Zeitgeist the Movie

[chin311]

saw this movie the other day too, showed some friends, we were all SHOCKED really, i mean the 9/11 part and what not ive seen some before, but the part that really got to me was indeed PART 3.

and that does tie into the bible doesnt it? i mean the book of revelation anyway??

 

[Narmer]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Narmer
I saw this and was going to post a question regarding the plane that hit the Pentagon. How come there are no pictures or videos of it happening? In the documentary, it says the FBI confiscated all of them. WHy would they do that? Is it because there was no such incident?

Video of plane hitting Pentagon
Video of Plane hitting a concret wall at 500 MPH, there is NOTHING left of the plane.
Video of Pentagon crash from Hotel cam

That's the best they got? Granted I watched the second plane hit the WTC, but this is garbage video. I smell something fishy. That does not look like no plane to me. Looks like a setup.

:laugh: They (the middle eastern gentlemen - not CIA spooks) used planes for everything else but the Pentagon HAD to be a missile huh? Kooky...

I don't have the answers to everything but I can tell you that that does not look like a plane hitting the Pentagon. It looks like either a missile or just a bomb. Something isn't right.

 

[HombrePequeno]

Originally posted by: yobarman

Originally posted by: HombrePequeno

Originally posted by: yobarman

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
You gotta love conspiracy theories..

You gotta like throwing away 20% of your income to banks. You know the Federal Reserve is a private organization right?

It's an organization made up mostly of publicly traded banks that has oversight by the US government. Do you really want complete control of the money supply by the US government? Countries that allow a high degree of control of the money supply by the government tend to be plagued with inflation.

But go ahead, keep your money under your pillow to avoid the evil banks. That really is a great place for it.

I have no problem with banks really, but I do have a problem with a private organization printing our nation's money and making citizen's pay interest on it. Inflation is bad enough already, and the Fed is printing money just as fast as our gov't could. Why can't we just skip the middle man, that coincidently is accountable to no one?

?I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of our currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that will grow up around (the banks) will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.? - Thomas Jefferson

Money, Banking, and the Federal Reserve

Trust me, the government can print money a lot faster than the current rate. The Fed has kept inflation pretty stable for the last few decades. A low, stable rate of inflation is not a bad thing. I don't know why anyone would think it could be a bad thing. Dealing with a little bit of inflation is a hell of a lot better than what we had with the Gold Standard. We'd have long periods of deflation and some periods of inflation. Business cycles were horribly dependent on whether the gold supply increased or not.

Also, the Fed is accountable to Congress which puts its activities under review every so often.

I watched the movie a little bit ago. The first part was kind of interesting but I'm not sure I completely buy it. I skipped the second part because I've heard all that crap before. For the third part I can immediately point out the part about the income tax is flat out wrong. I've argued with several people on this forum about that and their arguments are always horribly flawed. The income tax is constitutional and the 16th Amendment was ratified properly.

The part about the Federal Reserve is pretty ridiculous. The Federal Reserve doesn't even get the profit it generates, it returns it's profits back to the Treasury Department. It doesn't really even make that much profit seeing as it only holds less than 10% of the government's debt. It makes no sense for the Federal Reserve to push for war when it gets nothing in return for it.

Here's a nice site that refutes most the conspiracy theories about the Federal Reserve.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Narmer
I saw this and was going to post a question regarding the plane that hit the Pentagon. How come there are no pictures or videos of it happening? In the documentary, it says the FBI confiscated all of them. WHy would they do that? Is it because there was no such incident?

Video of plane hitting Pentagon
Video of Plane hitting a concret wall at 500 MPH, there is NOTHING left of the plane.
Video of Pentagon crash from Hotel cam

That's the best they got? Granted I watched the second plane hit the WTC, but this is garbage video. I smell something fishy. That does not look like no plane to me. Looks like a setup.

:laugh: They (the middle eastern gentlemen - not CIA spooks) used planes for everything else but the Pentagon HAD to be a missile huh? Kooky...

I don't have the answers to everything but I can tell you that that does not look like a plane hitting the Pentagon. It looks like either a missile or just a bomb. Something isn't right.

I thought there were people who saw the plane hit the building. Or at least people who saw a low flying plane cross over the highway right before the big boom.

Anyone who believes all the BS about 9-11 is just a fool.

If our government can pull of a stunt like 9-11 then why can't they plant some WMD in Iraq and say "see look!" and use that to justify even more attacks against Iran and Syria etc.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Narmer
I saw this and was going to post a question regarding the plane that hit the Pentagon. How come there are no pictures or videos of it happening? In the documentary, it says the FBI confiscated all of them. WHy would they do that? Is it because there was no such incident?

Video of plane hitting Pentagon
Video of Plane hitting a concret wall at 500 MPH, there is NOTHING left of the plane.
Video of Pentagon crash from Hotel cam

That's the best they got? Granted I watched the second plane hit the WTC, but this is garbage video. I smell something fishy. That does not look like no plane to me. Looks like a setup.

:laugh: They (the middle eastern gentlemen - not CIA spooks) used planes for everything else but the Pentagon HAD to be a missile huh? Kooky...

I don't have the answers to everything but I can tell you that that does not look like a plane hitting the Pentagon. It looks like either a missile or just a bomb. Something isn't right.

I thought there were people who saw the plane hit the building. Or at least people who saw a low flying plane cross over the highway right before the big boom.

Anyone who believes all the BS about 9-11 is just a fool.

If our government can pull of a stunt like 9-11 then why can't they plant some WMD in Iraq and say "see look!" and use that to justify even more attacks against Iran and Syria etc.

Obviously Iran's nuclear program is all our propaganda too, you see, we have given ourselves reason to shed blood for profit!

By the way, where are the people on those planes the liberals say never existed?

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Obviously Iran's nuclear program is all our propaganda too, you see, we have given ourselves reason to shed blood for profit!

By the way, where are the people on those planes the liberals say never existed?

Wasn't there a news reporter on one plane talking to people from the network right before they crashed?

How about all the other people who claimed to have gotten phone calls from loved ones as well.
This was one hell of a conspiracy.

 

[noto12ious]

They can't explain why these squibs + explosions are moving upwards / diagonally.

Demolition sequence of the south tower



They also can't explain Mineta's testimony about Cheney and the Pentagon.

Uh Oh Cheney, you're in trouble!

Mineta reaffirms

 

[KAZANI]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
:laugh: They (the middle eastern gentlemen - not CIA spooks) used planes for everything else but the Pentagon HAD to be a missile huh? Kooky...

The pentagon required a precision strike. This was the part of the building recently reinforced against air strike (call it coincidence all you want). Tell me how could Hanjour fly an airliner at that speed, so close to the ground (I mean SO CLOSE) when he was barely able to fly a Cessna. He had ZERO flying experience with a Boeing 757!

pilotsfor911truth analysis:

So, who pulled off this stunt?

Hani Hanjour. Reported to have 600TT and a Commercial Certificate (see quotes right margin). Hani tried to get checked out in a 172 a few weeks prior at Freeway Airport in MD. Two seperate CFI's took Hani up to check him out. Baxter and Conner found that Hani had trouble controlling and landing a 172 at 65 knots. Bernard, the Chief CFI, refused to rent him the 172. I have instructed many years. I have soloed students in 172's when i had 300 hours as a CFI. How anyone could not control a 172 at 600TT and a Commercial is beyond me. Flight Schools keep going till you "get it" if you are a bit rusty, and then rent you the plane. They are in business to make money after all. .right? The Chief CFI basically refused any further lessons and basically told him to get lost. All this can be confirmed through google searches.

Later, a week after Sept 11. Bernard, the Chief CFI, made a statement saying, "although Hani was rejected to rent a 172, i have no doubt he could have hit the pentagon." What?? Bernard, who didnt even fly with Hani, doesnt know the maneuver involved, where the plane hit, the speeds, etc etc.. says he has no doubts that he could hit the pentagon? Sure, my grandma could hit the pentagon. How about looking into the maneuver before making that statement? He made that statement while the pentagon was still smoking for petes sake. A bit of monday morning quarterbacking if you ask me. A common theme among inexperienced pilots. This also can be verified via google searches.

So, to sum up. Hani Hanjour, took a 757, with zero time in type, did the maneuver described above, a 400 knot 330 degree sprialing dive at 2500 fpm, only gaining 30 knots, then 30 knots more descending from 2200 feet at full power, with a very steady hand as to not overshoot or hit the lawn, inside ground effect, at 460 knots impact speed, but was refused to rent a 172 cause he couldnt land it at 65 knots? C'mon... sounds like a bad B movie... Please see right margin for more testimony regarding Hani and his training.

Has it ever occured to you that you cling on derision only because you can't use facts as weapons?

 

[KAZANI]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
How about all the other people who claimed to have gotten phone calls from loved ones as well.

Mark Bingham called his mother and said "This is Mark Bingham. I love you". Who would use his last name to address his mother before dieing?

 

[vhx]

Only 2 pages? I'm disappointed in you ATOT.

I just watched this thing, pretty mind blowing, more importantly the 3rd part. I'll be damned if I'll sit around when the North American Union is agreed to and the constitution thrown out. And that chipped stuff and call with Rockafella is pretty fuckin disturbing, I'll say that.

As far as there being nothing in the law or consitution requiring a federal income tax. What exactly happens when you don't pay it other than messages that you owe money? Never did not do it.

EDIT: The only thing not mentioned is steps to prevent things like this. Waiting for 'America' to wake up won't work. Too much confusion with mass media. Unless of course you play this on TV. :]

 

[HombrePequeno]

Originally posted by: vhx
Only 2 pages? I'm disappointed in you ATOT.

I just watched this thing, pretty mind blowing, more importantly the 3rd part. I'll be damned if I'll sit around when the North American Union is agreed to and the constitution thrown out. And that chipped stuff and call with Rockafella is pretty fuckin disturbing, I'll say that.

As far as there being nothing in the law or consitution requiring a federal income tax. What exactly happens when you don't pay it other than messages that you owe money? Never did not do it.

EDIT: The only thing not mentioned is steps to prevent things like this. Waiting for 'America' to wake up won't work. Too much confusion with mass media. Unless of course you play this on TV. :]

The amero and the North American Union have never been seriously discussed in Congress. The movie is sensationalizing it.

What happens when you don't pay your income tax is you get fined and if you don't pay the fine you go to jail. That's because the 16th Amendment changed the laws so that an income tax can be spent however Congress wants. BTW the 16th Amendment was passed by an overwhelming majority of states. Some nutjobs think a few states didn't legally pass it because they didn't pass the same exact document as the others. The only changes in some of the amendment documents were spelling errors and things like that. It was passed perfectly legally.

 

[morkinva]

Originally posted by: HombrePequeno

Originally posted by: vhx
Only 2 pages? I'm disappointed in you ATOT.

I just watched this thing, pretty mind blowing, more importantly the 3rd part. I'll be damned if I'll sit around when the North American Union is agreed to and the constitution thrown out. And that chipped stuff and call with Rockafella is pretty fuckin disturbing, I'll say that.

As far as there being nothing in the law or consitution requiring a federal income tax. What exactly happens when you don't pay it other than messages that you owe money? Never did not do it.

EDIT: The only thing not mentioned is steps to prevent things like this. Waiting for 'America' to wake up won't work. Too much confusion with mass media. Unless of course you play this on TV. :]

The amero and the North American Union have never been seriously discussed in Congress. The movie is sensationalizing it.

What happens when you don't pay your income tax is you get fined and if you don't pay the fine you go to jail. That's because the 16th Amendment changed the laws so that an income tax can be spent however Congress wants. BTW the 16th Amendment was passed by an overwhelming majority of states. Some nutjobs think a few states didn't legally pass it because they didn't pass the same exact document as the others. The only changes in some of the amendment documents were spelling errors and things like that. It was passed perfectly legally.

What happens when you don't pay your income tax is a jury of your peers finds you not guilty
http://youtube.com/watch?v=l5Of8M1MZJQ

 

[shira]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Narmer
I saw this and was going to post a question regarding the plane that hit the Pentagon. How come there are no pictures or videos of it happening? In the documentary, it says the FBI confiscated all of them. WHy would they do that? Is it because there was no such incident?

Video of plane hitting Pentagon
Video of Plane hitting a concret wall at 500 MPH, there is NOTHING left of the plane.
Video of Pentagon crash from Hotel cam

That's the best they got? Granted I watched the second plane hit the WTC, but this is garbage video. I smell something fishy. That does not look like no plane to me. Looks like a setup.

:laugh: They (the middle eastern gentlemen - not CIA spooks) used planes for everything else but the Pentagon HAD to be a missile huh? Kooky...

I don't have the answers to everything but I can tell you that that does not look like a plane hitting the Pentagon. It looks like either a missile or just a bomb. Something isn't right.

At 500 mph, an airplane is going about 733 feet per second. For the security-gate video, the frame rate appears to be one frame/second. The distance from the point of collision to the right edge of the video frame appears to no more than 100 feet, so the chances of capturing the Boeing 757-223 (118 feet 5 inches in length) in the video are approximately (118.5 + 100)/733 or about 30%. Thus, it's not surprising that we see an empty frame followed by an explosion.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: shira
At 500 mph, an airplane is going about 733 feet per second. For the security-gate video, the frame rate appears to be one frame/second. The distance from the point of collision to the right edge of the video frame appears to no more than 100 feet, so the chances of capturing the Boeing 757-223 (118 feet 5 inches in length) in the video are approximately (118.5 + 100)/733 or about 30%. Thus, it's not surprising that we see an empty frame followed by an explosion.

Damn it dude you need to stop trying to use logic here.
This isn?t about logic, it?s about feelings and paranoia.

I have a question for the conspiracy people, why did they have one plane crash into a field? What was the point of that?

Anyone who believes this is all one big conspiracy should be declared ?legally stupid? and locked up to protect themselves.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: shira
At 500 mph, an airplane is going about 733 feet per second. For the security-gate video, the frame rate appears to be one frame/second. The distance from the point of collision to the right edge of the video frame appears to no more than 100 feet, so the chances of capturing the Boeing 757-223 (118 feet 5 inches in length) in the video are approximately (118.5 + 100)/733 or about 30%. Thus, it's not surprising that we see an empty frame followed by an explosion.

Damn it dude you need to stop trying to use logic here.
This isn?t about logic, it?s about feelings and paranoia.

I have a question for the conspiracy people, why did they have one plane crash into a field? What was the point of that?

Anyone who believes this is all one big conspiracy should be declared ?legally stupid? and locked up to protect themselves.

Here's a better question, why fly something OTHER than a plane into the pentagon and TELL people it was a plane? The WTC crashes were clearly planes, so obviously obtaining planes and crashing them into things wasn't a problem...so why would people behind a conspiracy not just use a plane on the Pentagon as well? I can see no advantage from their point of view in using a missile and then lying to everyone about it.

That's the real problem with conspiracy theories, they are so focused on a particular outcome that nobody seems to realize that they are NOT very good explanations for the actual events. In any situation, it's pretty easy to "explain" it all as some vast conspiracy theory, but it's a little harder when you have to explain why that's the best explanation.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: noto12ious
They can't explain why these squibs + explosions are moving upwards / diagonally.

Demolition sequence of the south tower



They also can't explain Mineta's testimony about Cheney and the Pentagon.

Uh Oh Cheney, you're in trouble!

Mineta reaffirms

That "Mineta reaffirms" video disturbs me. The time difference is substantial. Unless the Bushbot idiots are going to claim Bush's own transportation secretary is a lying 911 truther while Cheney is a truth telling angel (LOL), i think we need these questions raised and investigated.

 

[Worlocked]

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous than standing armies... If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of currency... The banks and corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of their property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."

Thomas Jefferson(1743-1826)


Sagely or what?

 

[aceofskies05]

Not trying to start a fight, but can some one show me written proof that states paying federal income tax as being a law? Im just curious

 

[NoStateofMind]

Originally posted by: aceofskies05
Not trying to start a fight, but can some one show me written proof that states paying federal income tax as being a law? Im just curious

Most will point to the 16th amendment of the Constitution as the "Law". But if you do some research there are some indications it was never lawfully ratified. Eh, what do I know?

 

[aceofskies05]

I hear that it was and i hear it wasnt, i just want too see some factual evidence

 

[HombrePequeno]

Originally posted by: PC Surgeon

Originally posted by: aceofskies05
Not trying to start a fight, but can some one show me written proof that states paying federal income tax as being a law? Im just curious

Most will point to the 16th amendment of the Constitution as the "Law". But if you do some research there are some indications it was never lawfully ratified. Eh, what do I know?

I don't know why this was dug up from the dead...

No, the 16th Amendment didn't allow income to be taxed; that was legal beforehand. The 16th Amendment dealt with apportionment. That's it. And yes it was legally ratified, the only contention which conspiracy theorists dwell on is that some copies that were ratified had typos in them so each state didn't technically pass the exact same document.

The passing of the IRS tax code specifically deals with how income is taxed.

 

[Sinsear]

Great, I see another tinfoil extravaganza was brought back from the dead.

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: Narmer
I saw this and was going to post a question regarding the plane that hit the Pentagon. How come there are no pictures or videos of it happening? In the documentary, it says the FBI confiscated all of them. WHy would they do that? Is it because there was no such incident?

I have a cousin in the USMC who was in the Pentagon at the time it was hit. It happened.

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: Sinsear
Great, I see another tinfoil extravaganza was brought back from the dead.

Anything that causes people to look at government as something that is extrinsic, rather than Intrinsic, is not necessarly a bad thing.