Question Zen 4 builders thread

[Markfw]

I know its early, but as someone pointed out, I better get my ram now before the scalpers are all over it.

To go with a 7950x, what do you think of this ram:

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr5-sdram/p/N82E16820374369?Item=N82E16820374369

(edited for my best recommendation, 12/5/2023)

 

[A///]

ASRock X670E Steel Legend.
Yes to chipset drivers. The wifi drivers were those from ASRock's website: ver:1.723.0.164 and ver:3.3.0.467. But I've disabled it in the BIOS.

It is just fair warning to potential buyers that this is a platform that currently doesn't support sleep with XMP enabled and also has 50 second post times. And somehow people find this to be fine. The board has great reviews. If you ask other owners they have that same problem. They just don't care? Somehow I'm the only person that finds this to be a bad experience... weird.

Hmm sorry gdansk. I must have missed your post earlier. I was wondering how you were running that wifi module on a x370 mobo. I built someone a system using an Asus x670E the week after launch but it didn't have those long boot times after training. 2 TB Firecuda 530 if that helps ya out. Training took a good bit. Afaik this is an asrock issue now. Button push to desktop was <20-25 seconds true cold boot.

 

[alexruiz]

ASRock X670E Steel Legend.
Yes to chipset drivers. The wifi drivers were those from ASRock's website: ver:1.723.0.164 and ver:3.3.0.467. But I've disabled it in the BIOS.

It is just fair warning to potential buyers that this is a platform that currently doesn't support sleep with XMP enabled and also has 50 second post times. And somehow people find this to be fine. The board has great reviews. If you ask other owners they have that same problem. They just don't care? Somehow I'm the only person that finds this to be a bad experience... weird.

Their Wifi and BT drivers seem to be a little behind, but that shouldn't be causing the sleep issue.
50 secs boot time? Wow! Gigabyte is at around 20-25 secs

I am assuming that you have at least EUFI 1.09 (AGESA ComboAM5 1.0.0.3A)
Maybe upgrading the UEFI to 1.11?
Maybe getting gigabyte's Wifi and BT drivers?

 

[gdansk]

If you have an issue you should contact AMD directly. Posting on some message board that has no relation to AMD won't help you out much. If you have an issue with the usage of the word smooth take it up senor ruiz many posts up.

I'm not trying to get help. It seems people are treating that way. But I catalogued my problems in response to a post about smooth launches. Hopefully it will cause some people to delay buying Zen 4. Or at least ASRock motherboards. By which time, hopefully, these issues aren't real anymore.

I find it astounding so few people use EXPO/XMP and sleep. Reviews don't even mention it. Ratings on Newegg/etc don't reflect it. That's a feature that just worked on every platform since XMP was introduced. Then return it? I don't want to buy Intel. But maybe other people are open to it and they should know of the problem. Oh and don't buy any AM5 motherboards expecting ECC to work like it does on certain AM4 boards. Asus still lists it in the specs but they'll remove it soon

50 secs boot time? Wow! Gigabyte is at around 20-25 secs

That still seems long for a POST time, especially egregious if it cannot wake from sleep instead of power on. But AM5 launch is in such a state that 25 seconds is fast and sleep is esoteric. Is that with 32GB of memory I wonder? XMP or EXPO?

I am assuming that you have at least EUFI 1.09 (AGESA ComboAM5 1.0.0.3A)

Already been on 1.11 since the 27th.
The wifi issue is that I don't use it but regardless its driver was indicated in the Windows memory dump. So, I disabled it and no more locking up in sleep.

And I know it doesn't sound like it but I'm something of an AMD CPU fan since Zen launched in 2017. I have in my home right now B450/1700X, B350/3600, X570/3700X, B550/5900X and X670E/7950X PCs. This has been the most problematic of them. Maybe it's all the board's fault but I've seen similar issues mentioned for many others.

 

[MarkPost]

I've not used sleep/hibernate function for years, so I've tried them (Tomahauk B650, 32GB EXPO ON).

-Hibernate mode works fine.
-Sleep works, but at a second try haha This is the sequence: power botton on --> doesnt boot --> power botton off --> power botton on --> boots and Windows loads from sleep mode.

About Wifi/bluetooth both works fine.

My complains with this platform are the long boot time and a general BIOS immaturity (but the last one is a common issue with whatever platform, AMD or Intel, at this early stage).

 

[eek2121]

Nope, I had to order from a limited selection at the time and I can't return by now I think. Though the RAM seems excellent so far as long as the BIOS support continues or is fixed. This is the kit:
Trident Z5 RGB DDR5-6000 CL32-38-38-96 1.40V 64GB (2x32GB) F5-6000J3238G32GX2-TZ5RS

FYI I am running F5-6000J3238G32GX2-TZ5K, which is the black version of that kit, at DDR5-6000 speeds. I chose DOCP I in the bios, FWIW. Testmem 5 and Prime95 memory stress showed no errors. I also haven’t had any issues with stability.

I am on 0809, which is the latest available on my Strix X670E-I.

EDIT: I bring this up because this kit does work. It is entirely likely that a new BIOS will fix things.



(That reminds me I need to change my UCLK back to 3000 lol!)

 

[CakeMonster]

I am on 0809, which is the latest available on my Strix X670E-I.

EDIT: I bring this up because this kit does work. It is entirely likely that a new BIOS will fix things.

Edit: That's great news, although it seems your board is on a different revision than mine, so I'll probably just wait for a new official version then. Yeah, I figure it will be sorted out in the end given the amount of people who won't buy specific EXPO kits.

 

[marth123]

Is anyone running 128GB DDR5 RAM yet? Given 4 DIMMS of 32GB in the 2 memory channels, speed goes down to 3600 MT/s officially with a miserable memory bandwidth of about 65Gb/s at high latency (i9-13900K is similar to the 7950X in that respect). Wonder if anyone can get higher stably.

Unfortunately considering the Mac Studio now with the M1 Ultra and 128GB DDR5 RAM which does run at full speed with 400GB/s memory bandwidth.

Alternatively AMD Threadrippers Pros with more memory channels are way overpriced and cost more than the Mac Studio ($2400 for just the 24 core 5965WX Threadripper chip!).

 

[igor_kavinski]

Unfortunately considering the Mac Studio now with the M1 Ultra and 128GB RAM which does run at full speed with 400GB/s memory bandwidth.

Alternatively AMD Threadrippers Pro’s are way overpriced and cost more than the Mac Studio

Mac Studio with 128GB RAM is more affordable than a Threadripper? When did this happen?

 

[marth123]

Mac Studio with 128GB RAM is more affordable than a Threadripper? When did this happen?

$2400 for just the 24 core 5965WX Threadripper CPU chip, and another $1000 for a compatible motherboard. Yeah….

Add 128GB DDR5 RAM on top of that…. a GPU comparable to the M1 Ultra… proper cooling for the Threadripper beast…

And that’s not even considering the electricity bill of running the Mac Studio versus the massive Threadripper build.

First time I’m considering Apple desktops for non-gaming workflows.

 

[igor_kavinski]

$2400 for just the 24 core 5965WX Threadripper CPU chip, and another $1000 for a compatible motherboard. Yeah….

AMD Ryzen Threadripper Pro 5995WX Review

This is the most expensive AMD Ryzen CPU you can buy, which as you might suspect is also the fastest and most powerful Ryzen CPU currently in...

www.techspot.com

8 channels of DDR4-3400.



Doesn't seem that expensive if you get it from Lenovo.

EDIT: Actually checking on the site, the 5995WX starts at $9519!

The world must be upside down, now that a 128GB RAM Apple Studio is the value option!

 

[marth123]

EDIT: Actually checking on the site, the 5995WX starts at $9519!

The world must be upside down, now that a 128GB RAM Apple Studio is the value option!

Yeah crazy isn't it? And with the Apple Studio you get a silent and portable workstation too at 1/4 the electricity.

 

[AdamK47]

58.9 ns is the new latency I get in AIDA64. Would use the beta version, but the $4 key I bought from G2A a couple years back doesn't work with it.

View attachment 68707

Over three weeks later and I have it tuned to this. Same speed at 6000 and same primary timings at 32-38-38.

 

[Asterox]

Yes that was what I was saying. Do you write for notebookcheck? I read their site religiously and saw an article about this in the early am. If this keeps up through the next 8 weeks of the holiday period then I don't see either zen 4 or raptor lake making great sales strides. The 13900K is will be getting a ks model but it is to be seen what zen 4 will get. Only the one model or all models getting a x3d version taking over the current msrps while the current parts drop down in msrp. Can amd afford such a move and if they can will it spell sales doom for intel. x3d won't help in all games and doesn't do much in non game work loads but it would make it more tantalizing to go with amd especially if the partner board prices drop. my 2c

AMD has a big fight against it when it comes to arrow lake and even @Geddagod would agree with me on that. Arrow gets lion cove big cores with crestmont small cores. Lunar uses the same core designs with added cores.Arrow allegedly uses TSMC3 with an 8+32 structure and will share node parity with AMD at the same foundry.

Arrow will come at a time when the recession is winding down and inflation will be back to normal. Prime period for consumer driven purchasing of new computers and hardware. Zen 5 may come 1-2 quarters earlier but will suffer from the tail end of the recession, but will have a lead over Intel. Great times to be a consumer.

No, what makes you think i write for them? I have nothing to do with them, and I officially have never written any articles for any website.

When the cheapest B650 motherboards arrive(130-150$), and especially the A620 motherboards, only then will sales of AM5 processors start significantly.CES 2023, after that there will be enough cheaper B650 and A620 motherboards.

Cheaper B650 motherboards, "hm let's say they arrived" as an example Gigabyte model for $160.Over time, the price of AM5 motherboards(especially cheaper models)will slowly fall.

https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=am5&N=100007625&Order=1

If you compare the same Gigabyte motherboard series, it is obvious that AM5 model cannot have the same significantly lower price vs old B450 or B550 AM4 series.Gigabyte B650M-DS3H, it is more then enough for any Ryzen 5 or Ryzen 7 CPU no doubt.Most people don't even need the fastest PCIE 4.0 SSD drives, or most people don't care if the motherboard doesn't have PCIE 5.0.

AM5 version

- two Display Port-s 1.4 and one HDMI 2.1

- much larger VRM heatsinks

- one rear USB Type-C port

- DDR5 memory specifications

AM4 version

- only one HDMI 2.0 or 2.1

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B650M-DS3H-rev-10#kf

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B550M-DS3H-rev-1x#kf

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B450M-DS3H-rev-1x#kf

I moved the answer to this Zen 4 topic.

 

[repoman0]

Spent a little time tightening timings. Not bad so far for free and I haven't bothered going above 1.25 V. Also my board doesn't allow for increasing the refresh interval yet. Doesn't seem to tolerate reducing refresh recovery time very much at all though, so who knows if this kit can even tolerate a higher interval.

Probably some room left especially with increased voltage .. some Samsung kits run as low as CL32 with 1.4V, I believe I read, but I'm good with this for now. No more testing until my 7950X arrives this week but this will be my baseline.

 

[A///]

- one rear USB Type-C port

I often forget how valuable type c is on modern systems and am stuck in the past equating them to one lone device. A good type c port can be broken up into multples of older ports offering expansion, not to mention the internal headers for rear io pcie plates.

 

[gdansk]

Does anyone have an ASUS X670 motherboard?
If XMP/EXPO is enabled, is sleep disabled? Does sleep work?

I'm trying to find a replacement for this ASRock board. Where hopefully standard features work.

 

[repoman0]

Does anyone have an ASUS X670 motherboard?
If XMP/EXPO is enabled, is sleep disabled? Does sleep work?

I'm trying to find a replacement for this ASRock board. Where hopefully standard features work.

My friend has the dumb $1000 ASUS board and sleep works at higher RAM frequencies. I’ll be replacing my Asrock board too if they don’t get it together over the coming months but don’t want to give up yet. Could help to make some noise with support tickets so they know we as customers care about that basic function.

 

[gdansk]

My friend has the dumb $1000 ASUS board and sleep works at higher RAM frequencies. I’ll be replacing my Asrock board too if they don’t get it together over the coming months but don’t want to give up yet. Could help to make some noise with support tickets so they know we as customers care about that basic function.

I did submit a few tickets regarding various deficiencies but as the Newegg return window ends tomorrow I am submitting an RMA today.
I ordered an Asus X670 Prime and will report if the grass is greener.

 

[repoman0]

Got my new/used 7950X! I loaded my tweaked RAM settings and went right for -30 all core offset, don't have time or patience to take it slow again. So far so good.

edit: one iteration of CoreCycler complete. Seems like all the Zen 4 chips are pretty good. This one boosts a little higher with one core loaded, to be expected I guess for the top SKU.

 

[A///]

are ddr5 prices supposed to fall even more this year for entry speeds? would 6000 qualify as entry ddr5 since 4800 came out over a year ago and is dead cheap now?

 

[A///]

My friend has the dumb $1000 ASUS board and sleep works at higher RAM frequencies. I’ll be replacing my Asrock board too if they don’t get it together over the coming months but don’t want to give up yet. Could help to make some noise with support tickets so they know we as customers care about that basic function.

asrock used to be decent. it should have served as a warning when their am5 boards are cheaper than the comp and offer more features.

 

[repoman0]

asrock used to be decent. it should have served as a warning when their am5 boards are cheaper than the comp and offer more features.

The board is really nice, don’t get me wrong, I’m pretty happy with it. One of the more premium feeling motherboards I’ve used and quite stable so far. MSI and Gigabyte are still struggling with sleep states too. I’m willing to give them some time.

 

[AdamK47]

My friend has the dumb $1000 ASUS board and sleep works at higher RAM frequencies. I’ll be replacing my Asrock board too if they don’t get it together over the coming months but don’t want to give up yet. Could help to make some noise with support tickets so they know we as customers care about that basic function.

I have the dumb $1000 Asus board. Never used sleep or hibernate with it. It gets shutdown when not in use. Mainly used for PC gaming.

I can't live without putting my work laptop to sleep at the end of the day. Too many applications that I want to keep running and resume using the next day.

 

[igor_kavinski]

I can't live without putting my work laptop to sleep at the end of the day. Too many applications that I want to keep running and resume using the next day.

Same. My laptop usually has an uptime of several months. Even my Windows 10 desktop may be running for the past month or so. I use it mainly for media consumption from USB so the WIFI is disconnected unless I really need it. Also keeps those pesky Windows updates away.

 

[gdansk]

As for the ECC support ASRock did reply to me indicating that only the first AGESA version supports ECC:

The first AGESA code supports the ECC function but the newer AGESA code removes the ECC function.

So we temporarily remove DDR5 ECC memory support from ASRock website.

Still waiting for AMD to release the new patch to fix it.

If AMD releases the new AGESA code to add ECC memory support, we’ll add ECC support on the specification for AM5 motherboards.

So maybe I needed to downgrade my BIOS. Unfortunately it is too late for me to test that.