officer at the van was indeed justified. I cannot believe that anyone could at all defend that woman. She is a complete idiot. And she basically used her younger children as a human shield. No different than a criminal taking a child as a hostage. She and her teenage son need to be behind bars for their actions for a very long time.

 

[BUTCH1]

uh...even fleeing from a cop isnt a death penalty punishable crime in america

on the news i think they said the woman is being charged with something like child endangerment because the cops fired at the car...amazing, america is a truly screwed up place

As much as I hate Cops on a power trip I equally hate belligerent assholes that think that they are above getting something as simple as a speeding ticket, if your caught speeding STFU and take your ticket, fight it in court if you wish but driving away then assaulting a cop over a speeding ticket?, fuck it, shoot 'em..

 

[BikeJunkie]

As much as I hate Cops on a power trip I equally hate belligerent assholes that think that they are above getting something as simple as a speeding ticket, if your caught speeding STFU and take your ticket, fight it in court if you wish but driving away then assaulting a cop over a speeding ticket?, fuck it, shoot 'em..

She had drug paraphernalia in her car which is why she freaked out. Not that I'm excusing her behavior AT ALL. Just getting the info out there.

 

[T_Yamamoto]

classic sandeagle

 

[smackababy]

She had drug paraphernalia in her car which is why she freaked out. Not that I'm excusing her behavior AT ALL. Just getting the info out there.

Which, had she just taken the ticket politely, would have been found. I have never been pulled over (for the whopping 3 times it has happened in my life) had my vehicle searched. But, I also am polite, turn off my car, have both my hands near the window with my information ready. I've gotten 1 ticket.

The idea that all cops are bad guys and bullies on a powertrip is so stupid. A few bad apples ruins the bunch. The trick to not having to worry about that is to not break the law. Easy, right?

 

[Midwayman]

Bad shoot IMHO. There was no immediate danger to anyones life when they fled. They should have just pursued and put the vehicle to a hard stop. If he had shot while being assaulted by the kids and mother I would have less of a problem with it.

 

[DrunkenSano]

its obvious he tried to pop a tire. later u see the minivan with a flat?
anyway, discharging a firearm into a moving vehicle, tire or not, is not allowed anywhere i can think of.


oh and i love how the media fucking titles the video, assholes

I've seen those police chase shows that does show police shooting out tires to get vehicles to stop. Even from a moving cop car.

And it is no longer a simple ticket once you assault the office and flee from the scene in a vehicle. The vehicle can also be considered a deadly weapon once you flee the scene and begin running from cops.