Ze First Debate

[eelw]

Lol why did it take this many days after the debate for the trolls crawl out from under the bridge?

 

[nickqt]

Lol why did it take this many days after the debate for the trolls crawl out from under the bridge?

Marching orders can take a bit to get sent out and acted upon.

 

[Shervan360]

Lol why did it take this many days after the debate for the trolls crawl out from under the bridge?

Forum moderators blocked me for no reason.

You simply cannot, yet again, comment on moderate actions in open forum. This is not your first or second or third time doing so. You have now accumulated enough points to trigger an automatic one month vacation. That may be extended. Additionally, going forward, you are banned from posting in P&N, as posting in this forum has been the root cause of causing you to recklessly throw away years of being a good contributor on the tech forums.

When you return, should you call us out again in open forum OR post anything here in defiance of your P&N ban, we will be forced to permaban you from ATF. I personally hope it doesn't come to that.

Perknose
Forum Moderator

 

[K1052]

That is standard procedure for one simple reason. It saves lives!

There are many more firefighter/EMTs units than EMS crews. Every department I am familiar with (and having been a volunteer firefighter for over 30 years, and have a grandson that is a Firefighter/Paramedic it's a few) the minimum requirement to be hired is firefighter certifications, and EMT certification (or higher).

Statistics clearly show that trained medical response sooner saves lives.

In my area, there are about 20+ EMS units staffed with Paramedics. At any time, many of those are busy taking care of patients or at the hospital transferring a patient to the hospital staff.

Conversely, there are probably 80–90+ firefighter/EMT crews that are within a closer distance to a person having a medical emergency, and can begin life-saving care minutes early.

But if you still view it as "the god damnedest thing" then tell the 911 dispatcher not to send the fire department when your loved one is having a heart attack, not breathing, or bleeding out...

It is a poor allocation of resources especially in an urban area. Which one of these things is more useful in my circumstances and cheaper to roll?

Basically I need two people in one of these:




Not five people in one of these:

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Hope? Change? NO. More of the same at home and abroad Until the laughing queen makes America the laughing stock of the world. Can America afford Kamala? Save America. Vote Trump 2024.


View attachment 107547

Who is not busy, I know this can be debunked

 

[Muse]

Denial of reality; copious copium.


Have you tried capsicum garden spray as a deterrent? Maybe fox urine/scent?

I suppose that's what I've been doing. I put maybe 1/4 cup of the dried hot pepper flakes I buy at Costco in a cup or two of water, bring to a simmer and sieve. Cool and put in spray bottle and spray the kabocha squashes in the yard. Once a squirrel tries to nibble one it decides they taste horrible and leave off attacking. This year it didn't work as well. I think I might have rat problems, not squirrel this year... maybe both. I am seeing tomato damage too that looks from rodents. Don't know if SQ or RAT.

 

[Muse]

Duplicate

 

[Moonbeam]

Forum moderators blocked me for no reason.

I was going to tell you what a f-ing lie that is, that it's just victim mentality when liars get called on lies, but the moderators told me I can't post this.

 

[Muse]

Hope? Change? NO.

Uh uh. Covid-19 did that. And your monster Republican has-been former president was responsible for 1/2 a million dead Americans from Covid-19. Sheesh.

 

[Moonbeam]

I suppose that's what I've been doing. I put maybe 1/4 cup of the dried hot pepper flakes I buy at Costco in a cup or two of water, bring to a simmer and sieve. Cool and put in spray bottle and spray the kabocha squashes in the yard. Once a squirrel tries to nibble one it decides they taste horrible and leave off attacking. This year it didn't work as well. I think I might have rat problems, not squirrel this year... maybe both. I am seeing tomato damage too that looks from rodents. Don't know if SQ or RAT.

Maybe one of your Berkeley illegals can give you some of their cat litter balls that will add clay to your soil and reek of pre dinner cat pee sufficient to keep mice and rats away. Or just leave cat food out for your local ferals. I got no more ground squirrels in my garden cause of that and I ain't seen no mice or rats.

 

[Muse]

Maybe one of your Berkeley illegals can give you some of their cat litter balls that will add clay to your soil and reek of pre dinner cat pee sufficient to keep mice and rats away. Or just leave cat food out for your local ferals. I got no more ground squirrels in my garden cause of that and I ain't seen no mice or rats.

There is a feral cat that's been trolling my property for a couple weeks or so. I saw it stalking a rat early on, but it got away and ducked under the house. A big problem is that the cat appears to be all but blind. It bumps into things. It's probably helping with the rodents anyway.

 

[manly]

That is standard procedure for one simple reason. It saves lives!

There are many more firefighter/EMTs units than EMS crews. Every department I am familiar with (and having been a volunteer firefighter for over 30 years, and have a grandson that is a Firefighter/Paramedic it's a few) the minimum requirement to be hired is firefighter certifications, and EMT certification (or higher).

Statistics clearly show that trained medical response sooner saves lives.

In my area, there are about 20+ EMS units staffed with Paramedics. At any time, many of those are busy taking care of patients or at the hospital transferring a patient to the hospital staff.

Conversely, there are probably 80–90+ firefighter/EMT crews that are within a closer distance to a person having a medical emergency, and can begin life-saving care minutes early.

But if you still view it as "the god damnedest thing" then tell the 911 dispatcher not to send the fire department when your loved one is having a heart attack, not breathing, or bleeding out...

Huh? @K1052 didn't say a FD crew isn't eminently capable of saving lives.
He implied it was economically inefficient to send 6 guys on a firefighting truck, if a 2-person ambulance crew could do the same job.

Your point about quantity of available personnel is a fair one, and if that's the main reason a FD crew is often sent out for a medical emergency, that's fine.

 

[Moonbeam]

That breaks my heart. I feed a girl cat at my back door and more recently a male at my front door. I chase off the male when he goes in the back to steal food and run off my female kitty. I can now pet the female and the male will now go up to my hands as I put food in his dish. I have two sisters out of a family of eight including Dad and Mom long disappeared that I brought inside that showed up because I was feeding a family of crows because a family member who had cats told me their chances outside weren't very good. One just showed up as I type this , putting her front paws on my leg. Her name is cloudy from the big patches of white on her gray and white coat.

 

[Brainonska511]

Huh? @K1052 didn't say a FD crew isn't eminently capable of saving lives.
He implied it was economically inefficient to send 6 guys on a firefighting truck, if a 2-person ambulance crew could do the same job.

Your point about quantity of available personnel is a fair one, and if that's the main reason a FD crew is often sent out for a medical emergency, that's fine.

The FD could also have smaller, rapid response vehicles, where they only need to send out 2 people, if an ambulance is a little further off. Cheaper than rolling a whole truck, and less wear and tear on local roads.

 

[jdubs03]

Who is not busy, I know this can be debunked

It can be. While there is no doubt prices have increased since mid-2021. The poster is not considering the actions performed previously that are themselves inflationary in nature.
-Quantitative easing for a decade.
-A highly regressive backend (for income earners) $2 trillion tax cut in a stable growth economy.
-Then COVID comes along and there were 3 separate stimulus payouts.

3 of those 5 inflationary actions were performed by the Trump administration. The last one by Biden. QE by the Fed.
Add into the situation of worldwide supply chain gridlock and disruption which happened as a result of Covid restrictions being removed as society started to get back to normal; and you have a recipe for high demand and low supply. That low supply takes time to get worked out and thus you have a period of pretty high sustained price pressure.
Edit: can add the federal reserve waiting a bit to raise interest rates too.

Also, the poster is failing to recognize is that the US has worked to get these prices down faster than pretty much any other highly developed economy. Along with having higher GDP growth than their OECD counterparts. That is a success story of the Biden administration.

Hindsight is 20/20 when it comes to what was happening during the throws of the pandemic. It’s quite rich to be on your soapbox and just blame Biden in a vacuum for inflation because it happened while he was President, It’s lazy thinking.
Unfortunately, that’s what a lot of these Independents and vast majority of Republicans think.

 

[Moonbeam]

The FD could also have smaller, rapid response vehicles, where they only need to send out 2 people, if an ambulance is a little further off. Cheaper than rolling a whole truck, and less wear and tear on local roads.

We could turn the world's military into health care workers and save on bombs.

 

[Moonbeam]

It can be. While there is no doubt prices have increased since mid-2021. The poster is not considering the actions performed previously that are themselves inflationary in nature.
-Quantitative easy for a decade.
-A highly regressive backend (for income earners) $2 trillion tax cut in a stable growth economy.
-Then COVID comes along and there were 3 separate stimulus payouts.

3 of those 5 inflationary actions were performed by the Trump administration. The last one by Biden.
Add into the situation of worldwide supply chain gridlock and disruption which happened as a result of Covid restrictions being removed as society started to get back to normal; and you have a recipe for high demand and low supply. That low supply takes time to get worked out and thus you have a period of pretty high sustained price pressure.

Also, the poster is failing to recognize is that the US has worked to get these prices down faster than pretty much any other highly developed economy. Along with having higher GDP growth than their OECD counterparts. That is a success story of the Biden administration.

Hindsight is 20/20 when it comes to what was happening during the throws of the pandemic. It’s quite rich to be on your soapbox and just blame Biden in a vacuum for inflation because it happened while he was President, It’s lazy thinking.
Unfortunately, that’s what a lot of these Independents and vast majority of Republicans think.

Low level thinking is characteristic of people for whom reasoning would result if damage to their sacred cow beliefs. Conservative quick draw thinking has become an obstacle to human welfare since the paleolithic.

 

[Dave_5k]

Hope? Change? NO. More of the same at home and abroad Until the laughing queen makes America the laughing stock of the world. Can America afford Kamala? Save America. Vote Trump 2024.

lol

- Actual Biden administration policy impacts on inflation: negligible. Almost all inflation was in first 12-18 months, where there had been little impact from Biden policy changes ~ but rather entirely carryover from COVID and the Trump administration.

- The one item that Biden signed that did likely increase inflation, the American Rescue Plan Act, probably added between 0.1 and 0.5% to total inflation depending on your model, but also sharply cut child poverty and accelerated job recovery from COVID, while putting more cash back to individuals (rather than the Trump-preferred variant of giving cash away to billionaires while similarly spiking inflation, the deficit and debt).

- And in any case, USA inflation vs. rest of world: far lower than average.

- Trump 2025 plans impacts on inflation: Multiple trillions of dollars with guaranteed 20% higher prices across large swaths of the economy with 20% to 100% increase on all imports which will explode inflationary pressures across the supply chain. Although the rebound from this and resulting trade wars, the Trump Greatest Depression Ever! would later drop prices...

 

[MtnMan]

It is a poor allocation of resources especially in an urban area. Which one of these things is more useful in my circumstances and cheaper to roll?

Basically I need two people in one of these:

View attachment 107550


Not five people in one of these:

View attachment 107551

Two people is fine, for routine medical issues. Many calls have the best outcome when there is more manpower, then throw in simple complications like stairs, obese patients. Furniture often needs to be moved, so roll a patient out of a backroom on a gurney.

The SUV, vs fire truck. An SUV equipped with all the emergency and medical equipment is going to be $100K - $150K and up, and needs to be replaced about every 5 years.
A firetruck is $500K and up, and will be replaced every 20 years (that code). The SUV does not negate the need for the fire truck, nor does it save it from being replaced in 20 years (remember that code), so $400K for 20 years of SUVs saves how much fuel in the bigger trucks?

Staffing, either have "first responder only staff, at the fire house" otherwise a firetruck is now out of service while they ride around in the SUV. Remember minutes matter when saving a life, and fighting a fire or other situation that would necessitate an engine company response, i.e. such as extrication from a wreck,

This is based on studies done by fire departments and determined the best expenditure of their limited $$$. The city I live in went through this probably 10 years ago when people that don't understand this reality created an outcry in the media about fire trucks responding to medical calls. It saves both lives and money.

The fire crews also remain local to their coverage area. The EMS crew may travel 15–20+ miles outside their coverage area, transporting a patient to the hospital.

 

[manly]

The FD could also have smaller, rapid response vehicles, where they only need to send out 2 people, if an ambulance is a little further off. Cheaper than rolling a whole truck, and less wear and tear on local roads.

Agreed, and left it out of my reply because it's a tangential topic. We hardly ever address our outlier national medical spending (we likely get the absolute worst value per $) because we just accept all the various inefficiencies (well, because GQP and "capitalism").

The exceptions would be the ACA, which appears to have bent the curve downward on Medicare spending; and it's a minor miracle we even got to the point where the Biden administration is negotiating prices on a handful of drugs. The scope of the problem is enormous, and kicking the can down the road will probably have disastrous consequences.

I doubt that sending out a firefighting truck shows up on any medical spending reports, but it's emblematic that as a nation, we get low value/$ compared to rest of the world.

 

[Brainonska511]

I doubt that sending out a firefighting truck shows up on any medical spending reports, but it's emblematic that as a nation, we get low value/$ compared to rest of the world.

Yes. It's just death by a thousand cuts.

 

[MtnMan]

Huh? @K1052 didn't say a FD crew isn't eminently capable of saving lives.
He implied it was economically inefficient to send 6 guys on a firefighting truck, if a 2-person ambulance crew could do the same job.

Your point about quantity of available personnel is a fair one, and if that's the main reason a FD crew is often sent out for a medical emergency, that's fine.

Did you miss the point that fire crews far out number EMS crews? Fires crews will be "available" (not on a call) to respond at a higher availability rate, and often miles closer to the patient.

A typical EMS crew, from arrival at patient, to the point they are back in service, in their coverage area, is about 2 hours, which includes drive to hospital, patient handoff at hospital, and cleaning the unit to put it back in service, then travel time back to their coverage area. That time can be much longer, if the hospital jammed up or understaffed, or just distance.

Fire crews stay in their service area, and can immediately respond to whatever comes next.

 

[MtnMan]

Hope? Change? NO. More of the same at home and abroad Until the laughing queen makes America the laughing stock of the world. Can America afford Kamala? Save America. Vote Trump 2024.


View attachment 107547

Step away from the orange kool-aid..

 

[Puffnstuff]

Ok, y'all might get a kick out of this.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1834585071875158502

Have you seen this one?

 

[MtnMan]

Forum moderators blocked me for no reason.

"no reason" that you agree with, or can even comprehend. I'm sure in your world, like your idol, you think it was "a beautiful post, the most biggestly beautiful post ever posted"