YATT: Pete visits a no-tip restaurant

[pete6032]

Last weekend I visited my first no-tip-required restaurant. It was a brewpub/pizza joint. The food/drink prices on the menu were just for food/drink, and the bottom of the menu said that a 21% "fair wage and wellness surcharge" would be added to my bill. The note also said that the surcharge helped provide fair wages across the company and access to benefits like health care for all restaurant employees. The service was excellent (perhaps because their employees are paid more and get benefits), and I generally tip 20% anyway, so the 21% charge was not a big deal. I was surprised that a 21% charge was enough to provide health insurance and other benefits for employees. This made me think that most people must be leaving much less than 20% on their bill, otherwise at least the waiters could purchase health insurance on the individual market. At the end of the meal when I paid, there was a spot for an extra tip when I signed the credit card receipt, but the receipt said no tip required. All in all it was a good experience.

 

[purbeast0]

"I went to a no-tip restaurant that had a mandatory 21% service charge and a tip line on the receipt"

Okay ... whatever floats your boat.

 

[nakedfrog]

It sounds more like a "mandatory tip" restaurant, IMO...

 

[Iron Woode]

LOL

mandatory gratuity is not a no tip restaurant.

If the place is so worried about "fair wage and wellness" then maybe they should pay them a higher wage then rather than having the customer pay it?

EDIT: yes, I know the customer pays for it no matter what.

 

[snoopy7548]

Sounds dumb. There's no such thing as a "no-tip" restaurant in America.

When I was in Australia it was nice not being required to tip, and being left alone to eat in peace. The servers would pretty much just ask for your drink order, come back with the drinks and ask for your food order, then not bother you again unless you either flagged them down or went to the register to pay. I wish we could adopt that system; I don't need someone coming back to ask how my food is ten seconds after they put it on the table.

 

[BoomerD]

So...this wasn't a "no tip restaurant," it was a "mandatory tip no matter how bad the service might be" restaurant.

21% is ridiculous. 15% is the starting point for us. If service is above the norm...we tip more, if service is poor, we tip less...and if service sucks, we don't tip at all.
The nation should eliminate the sub-minimum wage for tipped employees so that, instead of using their tips to make um the difference between $2.13 and whatever the state/federal minimum wage...they actually get that minimum wage (or more) PLUS their tips.

 

[nakedfrog]

So...this wasn't a "no tip restaurant," it was a "mandatory tip no matter how bad the service might be" restaurant.

21% is ridiculous. 15% is the starting point for us. If service is above the norm...we tip more, if service is poor, we tip less...and if service sucks, we don't tip at all.
The nation should eliminate the sub-minimum wage for tipped employees so that, instead of using their tips to make um the difference between $2.13 and whatever the state/federal minimum wage...they actually get that minimum wage (or more) PLUS their tips.

It seems like probably ten or fifteen years ago people started pushing to make 18% be considered the "standard". I'm still with you on 15% as the starting point.

 

[Midwayman]

Honestly if you're going to run that sort of place you need to make it clear employees are not allowed to accept tips. I don't mind the service charge, but I'd rather they just roll it into the price. I get the sticker shock issue though.

 

[ElFenix]

There's no such thing as a "no-tip" restaurant in America.

lies. i don't tip at whataburger.

 

[FeuerFrei]

As long as this isn't driven by some false notion that every job should pay a "living wage" ... or the greedy notion that tips should be increased to 20% ... I don't technically have a problem with baking service cost into the price structure.

I only hope that they actively discourage/punish anyone daring to tip there - otherwise the "no tip" label is a sham devised to draw foot traffic.

 

[Sgt. York]

Do you know that the 21% is really going to the employees, or is the owner skimming off the top?

 

[Craig234]

Sounds dumb. There's no such thing as a "no-tip" restaurant in America.

Pretty much every fast food restaurant I go to, and others to-go.

 

[OccamsToothbrush]

"I went to a no-tip restaurant that had a mandatory 21% service charge and a tip line on the receipt"

Okay ... whatever floats your boat.

That. There's a big difference between "no-tip" and "mandatory tip".

 

[Craig234]

As long as this isn't driven by some false notion that every job should pay a "living wage"

Or any false notion that customers shouldn't rape employees or false notion that people shouldn't be killed for lack of healthcare in the US.

 

[pmv]

Is there really a difference between 'no tip' and 'mandatory tip'? Seems to me they are effectively the same thing. Unless there's also a suggestion of a further 'optional tip' (as the OP mentions). Having that extra-bonus tip suggested seems to undo the whole thing and put you back where you started.

But a mandatory tip is just a % price-hike (combined with a commitment to pay staff at least somewhat higher than minium wage, with a bonus based on turnover).

I don't think that is the same thing as a 'tip' at all. Once you make it mandatory it's no longer a 'tip' in any meaningful sense. Certainly if you take the next step and just don't mention it or list it separately on the bill (just increase prices of each item).

 

[Dr. Detroit]

The nation should eliminate the sub-minimum wage for tipped employees so that, instead of using their tips to make um the difference between $2.13 and whatever the state/federal minimum wage...they actually get that minimum wage (or more) PLUS their tips.

Minimum wage is $15 here due to high cost of living and In N Out starts its employees at $18.50 I believe. Because of the higher minimum wage everything has gone up in price. Everything.

I just dont see myself tipping like I used to and those blasted fast casual IPad tipping screens they thrust in front of you with pre-populated tips starting at 20%. Fuck off!

I'm over tipping.

 

[pete6032]

Do you know that the 21% is really going to the employees, or is the owner skimming off the top?

No, it did not say, but I'm guessing the ownership would have trouble getting employees to work there if they just skimmed the 21% off. That would leave the waiters and staff with no "tip" at all.

 

[clamum]

Sounds dumb. There's no such thing as a "no-tip" restaurant in America.

When I was in Australia it was nice not being required to tip, and being left alone to eat in peace. The servers would pretty much just ask for your drink order, come back with the drinks and ask for your food order, then not bother you again unless you either flagged them down or went to the register to pay. I wish we could adopt that system; I don't need someone coming back to ask how my food is ten seconds after they put it on the table.

Haha yeah that's kinda dumb when they come back and ask how things are when you've barely even started eating yet. Sometimes, depending on what I get, I'm still "fixin" my food and haven't taken a bite and they'll ask me. How about come back in 3-5 minutes so people have a chance to taste things first? If they need you sooner they'll flag you down. Whatevs

I wish restaurants would pay their employees more and just get rid of tipping. Get rid of tipping in ALL careers/positions. When I'm king I'll make it happen.

 

[Chromagnus]

Is there really a difference between 'no tip' and 'mandatory tip'? Seems to me they are effectively the same thing. Unless there's also a suggestion of a further 'optional tip' (as the OP mentions). Having that extra-bonus tip suggested seems to undo the whole thing and put you back where you started.

But a mandatory tip is just a % price-hike (combined with a commitment to pay staff at least somewhat higher than minium wage, with a bonus based on turnover).

I don't think that is the same thing as a 'tip' at all. Once you make it mandatory it's no longer a 'tip' in any meaningful sense. Certainly if you take the next step and just don't mention it or list it separately on the bill (just increase prices of each item).

For me the difference would be how the price is listed on the menu. A "mandatory tip" place would list an item on the menu at $10 and then say there is a 21% service fee, like this place did, and a no tip place would bake it into the item price and just say that the item is $12.10. At the end of the day you are still paying the same price and it's just a matter of semantics.

Theoretically with the mandatory tip they are being upfront with that money going to the server as opposed to just saying the price is $12.10 and you don't know what goes to the server.

 

[nakedfrog]

Haha yeah that's kinda dumb when they come back and ask how things are when you've barely even started eating yet. Sometimes, depending on what I get, I'm still "fixin" my food and haven't taken a bite and they'll ask me. How about come back in 3-5 minutes so people have a chance to taste things first? If they need you sooner they'll flag you down. Whatevs

I wish restaurants would pay their employees more and just get rid of tipping. Get rid of tipping in ALL careers/positions. When I'm king I'll make it happen.

There have definitely been multiple times where we said "we don't know yet" when they stopped by that early to ask how everything is.
Need to switch to the Japanese system where you have a button at your table to push when you need the waitstaff.

 

[Midwayman]

For me the difference would be how the price is listed on the menu. A "mandatory tip" place would list an item on the menu at $10 and then say there is a 21% service fee, like this place did, and a no tip place would bake it into the item price and just say that the item is $12.10. At the end of the day you are still paying the same price and it's just a matter of semantics.

Theoretically with the mandatory tip they are being upfront with that money going to the server as opposed to just saying the price is $12.10 and you don't know what goes to the server.

For the customer, sure. I know there are some legal ramifications on how money is pooled, etc depending on tip vs service charge vs salary.

Ideally its not the customer's worry about how or if an employee is getting paid though.

 

[Chromagnus]

For the customer, sure. I know there are some legal ramifications on how money is pooled, etc depending on tip vs service charge vs salary.

Ideally its not the customer's worry about how or if an employee is getting paid though.

Yes, ideally we would live in a society where the customer doesn't need to be concerned if the employees are being treated fairly but unfortunately that is not the world we live in. A company saying that they provide their employees with healthcare and decent wages is a good marketing tool. Some people don't care but some do.

 

[purbeast0]

Is there really a difference between 'no tip' and 'mandatory tip'? Seems to me they are effectively the same thing. Unless there's also a suggestion of a further 'optional tip' (as the OP mentions). Having that extra-bonus tip suggested seems to undo the whole thing and put you back where you started.

But a mandatory tip is just a % price-hike (combined with a commitment to pay staff at least somewhat higher than minium wage, with a bonus based on turnover).

I don't think that is the same thing as a 'tip' at all. Once you make it mandatory it's no longer a 'tip' in any meaningful sense. Certainly if you take the next step and just don't mention it or list it separately on the bill (just increase prices of each item).

So when you go to a restaurant and see the writing "a 18% gratuity is added automatically for parties of 6 or more" yet when you eat there with just 1 other person, it's not automatically added, you consider that restaurant a no-tip restaurant when visiting with 6 or more people, and a tip restaurant with 5 or less?

 

[zinfamous]

"I went to a no-tip restaurant that had a mandatory 21% service charge and a tip line on the receipt"

Okay ... whatever floats your boat.

it sounds a bit like the "table charge" you get at restaurants in Europe, that famously don't tip....but then again, those are usually ~5-10% IIRC.

 

[pmv]

So when you go to a restaurant and see the writing "a 18% gratuity is added automatically for parties of 6 or more" yet when you eat there with just 1 other person, it's not automatically added, you consider that restaurant a no-tip restaurant when visiting with 6 or more people, and a tip restaurant with 5 or less?

This is getting awfully philosophical for a question about tips, but I think insofar as one has a choice as to how many people to go to the restaurant with, it's a tip restaurant, because the tip is in effect optional. I could be persuaded otherwise, but that's my first thought.